Steam & Excursion > C&T's Other Two "Locomotives"

Photo 1.  In this older photo of the Chama Round(ish)house one can't help but notice the tall smokestack that towered over it- now long gone.  So what was it for?
Photo 2.  In the far back corner of the 'house are these two boilers- long out of use.  I don't know what they were back when they were a bit more "Free Range".  A pair of 2-8-0's perhaps?  They appear to be a matched set.
Photo 3.  They were fed from a small coal bin just inside this door modified for the purpose.  This was in-turn fed from from a gon that you will often see spotted here in old photos. (If you're modeling the roundhouse, it's a nice detail to include)

Photo 4.  The base of the old stack is still in the roof, now capped.  I don't know when the stack came down.
SR

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Thanks for posting these photos with details showing some great detail and history just under the surface. Great stuff!!

Many railroads had house steam to preheat the boilers of the steam locomotives before actually lighting them off from cold. That way they could bring up the pressure slowly and prevent excess stress on the boiler staybolts. That may have been the likely use for the stationary boilers and hence the smokestack.
Here in Cheyenne the UP had a Powerhouse that was oil fired when I came here in 1976. Yes, even that late date the railroad had steam heat to the roundhouse, depot and other buildings. The steam drops were still in place in the old roundhouse, of which 42 of the original 48 stalls still remained.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

Steam Heating was a secondary function of the "House Boiler."  The primary use of steam from these boilers was to power the heavy machinery used to maintain the locomotives via an complex system of shafts and belts.  Unfortuantely, almost all these supporting shops are long gone and we're pretty much left with East Broad Top as perhaps the typical example. 

In 1987, the National Park Service, in coordination with America's Industrial Heritage Project (AIHP), began an initiative to inventory historic sites in southwestern Pennsylvania. The Historic American Buildings Survey (HABS) and the Historic American Engineering Record (HAER), both of which form a division of the Park Service, began this multi-year historical and architectural documentation project in order to identify surviving historic engineering works and industrial resources in the region.  The Project has generated some exquisitely detailed mechanical drawings of the East Broad Top Railroad including the shop complex. 

The linked site is a rail fan who has converted the source material from TIFF files to PDF.  Unfortunately the link to the source material on the National Park Service site is no longer good, but after a few minutes searching, it appears the source material is still there. 

Here is a link to the EBT Machine Shop in Rockhill, PA: 

http://www.totalracing.com/ebt/machine_shop_floor_plan_00001a.pdf 

And of interest to this thread is a drawing of the power shafts that powered the heavy machinery: 

http://www.totalracing.com/ebt/machine_shop%20_power_shafts_00002a.pdf 

Here is a link to the main page, high recommended for fans of the EBT: 

http://www.totalracing.com/ebt/drawings.htm



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/18 08:44 by SR-RL_Nr_10.

The Colorado Railroad Museum publication "Steam in the Rockies" notes that the boiler from 2-6-0 # 152 was installed at Chama about 1899 when the engine was scrapped.  Several other worn out 2-6-0s and 4-4-0s were scrapped at about the same time, and may be candidates for the other boiler (or both).  Those included 2nd #24 and 2nd #25, both former Cairo & St. Louis 2-6-0s, 2-6-0 #154  and 4-4-0 #90 as well as the original 2-6-0 #2.    I am sure that the guys at Chama or Earl will have the correct answer.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/18 08:23 by elueck.

There are several remaining railroad shops that use or used the belt and pulley system.  EBT is not the only remaining example.  The Columbus and Greenville RR shop in Columbus, MS was ACTIVE and using their belt driven machinery until 2015 when locomotive maintainence was transferred by G&W to Florida.  When I saw it on the day that it officially closed, you could eat off of the floor or the machines.  The place was spotless.  At the time, the city was trying to preserve it but I don't know if that effort ever got off of the ground. 
 
The Southern Forest Heritage Museum, in Long Leaf, LA preserves the former Crowell & Spencer Lumber Co / Red River and Gulf RR shop, which was converted to run on electricity in 1954, and was active until 1969.  Many of its machines were restored to operation, and the shop is used by museum volunteers even today for minor work.  So far as I know, this shop is one of very few that you can visit and actually see work.

I have been told of others, but I have not been to any of them, but I know that there are more out there.
 

