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Steam & Excursion > Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's


Date: 04/06/20 11:06
Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

Here is a nearly 2 minute clip just the way the film was edited that I obtained a few months ago.  We are trying to determine which train that short one is.  Most excursions were longer, like the Rocky Mountain RR club trip with 483 shown here.  The guy shooting movies chased the 483 and obviously rode the 484 trip.
We have the date of the 483 trip which was determined by the helper used from Chama-Cumbres.  But the short train is a mystery.  Anyone who can give me the correct info gets a free DVD of their choice from our website.  Also wanted to post some video to provide a little entertainment value for this difficult time.  I will be doing periodic uploads including some contemporary clips.  Remember we want to know (a) The Sponsor, (2) The dates, and (3) how many days and (4) where they ran each day!
Sorry now audio for these original silent films.  By the way 484 is still operational on the Cumbres and Toltec Scenic Railroad.
Greg Scholl
http://www.gregschollvideo.com

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Date: 04/06/20 14:54
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: PlyWoody

The pillar of rock 030-045 is just below the Table Rocks on the cliff in the distance.The location was used for a photo of Table Rocks with the train passing under it.



Date: 04/06/20 15:33
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: andersonb109

There always has to be that one person who walks (or in this case runs) into view before the train has cleared the runby scene.  



Date: 04/07/20 10:30
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

PlyWoody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The pillar of rock 030-045 is just below the Table
> Rocks on the cliff in the distance.The location
> was used for a photo of Table Rocks with the train
> passing under it.

I had never seen this location before obtaining this film footage.  Really a cool spot!  Also neat that they decided
to do a photo stop there.  We have tried the Narrow Gauge discussion board and nobody seems to know anything about this trip. Surely there is
a photo of this train somewhere in a book or online with a date.  I have never seen one with this type of consist on the D&RGW.  One other thing is that
the trip over from Alamosa to Durango(Was also 484), had the same consist, and was likely in the early spring, since there was plenty of snow on Tanglefoot curve and at Cumbres.  Going down from Cumbres it faded out entirely by around Cresco.  So likely around early May to Mid-June I would guess.
Greg



Date: 04/07/20 10:33
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

andersonb109 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There always has to be that one person who walks
> (or in this case runs) into view before the train
> has cleared the runby scene.  

Well I figure the gal didn't know any better, and was hurrying to get to the train to board so she didn't get left behind.  Otherwise the shot was pretty people free.
It was an outstanding location, and one I had never seen before.  This section from Chama to Durango was torn-up in 1970.  It is a remote area as well.
Greg Scholl
http://www.gregschollvideo.com
 



Date: 04/07/20 13:50
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: Mike4960

Very enjoyable film clip. My guess for the bridge in the initial shot would be the San Juan River crossing which is described on the bridge hunter web site.

https://bridgehunter.com/co/archuleta/bh74332/

It was abandonded in place and is still clearly visible on Google maps if you plug in the GPS coordinates.

Bob McGarrah
Edwards, IL



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/20 13:51 by Mike4960.



Date: 04/08/20 08:41
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: WW

Without going back to notes, etc.  The first excursion could have been the 3-day fall Kiwanis Kolor Karavan excursion sponsored by the Alamosa Kiwanis Club.  This was run on September 27-29, 1963. The last public excursions before abandonment took place in 1966.  The Kiwanis Kolor Karavan excursion from Alamosa to Chama and return occurred that fall and was the last public excursion over the line from Chama to Durango.  A charter train was run by the D&RGW from Durango to Alamosa in November of 1968 for National Park Service officials to examine the line for possible National Park or Monument designation, but that run was not open to the public.



Date: 04/08/20 11:22
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

WW Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Without going back to notes, etc.  The first
> excursion could have been the 3-day fall Kiwanis
> Kolor Karavan excursion sponsored by the Alamosa
> Kiwanis Club.  This was run on September 27-29,
> 1963. The last public excursions before
> abandonment took place in 1966.  The Kiwanis
> Kolor Karavan excursion from Alamosa to Chama and
> return occurred that fall and was the last public
> excursion over the line from Chama to Durango.  A
> charter train was run by the D&RGW from Durango to
> Alamosa in November of 1968 for National Park
> Service officials to examine the line for possible
> National Park or Monument designation, but that
> run was not open to the public.

Its not any of those trips. I believe its 1963-1966.  The Kolor Karavan excursions were in the fall, and the trains were long enough to require a helper out of Chama to Cumbres.  This short one in our video was no helper from Chama-Cumbres.  The National Park train was with engine 483.  So its not that.  The last D&RGW excursions were in 1966.  The last D&RGW Freights were 1968(Except the park train you mentioned).

Amazing with all the info out there nobody can give any info on this short train.  With only 3 coaches, and an open gon(plus the box car and baggage), one is inclined to figure there were not many participants onboard.  Maybe 100?  I am thinking it could be a civic group from Alamosa or some such.  La Jara ran some trips, but the one I saw was 1960 and had a full length train (around 10 cars).  Some guys can tell you info on every piece of rolling stock on the Narrow Gauge, but even when a 2-3 excursion ran as a "Special Train" there is no documentation on film, nor print???  An oddity when it comes to all things D&RGW!
Greg



Date: 04/08/20 16:23
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: ProAmtrak

Cool video, I for one have the Cumbres and Toltec plus The Durango and Silverton on my bucket list!

