Steam & Excursion > Your favorite SP 4-8-4?

There were eight varieties of SP 4-8-4's. Many to choose from and many to please I would think. What is your favorite SP 4-8-4 and why?

My choice would be the GS-2, the first of the Daylight's. Although I grew up on watching plenty of movies of the 4449, I've come to really appreciate the sleek and simple lines of the GS-2. I've grown to like the single headlight, and a little less grill work underneath the front deck. The open cab to the rear still gave a clue to this was a traditional steam locomotive under all the steam lined shrouding. And now that we've learned that the GS-2 were equipped with the elegant six chime whistle, I'd be sold on building a GS-2 replica if foamers were donated some of current bailout money! :-)

I'll take a de-streamlined GS-4, just like they were in Peninsula commute service. That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

Bob Callahan
Monticello, IN

I like the GS-4 class locomotives the best. But the GS-6 style looked good as SP or WP engines.

I like the observation about the open cab on the GS-2 and -3 being part of the 'classic' tradition. I do agree. That said, I like the heftiness and practicality of the all-weather cab. And I like the later tenders. So of the -2, -3, and -6, I like the six, even though I know it was built with cheap wartime brass and iron.

And as much as I'm a sucker for a rotating signal light, I also like the single-headlight look.

My fantasy? (And I'm sure I'm not the first.) The 4460 rolls out of captivity in St. Louis, dressed in a full set of skirts and a three-color (or is it four?) paint job. Tap couplers with 4449 and whistle off. (With the air horn?) Now THAT would be a double-header to see. (Of course, you'd have to spend a month or so in black with a big feather on the tank, to give the WP fans their due!)

Second pick? One of the roller-bearing GS-5's. I'm sure Doyle and crew would have been a little happier out the gate, mechanically speaking, if the SP had saved 4458 or 4459 instead. And of those, I like the SKF bearing covers better, just because.

Love the beat-up look of the last days of GS-4's and -5's on the San Joaquin Daylight. With a busted-up boiler jacket, all ripply and the paint dull and flaking off, those big cutouts for the air pump bracket bolts, no skirts. Do I love it more than clean and pristine? Well, no. But to see a model done faithfully that way would also be a favorite.

And finally, 4449. Because, well, you just gotta love any SP 4-8-4 that's had such a fabulous life, in front of us for so long, that we can get kinda bored and speculate which ones we might like better!

Next to 4449 for obvious reasons, I like the GS-1's the best.

1. They were originaally T&NO engines from Texas.

2. They looked like a steam engine is supposed to look, further comment deleted, I ain't gonna be as inflammatory either.

Con

I tend to favor the GS-1s also, but won't be as inflammatory as Con was. Cross dressing diesels?

Frisco1522 Wrote:
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> I tend to favor the GS-1s also, but won't be as
> inflammatory as Con was. Cross dressing diesels?


Oh...I don't know. I think Con has summed it up pretty well. As I've said on this Forum before, some sheet metal and a Sherwin-Williams paint job does not automatically confer "Beauty Queen" status on anybody's engine. The SP is no exception.

Bob Callahan
Monticello, IN

A GS-5....What were there, 2 of them? A GS-4 with roller bearings. With that being said, 4449 looks better everytime she hits the high iron today than ANY GS-4 did in service. That locomovive is WELL LOVED, and it shows! Hey Brooklyn, tell us you are getting out in 2009!!

GS-1 built by Baldwin
GS-2 thru GS-6 built by Lima. Beauty is more than skin deep.


rcall31060 Wrote:
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> Oh...I don't know. I think Con has summed it up
> pretty well. As I've said on this Forum before,
> some sheet metal and a Sherwin-Williams paint job
> does not automatically confer "Beauty Queen"
> status on anybody's engine. The SP is no
> exception.

I'm with Bob, gimme a stripped down GS-4 anytime. Looks like she earns her livin'...Pat

Count me in the line of fans for a GS-1.

Tony

I agree with those who liked the GS-4's and painted black. Another very good look was the way a few GS's looked in the "semi daylight" scheme with the orange/red on the tank and the cab only and again, with the side skits off....


Having said that, an MT class 4-8-2 with the skyline casting looked better than all of the GS's put together.


Brian E

I have to admit to a slightly biased opinion on my choice of GS. A quick look in my garage will remove all doubt as to what is the real favorite. Part of the decision was so many more GS-4 drawings are still around compared to GS-1,2,3 drawings. A good model requires good original drawings and a preserved locomotive will remove all doubt as to how the missing details are to be dealt with.

