Western Railroad Discussion > Colorado keeping those mean trains down

https://coloradosun.com/2024/04/17/colorado-legislation-train-regulation/?mc_cid=0ba9c70bb3&mc_eid=ca859dec95


cause they are off the hook!

10 trains a day, lotta time these estimates are never realized, perhaps this time , if built , may occur

These articles on the new green adjenda , tend to gloss over the fact, all of us are consumiing oil , and trucking this oil to load out just increases the demand even further, spewing more greenhouse gasses.

Colorado is really attacking drilling, maybe even trying to phase it out in the summer to reduce ozone along the front range, then curtailing it all in the 2030's---corrections always welcome

thanks Alan for finding this.

The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting newspaper for East California...

dan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> https://coloradosun.com/2024/04/17/colorado-legisl
> ation-train-regulation/?mc_cid=0ba9c70bb3&mc_eid=c
> a859dec95
>
>
> cause they are off the hook!
>
> 10 trains a day, lotta time these estimates are
> never realized, perhaps this time , if built , may
> occur
>
> These articles on the new green adjenda , tend to
> gloss over the fact, all of us are consumiing oil
> , and trucking this oil to load out just increases
> the demand even further, spewing more greenhouse
> gasses.
>
> Colorado is really attacking drilling, maybe even
> trying to phase it out in the summer to reduce
> ozone along the front range, then curtailing it
> all in the 2030's---corrections always welcome
>
> thanks Alan for finding this.

When you read the article and see the regulations they want and factor in the way railroads want to operate these days, it seems like the railroads brought a lot of this on themselves.

Posted from iPhone

Doug Wetherhold
Macungie, PA

The new State regulations will get struck down at the federal level.   Just some "feel good" legislation at the local level that is just done for votes.

ALCO630 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> https://coloradosun.com/2024/04/17/colorado-legisl
>
> >
> ation-train-regulation/?mc_cid=0ba9c70bb3&mc_eid=c
>
> > a859dec95
> >
> >
> > cause they are off the hook!
> >
> > 10 trains a day, lotta time these estimates are
> > never realized, perhaps this time , if built ,
> may
> > occur
> >
> > These articles on the new green adjenda , tend
> to
> > gloss over the fact, all of us are consumiing
> oil
> > , and trucking this oil to load out just
> increases
> > the demand even further, spewing more
> greenhouse
> > gasses.
> >
> > Colorado is really attacking drilling, maybe
> even
> > trying to phase it out in the summer to reduce
> > ozone along the front range, then curtailing it
> > all in the 2030's---corrections always welcome
> >
> > thanks Alan for finding this.
>
> When you read the article and see the regulations
> they want and factor in the way railroads want to
> operate these days, it seems like the railroads
> brought a lot of this on themselves.
>
> Posted from iPhone

It's the Trainorders paradox. Everyone complains about train length "monsters" and lack of track maintenance and single crew. When a government body steps up to attempt to regulate some of those issues, it is overreach and the railroads know best!

Well....which is it?

The current Colorado political regime despises any extractive industry, despises agriculture, and doesn't care one bit how much it raises living costs of its own citizens, nor how many jobs that their policies destroy--especially jobs in rural areas.  The simple fact is that leftist metro and resort area residents in Colorado want rural Colorado as their private recreational park.  They have been at this for years now, and Colorado has become totally hostile to most extractive and heavy industry.  It pains me as a Colorado native to have seen this happen.  I saw the handwriting on the wall years ago and left Colorado for good.  I had Colorado environmental wackos tell me to my face that they were determined to see the Durango & Silverton railroad right-of-way be a hiking trail, AND the same for Moffat Line.  They  aren't kidding; they mean it--and they have elected a political regime in Colorado that largely agrees with them.  

Redwater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting newspaper
> for East California...

It isn't an opinion/editorial piece.  Reporting factually on what the Colorado House voted on doesn't present a lean one way or the other.

radar Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Redwater Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting
> newspaper
> > for East California...
>
> It isn't an opinion/editorial piece.  Reporting
> factually on what the Colorado House voted on
> doesn't present a lean one way or the other.

Most news stories start out with some nugget of 'fact' and make up a story that portrays the writer's bias. Sometimes it is blatant and other times it is subtle. I see it every day in a huge % of stories that I read or see on TV

Posted from Android

Redwater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting newspaper
> for East California...

Colarado is actually a suburb of Los Angeles...

Colorado would rather there cars and power plants run off of weed. So they could get high on the exhaust. 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/denver-plan-to-slash-police-and-fire-department-budgets-to-pay-for-migrant-crisis-clears-first-hurdle/ar-AA1nfLTC

https://www.coloradopolitics.com/rtd-crime-increases-safety-strategies/article_6cce7f23-aa51-5bbe-b95d-39b2992fcf7f.html

66



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/24 15:29 by goneon66.

Redwater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting newspaper
> for East California...

Colorado has become East California, jsut like Oregon adn Washington are northern California.  What can I say?