Posted from Android



Date: 04/08/20 17:54
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: Earlk

Hi Greg.  I've done some serious digging here.  First off, 484 had a pilot plow on her until she went into the Alamosa shop for overhaul in Sept. 1964, and didn't emerge from the shop, plow-less until June 28, 1965.  So the film had to have been shot after that date.

484 ran a passenger extra west out of Chama on 9/21/65 with Bill Holt as engineer and Jim Mayer firing. Called 1145am.  No info on the Alamosa-Chama leg.
3 days later 9/23/65, 484 ran a passenger extra east out of Chama with Pete Degani as engineer and Larry Shawcroft firing.  No info on the Durango-Chama leg.

The three days between west and eastbound trips would indicate a trip to Silverton and a trip to Farmington was run.  The typical itinerary of an Illini RR Club trip.

Looking at the foliage in the 484 clips, I see rabbit brush with flowers, and fading green to brown grass and weeds.  As this part of the RR is relatively low elevation, there would be little fall color.

Compare that to the short clip of 483 at Monero with green grass and plants indicative of spring that the RMRRC usually ran their trips.

So my money is on 9/21 and 9/23/1965.  As to who ran it, I don't know.  I do find it interesting that they ran a nice matching train of Silverton-painted boxcar, baggage 126, and 3 vestibuled San Juan cars (including the former "Alamosa" on the rear with an open gon, probably car 402. 



Date: 04/08/20 19:39
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

How do you account for snow on the westbound portion at Tanglefoot(Where the film starts), at Cumbres and part way down to Chama?  That to me indicates spring!  I suppose it could be early fall snow though!!!  There is footage of it east out of Chama to as far as Antonito Station.  As I recall there was no snow on Cumbres eastbound. 

The dates you give would line up to be a three day trip, with the middle date being a trip to Silverton, or Farmington perhaps.  I scoured the Denver Public library pics of excursions, and 484 pics and found nothing similar to this.

The other train with 483 was the RMRRC trip, also in 65, but that was in the spring, so perhaps this short one was right at the same time frame, which is why he spliced them together.  There is not footage of the 483 trip going west as I recall.  Will have to look again tomorrow.  The snow on Cumbres with 484 westbound was interesting to me.  We all know 66 was the last year for these longer excursions, so 1965 would make sense!

Gotta shut down...Tornado Warnings!!!  Lots of wind and lightning.

Thanks Earl....It is my quest to nail this sucker down at least partially.

Greg Scholl
http://www.gregschollvideo.com



Date: 04/11/20 04:39
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: mundo

This may  help solve.
.
Sept 18-26, 1965 was a tour called Colorado Narrow Gauge, that had a special  Alamasa -Durango-Silverton. sponsered by the Orange Empire Railway Museum and Central Coast Railrolad Club.  Group was about 100 passengers. + about  30 Chama to Durango from the Railway Club of Southern California.

Groups departed  Oakland and Los Angeles, combined at Williams AZ for Grand Canyon, Orgional plans was a special Pueblo - Alamosa, but sales could not afford this portion, so was bused.

Included a charter through the Royal Gorge, following the NG charters. which Sept 21-23 would fit.  Did not go to Farmlington.

Trying to locate the brochure, its missing from the master file to pin point the  dates on the NG.

 I was the  excursion director for OERM, but my  working for the Santa Fe at the time, I could not get off, so my wife was the escort.

Ed Von Nordeck
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/20 04:42 by mundo.



Date: 04/11/20 13:58
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: mundo

Found the brochure for the 1965  Central Coast-OERM excursion.

Power was the 484 confirmed with a photo, westbound at Chama.

Sept 21  Alamosa to Durango
Sept 22, Durango  &  Siliverton
Sept 23  Durango to Alamosa

So the crews called on duty all work out.
This one seems solved.

I do have a brocure for a 8th Annual Color Carvan for Oct 1-2-3  Do not know if it operated.  $23.00 round trip rail fare.
 



Date: 04/20/20 06:05
Re: Two D&RGW Excursions in the 1960's
Author: gregscholl

mundo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Found the brochure for the 1965  Central
> Coast-OERM excursion.
>
> Power was the 484 confirmed with a photo,
> westbound at Chama.
>
> Sept 21  Alamosa to Durango
> Sept 22, Durango  &  Siliverton
> Sept 23  Durango to Alamosa
>
> So the crews called on duty all work out.
> This one seems solved.
>
> I do have a brocure for a 8th Annual Color Carvan
> for Oct 1-2-3  Do not know if it operated. 
> $23.00 round trip rail fare.
>  

Thanks for the info.  This confirms Earl's dates, and nails down the sponsor.  I guess I owe you and Earl a video of your choice.
Check my website, and do a fake order, mentioning this FREE offer in the comments section.  I also have some freight train footage, which
I believe will be from the same time period.  Knowing the passenger time period should help with the freight footage as well.
Again thanks.
Greg Scholl
http://www.gregschollvideo.com



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