The boiler is still to be completed later this year. The number is yet to be decided as somewhere in the archives there is a photo of my twin brother and I in front of a GS-4 on the San Joaquin Daylight in very late steam. Our father, the fireman, realized the end was near and soon F units would replace his favorite steamers. When I find the photo, the engine number will be a done deal.

---

If a picture is worth a thousand words, this image of mine from 1984 sums up my responce. Great thread!

---

The highlight of the year in '08 for me was a cab ride in 4449 last June.
What a fantastic experience.

Also, I've dreamed for years of seeing 4460 returned to the West where
she belongs, running with the 4449 as might have happened back in the day.

I agree with previous comments; it's a real shame that the roller
bearing equipped 4458 and the 4459 were scrapped.

Regarding the 4-8-2 Mt class, mentioned above; If I have my info correct, I
believe the last one was scrapped in '62 in Eugene. What a shame. And to top
it off, I was once told by a retired SP Engineer (Johnny Critzer) that the
SP offered it or a cab forward to Eugene for display in a park. The Eugene
City Council, to their everlasting shame, declined the offer.

JDL

If I remember the story correctly, a GS-5 might have become part of the eventual CSRM collection in Sacramento, but apparently saving both a Daylight and a Cabforward was not in the cards. What might have been!

CoosLimited Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The highlight of the year in '08 for me was a cab
> ride in 4449 last June.
> What a fantastic experience.
>
> Also, I've dreamed for years of seeing 4460
> returned to the West where
> she belongs, running with the 4449 as might have
> happened back in the day.
>
> I agree with previous comments; it's a real shame
> that the roller
> bearing equipped 4458 and the 4459 were scrapped.
>
> Regarding the 4-8-2 Mt class, mentioned above; If
> I have my info correct, I
> believe the last one was scrapped in '62 in
> Eugene. What a shame. And to top
> it off, I was once told by a retired SP Engineer
> (Johnny Critzer) that the
> SP offered it or a cab forward to Eugene for
> display in a park. The Eugene
> City Council, to their everlasting shame, declined
> the offer.
>
> JDL

m420 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I agree with those who liked the GS-4's and
> painted black. Another very good look was the way
> a few GS's looked in the "semi daylight" scheme
> with the orange/red on the tank and the cab only
> and again, with the side skits off....
>
>
> Having said that, an MT class 4-8-2 with the
> skyline casting looked better than all of the GS's
> put together.
>
>
> Brian E

I Have to say I agree with Brian. Also the MTs' had subtle differences between most of them (such as whistle placement). I suppose that this was due to subsequent shoppings. They could also accelerate faster than the GS locos in commute service. A damn shame none were saved. As far as the GSs' though, I liked the GS-4s' best. I don't think the GS-2s' and 3's made it onto the Sunset route that often. I don't recall seeing them in service there in the 50s'. I do recall the GS-1s' and the Cotton Belt engines on their way to the Bay Area.

I like them all.....got a problem with that........

The GS-4's skirted in red and orange or de-skirted in black are my favorites Espee 4-8-4's. I like the appearance of the all-weather cab over the open cab and the more contoured lines of the tenders used on the later classes. While the mars light may not be as aesthetically pleasing as the single headlights of the 2's, 3's and 6's, seeing it in operation more than compensated for any deficiency.
The deskirted engines afforded a slightly better view of the valve gear so it was sort of a toss-up. Possibly the engines on which the skirts were removed but Daylight colors remained on the cabs and tenders for a time were best looking but never having seen one in this configuration makes it difficult to say.
While the red and orange gs-4's were plentiful on the coast line in the early to mid '50's, they were not to be seen on the Western Division, much to my chagrin when a family move caused relocation. I came to like the deskirted black engines as well however. It did initially seem odd that the San Joaquin Daylight was headed by a non Daylight painted 4-8-4.
I picked the GS-4 over the 5 as I find the stars in the centers of drivers signifying spring pad lubricators more appealing than the asterisks indicating roller bearings on the two GS-5's.
Suffice it say I never saw any GS that I didn't like, thought the transplanted 7's and 8's were never favorites, being rather odd looking with their low tenders and non SP looks.

sp3811

i wouldnt mind seeing #4449 painted in black, but not the way it was when it pulled the bnsf special. stripped down, no skirting, pulling a string of subs down the penisula.