RR

I'll steer clear of the political aspects of the story and situation. But reading through the story, it does seem to me most of the aspects of the legislation would have minimal impact on the former Grande. I decided to look up the text of the bill itself. Here is what is specifies:

• The length of a train must not exceed 8,500 feet;
• With certain exceptions, railroads must operate, maintain, and report the location of wayside detector systems. A wayside detector is an electronic device or a series of devices that monitors passing trains for defects.
• A train may not obstruct a public crossing for longer than 10 minutes unless the train is continuously moving or is prevented from moving by circumstances beyond the railroad's control;
• Any crew member of a train may report to the crew member's designated union representative a safety violation, injury, or death that occurred during the operation of a train. After receiving a report of a violation, a designated union representative may enter a railroad's place of operation to investigate the report during reasonable hours and after notifying the railroad.
• The public utilities commission (PUC) may impose fines for the violation of these safety requirements or for denying a union representative's access to the railroad's place of operation. The bill requires the PUC to develop guidelines for determining, imposing, and appealing fines.

No oil trains running on the Moffat today come anywhere close to 8,500 feet in length, let alone 10,000 feet. And the Moffat is chalked full of dragging equipment detectors and slide fence detectors. Further reading the text of the bill, it seems that either hotbox detectors or dragging equipment detectors are sufficient to satisfy the bill.

Not sure how many DED or HBD detectors are on the Greeley Sub, which many of these trains could take. The former KP (Limon Sub) is probably a greater concern as it is not even CTC and it probably would require installation of additional detectors.

Kevin Morgan
Arvada, CO
ColoradoRailfan.com



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/24 19:41 by ColoradoRailfan.

ColoradoRailfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'll steer clear of the political aspects of the
> story and situation. But reading through the
> story, it does seem to me most of the aspects of
> the legislation would have minimal impact on the
> former Grande. I decided to look up the text of
> the bill itself. Here is what is specifies:
>
>

• The length of a train must not exceed 8,500
  > feet;
  >
• With certain exceptions, railroads must
  > operate, maintain, and report the location of
  > wayside detector systems. A wayside detector is an
  > electronic device or a series of devices that
  > monitors passing trains for defects.
  >
• A train may not obstruct a public crossing for
  > longer than 10 minutes unless the train is
  > continuously moving or is prevented from moving by
  > circumstances beyond the railroad's control;
  >
• Any crew member of a train may report to the
  > crew member's designated union representative a
  > safety violation, injury, or death that occurred
  > during the operation of a train. After receiving a
  > report of a violation, a designated union
  > representative may enter a railroad's place of
  > operation to investigate the report during
  > reasonable hours and after notifying the
  > railroad.
  >

The public utilities commission (PUC) may
> impose fines for the violation of these safety
> requirements or for denying a union
> representative's access to the railroad's place of
> operation. The bill requires the PUC to develop
> guidelines for determining, imposing, and
> appealing fines.
>
> No oil trains running on the Moffat today come
> anywhere close to 8,500 feet in length, let alone
> 10,000 feet. And the Moffat is chalked full of
> dragging equipment detectors and slide fence
> detectors. Further reading the text of the bill,
> it seems that either hotbox detectors or dragging
> equipment detectors are sufficient to satisfy the
> bill.
>
> Not sure how many DED or HBD detectors are on the
> Greeley Sub, which many of these trains could
> take. The former KP (Limon Sub) is probably a
> greater concern as it is not even CTC and it
> probably would require installation of additional
> detectors.




There you go ruining their fun with actual facts. 

Like Kevin says no one has proposed long trains like you see on the transcons in these  mountain and  canyon areas.  I guess they could try it later ,  The way UP routes traffic away from the moffat, shows they would rather not run trains when they don't have to.  Perhaps shows they respect the territory, of course some investment  fund may tell how UP how it should run the trains.

WW Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The current Colorado political regime despises any
> extractive industry, despises agriculture, and
> doesn't care one bit how much it raises living
> costs of its own citizens, nor how many jobs that
> their policies destroy--especially jobs in rural
> areas.  The simple fact is that leftist metro and
> resort area residents in Colorado want rural
> Colorado as their private recreational park. 
> They have been at this for years now, and Colorado
> has become totally hostile to most extractive and
> heavy industry.  It pains me as a Colorado native
> to have seen this happen.  I saw the handwriting
> on the wall years ago and left Colorado for
> good.  I had Colorado environmental wackos tell
> me to my face that they were determined to see the
> Durango & Silverton railroad right-of-way be a
> hiking trail, AND the same for Moffat Line. 
> They  aren't kidding; they mean it--and they have
> elected a political regime in Colorado that
> largely agrees with them.  

Holy crap! What's next? Closing the interstate?

koloradokid Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Redwater Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The Colorado Sun is far left; A fitting
> newspaper
> > for East California...
>
> Colorado has become East California, just like
> Oregon and Washington are northern California. 
> What can I say?

I will say you see things correctly. Oregon and Washington are continuing to legislate and regulate social engineering with little to no regard to the implications of what law or regulations do especially in rural areas.

>
> RR

All I can say is Colorado has changed a hell of a lot since I was spending time there in the 70’s and 80’s.

Pretty sad to see what it’s becoming.

Regards

Posted from iPhone

Drknow Wrote:
> All I can say is Colorado has changed a hell of a
> lot since I was spending time there in the 70’s
> and 80’s.
>
> Pretty sad to see what it’s becoming.

Yes sir, this state had everything in the '70's. Loved skiing here. The state has turned a whiter shade of pale.

Posted from Android