Steam & Excursion > 1984 'World's Fair Daylight' full consist

In relation to the thread below and because I've never seen it online anywhere, here's the full passenger consist of the 1984 'World's Fair Daylight' as reported by TRAINS magazine in the October 1984 issue and originally found in the "4449 Album" book sold onboard:

PNWC (Pacific Northwest Chapter) NRHS #3300 'Miln D. Gillespie', combine for parts & crew. Ex-SP 3300 blt. Pullman Standard 1936.
PNWC NRHS #600 'Mount Hood', crew lounge sleeper, ex- SP&S #60, P-S 1950 for Empire Builder/NCL connection.
SW (Sierra Western Rail Corp.) #542 'Sonoma', 48-seat coach, ex-Amtrak 4842, nee SP 2355, P-S 1954 for Coast Daylight.
SW #544 'Mendocino', 48-seat coach ex-Amtrak 4844, nee SP 2358, P-S 1954 for Coast Daylight.
SW #546 'Humboldt', 48-seat coach ex-Amtrak 4846, nee SP 2361, P-S 1954 for Coast Daylight.
SW #507 'Shasta', 40-seat coach ex-Amtrak 7507, nee SP 2385, P-S 1949 for Shasta Daylight.
SW #511 'Stanislaus', 52-seat coach ex-Amtrak 7511, nee SP 2395, P-S 1949 for Shasta Daylight.
PAR (Pacific Railroad Society) #2397, 48-seat coach ex-Amtrak 7512, nee SP 2397, P-S 1949 for Shasta Daylight.
SW #500 'San Joaquin', ex-Amtrak #7500, nee SP 2241, P-S 1949 for Shasta Daylight. (TRAINS says this car has "896 seats"- THAT's high capacity!)
SW #510 'Tuolumne', 48-seat coach, ex-Amtrak #5710, nee SP 2392, P-S 1949 for Shasta Daylight.
GWT (Great Western Tours) #568 'Red River', 68-seat coach, ex-Amtrak 6800, nee GN 1147, ACF 1950.
SW 156 'Lake Pepin', diner, ex-GN #1156, nee SLSF (Frisco) 650, P-S 1948 for Texas Special
GS (Grant Corp?) #1290 'Appekunny Mountain', ex-GN obs-lounge, 32 seats 3 roomettes, ACF 1951 for Empire Builder.

Note that the equipment was owned by 5 different organizations. Hopefully this helps people in their 'where are they now' inquiries.

Here is a link to a shot of that train, I believe it is the same train.
Todd Montgomery
Eugene OR

http://www.trainorders.com/images2/view.php?368074



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/22/10 23:03 by coosbaytoday.

A link to a discussion about some of these cars that got landlocked on the NWP and were scrapped in 2008 at Willits, CA.:

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,1681548,1681610#msg-1681610

Apparently #500 & #507 have been scrapped. It appeared that #511 was going to be saved at the time. Not sure of its current fate.

davew833 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GS (Grant Corp?) #1290 'Appekunny Mountain', ex-GN
> obs-lounge, 32 seats 3 roomettes, ACF 1951 for
> Empire Builder.
>

I have a question about this car (and its sisters). The first streamlined Empire Builder hit the road in 1947. GN re-equipped it in 1951 and shifted the 1947 equipment set over to run as the Western Star. By the 1960s (when I first saw the Empire Builder), the Mountain series observation cars ran on the Western Star and the Empire Builder ran with the Coulee series sleeper-observation cars. I had always assumed the Mountain series cars were part of the 1947 Empire Builder. Evidently that is not the case. So then I have four questions:

1. What observation cars were used on the 1947 Empire Builder? What happened to those cars after the Mountain series cars were delivered?
2. When did the Mountain series cars stop operating on the Empire Builder? Maybe when the Great Dome Lounge cars were delivered?
3. Were any sister Mountain series cars saved?
4. Were the Coulee series cars converted from something else by GN to become the mid-1950s Empire Builder observation cars? Were they actually older cars than the Mountain series observation cars? What job did they have before the mid-1950s Empire Builder?

Thanks in advance,

Rob L.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/10 09:48 by rob_l.

It's sad to see that once-glorious Daylight train being scrapped at Willits. Valdals can kill any car in just a few days when left alone.

We have a saying at the museum that would be appropriate to any equipment saving organization:

"Do not consider a piece of equipment 'saved' unless it sits on a piece of property that you hold title to."

In the early museum (40s) years of streetcar 'saving' Branford and Seashore in the east, they fully learned this bitter lesson. This holds true, especially today, where property prices have soared and nobody wants a railroad car parked in their backyard. Even railroads really don't want to be bothered with a private car or loco, as usually it brings trespassers and liability to their operations and facilities. All one person owners of cars eventually fail due to the owner's age and time or marital ability to keep the equipment in repair.

Watts local

As a Frisco fan, would appreciate any info on what happened to diner "Lake Pepin".

Very, very nice full train! For this matched consist, I WILL forgive the canteen for operating purposes. This is why I haven't been out to see the Daylight, in some twenty years...it doesn't look like this anymore.

After my initial post I found this great website by Richard Percy showing much more information about the 1984 Worlds Fair Daylight and some of the early '90s excursion trains as well.

http://espee.railfan.net/1984_lsfd.html

Much of the remaining equipment, including diner "Lake Pepin" is apparently still stranded on the NWP as shown in the pics from Percy's website. He lists some of it at 'undisclosed locations' probably to attempt to prevent future vandalism.

#511, Stanislaus, was apparently saved and trucked out in 2008.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/10 13:43 by davew833.

