Steam & Excursion > Tanglefoot- Proof the World is Round

SR

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Thanks for sharing SR ...

It does put things into perspective!
The B&W adds to the overall effect.
Nice!

Odyssey
Evergreen, CO

Why doesn't it just turn right instead of going left and all over the place? First time I ever
saw that place was in 1957 and Dad was looking for a rope to drag me away!

Out



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/19 18:47 by callum_out.

I think it was because They billed by the mile. Same reason cab drivers did the same thing.
SR

The Cumbres & Toltec Scenic RR does not have any photo runs for the serious fans that ride but here is the exact place it could happen with very little delay to or from Osier and a good meal.  For up to 24 passengers two stops could be made here which would offer a great photo run opportunity.  A small one door wood platform could be made at top and bottom track connected with a wood stairway and small wooden hand rail.  As photo fan got off the train they could each pick one step of their liking while the train continues around Tanglefoot curve and pick them up at the other end of the stairway. It could be done either direction with only a few minutes delay that may not even be noticed by the rest of the customers. Conductors or train crew would collect all the photo fans into one car for their quick exit to the platform and stairway.  The one small wood railing and steps would not hurt the loop's image much.  Maybe one of the short original snowshed could be rebuilt for future historic fans.

BoilingMan Wrote:
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> I think it was because They billed by the mile.
> Same reason cab drivers did the same thing.
> SR

LOL

PlyWoody Wrote:
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> The Cumbres & Toltec Scenic RR does not have any
> photo runs for the serious fans that ride but here
> is the exact place it could happen with very
> little delay to or from Osier and a good meal. 
> For up to 24 passengers two stops could be made
> here which would offer a great photo run
> opportunity.  A small one door wood platform
> could be made at top and bottom track connected
> with a wood stairway and small wooden hand rail. 
> As photo fan got off the train they could each
> pick one step of their liking while the train
> continues around Tanglefoot curve and pick them up
> at the other end of the stairway. It could be done
> either direction with only a few minutes delay
> that may not even be noticed by the rest of the
> customers. Conductors or train crew would collect
> all the photo fans into one car for their quick
> exit to the platform and stairway.  The one small
> wood railing and steps would not hurt the loop's
> image much.  Maybe one of the short original
> snowshed could be rebuilt for future historic
> fans.

Well of course run-bys are done at Tanglefoot.  This is from the same Friends outing as the others in this series- a run-by at Tanglefoot.  You can see the worshipers off to the left.  Most stayed on the lower level of the curve but some of the faithful scrambled (ascended?) to a higher place.  The train made 2 or 3 runs at it, backing around these curves and running to about half way up the loop.  I'm not sure, but I think when the shoot was over a 2nd stop was made to p/u those at the top?  I didn't ride on this day so I'm not sure...
SR

But I did ride the day before:  I'm a sinner- but not a complete heathen!
Amen, Bro...
anyone see my wine?
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/19 06:18 by BoilingMan.

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PlyWoody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The Cumbres & Toltec Scenic RR does not have any
> photo runs for the serious fans that ride but here
> is the exact place it could happen with very
> little delay to or from Osier and a good meal. 
> For up to 24 passengers two stops could be made
> here which would offer a great photo run
> opportunity.  A small one door wood platform
> could be made at top and bottom track connected
> with a wood stairway and small wooden hand rail. 
> As photo fan got off the train they could each
> pick one step of their liking while the train
> continues around Tanglefoot curve and pick them up
> at the other end of the stairway. It could be done
> either direction with only a few minutes delay
> that may not even be noticed by the rest of the
> customers. Conductors or train crew would collect
> all the photo fans into one car for their quick
> exit to the platform and stairway.  The one small
> wood railing and steps would not hurt the loop's
> image much.  Maybe one of the short original
> snowshed could be rebuilt for future historic
> fans.

When I rode the C&TS in 1972, they indeed did a photorun eastbound at Tanglefoot Curve.  They stopped the train on the upper level, unloaded everyone who wanted to get a shot, rolled down around the curve and picked everyone up again.  They did another runby at Osier, but most passengers were standing in line to get lunch and missed out.

On my first trip to the C&TS in 1971, they did an eastbound runby at Sublette.  That train did a Chama-Big Horn-Chama round trip.

For several years, the C&TS did runbys at Big Horn.  Going east, they did a runby at Big Horn Siding, going west a mile or so east at MP 301.  Back then the trains ran four days a week, one way between Chama and Antonito, and return was by bus.  White painted rocks were carefully lined up about 50 feet from the tracks, and everyone was told to stand behind the rocks.  As crowds grew, policing his activity became too much for a 3 man train crew.  So the runby was dropped, and a simple 15 minute "photo stop" was made at Big Horn.  When the current operating format was put into place in 1980, the Big Horn stop was dropped in favor of a 15 minute stop at Cumbres and Sublette.  Eventually the need to get the trains over the road prevailed, and the stops were shortened to just water stops, with the passenger remaining aboard.  There are still lines of white rocks along the track out there for the curious to ponder.

It was too bad the photo stops were discontinued, but with around 10-15% of the passengers being railfans who appreciated the gesture, the "needs of the many" overruled.

There are plenty of photo trains per year on the Cumbres and Toltec. I hope the comment about turning left instead of right was sarcasm. A basic understanding of railroad grades goes a long way.

No, if they'd just started at Los Pinos on a 2.5% they could have made the summit without Tanglefoot, course
that would have played hell with Westbound loads, and I do have a knowledge of raiilroad grades.

Out

Uh-oh.

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Oh great
Pluto is laughing at us.
SR

That's the second thing wrong with that picture.

Out

Callum is of course being sarcastic - he's good at that, but a bit of an explanation might be in order.....  The ruling grade between Antonito and Cumbres is 1.42%, which works out to 75 feet per mile.  There are some level spots (Rock Tunnel, MP 316 to MP 323 east of Los Pinos has an elevation change of 6 feet).  The Rio Grande kept to this grade by looping its way through side canyons and in the case of Tanglefoot Curve, looping around the small valley to maintain the 1.42% grade.  Adding a stretch of steeper grade would have caused the RR to either run shorter trains, or add another helper district to the railroad.  Operational speed was not a factor when the RR was built - anything was better than walking - so making detours in and out of side canyons to loop the track into big lariat loops was no concern.

Thaty was exactly my point, it would have been simpler to raise the grade and eliminate the loop BUT the interesting
thing is looking at the Los Pinos approach vs the Coxo approach. It's pretty obvious that the railroad was built for
Westbpound heavy traffic. It wasn't until the opil traffic materialized that the 4% became a real boittleneck. Yes the
smaller power had issues with the 4% but the oil was post 1925 when the K36s appeared. Just an opinion, Earl is
indeed deeper into this than I.

Out