The Sierra RR out here in California is know for it's intact belt system- although I'm not sure how it's powered.  It might be electric now.
SR

elueck Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Colorado Railroad Museum publication "Steam in
> the Rockies" notes that the boiler from 2-6-0 #
> 152 was installed at Chama about 1899 when the
> engine was scrapped.  Several other worn out
> 2-6-0s and 4-4-0s were scrapped at about the same
> time, and may be candidates for the other boiler
> (or both).  Those included 2nd #24 and 2nd #25,
> both former Cairo & St. Louis 2-6-0s, 2-6-0 #154 
> and 4-4-0 #90 as well as the original 2-6-0 #2. 
>   I am sure that the guys at Chama or Earl will
> have the correct answer.

VERY interesting info- thanks!
SR

Hello, Earl?

Very interesting indeed!  The Cairo & St. Louis locomotives came from the narrow gauge line purchased by the Mobile & Ohio and standard gauged in one day to complete its route to St. Louis over Alto Pass.

Mary McPherson
Dongola, IL
Diverging Clear Productions

we also had a fully functioning belt system in the old CSRM Unit Shop (SP Sacramento Shops) until Dennis arrived. After Dennis took over for Ken Yeo and UP Joe, the belt system was dismantled and tossed outside into the weather.

Yes, the old Sierra RR’s roundhouse shop was changed to electric. It all still works. 
It is a marvelous place to visit. 

John

Not railroad, but vintage -- the machine shop at the Mt. Wilson Observatory is still belt driven, powered by a ~1900 era single (large) piston gas engine. It is a thing of beauty! 

This was the site of many profound breakthroughs in astronomy, not least Edwin Hubble's realization that those blurry nebula things were actually galaxies with billions of stars in each, his use of variable stars to measure their distances, and his formulation of Hubble's law to relate distance and speed of recession. The beginnings of modern cosmology!

The Observatory is a really great place to visit. It still hosts an active optical interferometer, the CHARA array, owned by Georgia State U. CHARA uses multiple small telescopes to synthesize an aperture with angular resolution equivalent to a 330 m sized telescope. The Observatory's Cosmic Cafe is a great place for lunch, especially if you hiked or biked up from the LA basin. Highly recommended.

The Southern Museum of Civil War and Locomotive History in Kennesaw, GA not only houses the General, which in itself is worth a visit, but also has the Glover Machine Works  exhibit featuring a fully working restored overhead shaft belt driven locomotive machine shop. Glover played a significant role after the Civil War as the largest locomotive builder in the South. 2 preserved locomotives and many of the original machines recreate the shop as it was in the early 1900's. This is a Smithsonian affiliate museum and is very well done.  

To drag this thread kinking and screaming back to its original direction:

The boilers are different.  Although they look the same from the rear, one is much shorter.  The pic shows one sticking through the far wall.  As Everett pointed out, the shorter one is from D&RG 152 a class 45 2-6-0, a rather rare wheel arrangement on the D&RG.  The other boiler is an original 1880 boiler from a 2-8-0.  Although there is no offical record of where it came from it either from a Class 60 (which became C-16 later on) or an earlier Class 56.  On the other side of the wall is the original BLW smokebox front.  I even recall seeing aspot where someone had clean off a bit of the door casting and revealed the Baldwin class number.  Alas, I never wrote that info down.

The boilers performed mulitple functions.  They powered the overhead belt driven machine shop that was on the other side of the wall to the left.  There is still a set of pullies up in the rafters from those days.  It also powered the steam driven water pump that filled the water tank.  There were car repair tracks below the roundhouse that would have needed compressed air, provided by a locomotive type air compressor.  They also provided steam heat for the shop office and depot. Someone told me before Chama got electricity (in the 1940's) there was a dyanmo powered by the boilers providing  electricity for the foreman's office and the depot.

The large stack that was for the boilers collapsed in 1973.




elueck Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Colorado Railroad Museum publication "Steam in
> the Rockies" notes that the boiler from 2-6-0 #
> 152 was installed at Chama about 1899 when the
> engine was scrapped.  Several other worn out
> 2-6-0s and 4-4-0s were scrapped at about the same
> time, and may be candidates for the other boiler
> (or both).  Those included 2nd #24 and 2nd #25,
> both former Cairo & St. Louis 2-6-0s, 2-6-0 #154 
> and 4-4-0 #90 as well as the original 2-6-0 #2. 
>   I am sure that the guys at Chama or Earl will
> have the correct answer.

All this info is quite interesting. I have several more photos from this roll I shot inside the roundhouse. I’ll go back through them this afternoon and see if I caught any of the remnants of the belt system.
SR

Thanks Earl.    Since the other boiler is from a 2-8-0, that opens up a whole host of possibilities since it was probably put in after the wholesale retirements of about 1908.  Maybe someone at Chama will go and clean of the construction class number sometime.