　Thank you for posting the consist. Here is how the train looked
on the second day of the long journey. After leaving Klamath Falls
it is about to leave Oregon and enter California. Haruo

---

In addition to the two rail cars listed as being owned (and they still are) by the Pacific Northwest Chapter, NRHS; we also own the GWT #568 Red River, we call it PNWC 6800. Both
the 6800 coach and the Mount Hood sleeper/lounge 600 have been in the Oregon Rail Heritage
Foundation Holiday Express consist including this years. The Mount Hood is now in its
heritage SP&S livery, the other two are in SP livery. Arlen

The "Coulee" Series cars were from the 1947 EB, though when originally delivered they were "River" series. In 1951, these cars were transferred to the Western Star when the new "Mountain" series were delivered for the Empire Builder. The "Mountain" cars were mostly lounge with only a couple roomettes used by crews. In 1955 when GN took delivery of the Great Dome lounges, they rebuilt the original 1947 "River" cars with additional sleeping facilities leaving a total of 4 bedrooms, 1 compartment and 6 roomettes with just a small observation lounge seating 9 people at the end of the car. These rebuilt cars were then renamed in the "Coulee" series and reassigned to the Empire Builder, while the newer "Mountain" series cars went to the Western Star.


rob_l Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> davew833 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > GS (Grant Corp?) #1290 'Appekunny Mountain',
> ex-GN
> > obs-lounge, 32 seats 3 roomettes, ACF 1951 for
> > Empire Builder.
> >
>
> I have a question about this car (and its
> sisters). The first streamlined Empire Builder hit
> the road in 1947. GN re-equipped it in 1951 and
> shifted the 1947 equipment set over to run as the
> Western Star. By the 1960s (when I first saw the
> Empire Builder), the Mountain series observation
> cars ran on the Western Star and the Empire
> Builder ran with the Coulee series
> sleeper-observation cars. I had always assumed the
> Mountain series cars were part of the 1947 Empire
> Builder. Evidently that is not the case. So then I
> have four questions:
>
> 1. What observation cars were used on the 1947
> Empire Builder? What happened to those cars after
> the Mountain series cars were delivered?
> 2. When did the Mountain series cars stop
> operating on the Empire Builder? Maybe when the
> Great Dome Lounge cars were delivered?
> 3. Were any sister Mountain series cars saved?
> 4. Were the Coulee series cars converted from
> something else by GN to become the mid-1950s
> Empire Builder observation cars? Were they
> actually older cars than the Mountain series
> observation cars? What job did they have before
> the mid-1950s Empire Builder?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Rob L.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/23/10 16:34 by czephyr17.

The New Orleans World's Fair Daylight was a project of the Pacific Northwest Chapter, National Railway Historical Society based in Portland Oregon. While I wasn't yet active in the PNWC, it is a very interesting chapter in our history that began in 1955 and continues to this day.

I am amazed that many of the major players in this gigantic adventure not only lived through it but continue to be active in the Portland historical railroad community. Arlen

davew833 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> After my initial post I found this great website
> by Richard Percy showing much more information
> about the 1984 Worlds Fair Daylight and some of
> the early '90s excursion trains as well.
>
> http://espee.railfan.net/1984_lsfd.html
>
> Much of the remaining equipment, including diner
> "Lake Pepin" is apparently still stranded on the
> NWP as shown in the pics from Percy's website. He
> lists some of it at 'undisclosed locations'
> probably to attempt to prevent future vandalism.
>
> #511, Stanislaus, was apparently saved and trucked
> out in 2008.


Car 511, the Stanislaus, former Amtrak 7511, originally SP 2395, built by Pullman-Standard in 1949, is alive, well, and safely stored on a private siding served by the LA Junction Railway in Southern California. Restoration is underway on a time and funds-available basis, though it will probably not be Amtrak Certified. The car was vandalized somewhat while stored in Willits, but it still retains the SP 1960's era interior. It was never refurbished by Amtrak.

Perhaps the fact that the World's Fair Daylight was a PNWC chapter project explains the lack of SP-owned passenger rolling stock in the consist? I understand SP owned at least one "Daylight" painted high-windowed chair car, #2356, which was renumbered #293 and used in the business fleet. I think they had a few "Daylight" cars I saw in the early '90s as well.

What a treat that train was for us who never witnessed a full Daylight Painted, Northern powered train. Thanks for posting the info...
http://www.trainorders.com/images2/view.php?418661

Keystone1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Very, very nice full train! For this matched
> consist, I WILL forgive the canteen for operating
> purposes. This is why I haven't been out to see
> the Daylight, in some twenty years...it doesn't
> look like this anymore.


Do you like to just try to stir trouble and comments? It's always negative about steam nowdays. "They are flying flgas, whitewalls, A-tanks, Amtrak locomotives, etc...."

Let it go man and let everyone else enjoy steam railorading as it is today!!!!!

firefighter25dfd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keystone1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Very, very nice full train! For this matched
> > consist, I WILL forgive the canteen for
> operating
> > purposes. This is why I haven't been out to see
> > the Daylight, in some twenty years...it doesn't
> > look like this anymore.
>
>
> Do you like to just try to stir trouble and
> comments? It's always negative about steam
> nowdays. "They are flying flgas, whitewalls,
> A-tanks, Amtrak locomotives, etc...."
>
> Let it go man and let everyone else enjoy steam
> railorading as it is today!!!!!

I'll certainly second THAT! Besides, what about the sounds? Maybe I'm a bit selfish, but from my vantage point, I really don't care what the hell is behind the locomotive, so long as we can: 1) run her, 2) go fast, and 3) pull a respectable load to make music!

I'd just as soon keystone1 stayed home with his 25 year old memories anyway!

Boyz, Boyz... can't we all just boil water and get along? Happy Daylight holidays, in fond Daylight memories no matter how old, and in the fresh new Daylight world to come -- thanks to the grit and determination of all the dedicated Daylight custodians!

~ BZ