Steam & Excursion > Wrong Choice

I know the Big Boy is at the top of the Food Chain, it's been UP' s Bread and Butter and being the biggest and most impressive machine but for long-term excursion service
the challenger should have been picked. And which one was sleeker? Thats easy: the challenger! Plus she could be decked out in different schemed paint which made her 
doubly  attractive. And she could run! What 4-6-6-4 didn't look good.
Easier to WYE too!

Half the railfans complain if UP chooses the Challenger over the Big Boy and the other half complain when UP chooses the Big Boy over the Challenger.  They all complain when UP doesn't choose both.  UP cancels Steam Program because of all the constant negative publicity.  You can't please everybody.

It really doesn't matter anymore. They don't have trips or events like the have had in the past. The last big thing was system wide tour of the 4014 in 2019, before that it was the same with 844 in 2012 then before that it was the 3985 pulling the circus train in 2010. I feel the days of seeing multiple trips a year in different directions are over. I guess enjoy seeing it while you can, those days may be numbered too.

Bread and butter? I don't think UP makes any money on this. Also, "Big Boy" has name recognition, not to mention UP can brag about running the largest steam loco in the world.

Victor Baird



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/23 06:05 by wabash2800.

The 'choice' and then committing the labor and expenses in 
restoring any steamloco to operation is NEVER A 'WRONG CHOICE'.

The benefits are subtle and not often appreciated.
The largest benefits are the learning and practicing the 
needed skills by the techs that undertake the tasks ---- 
those tasks always present learning opportunities.

There are lots of skills that need honing, and can be passed down
to newcomers.  In addition the use of 'contractors' has similar 
benefits for those workers ---- it deepens their experience opportunities.

The true educational value is the opportunity to learn more and
to develop those skills, and muscles on actual boilers, fireboxes
and loco systems.

Imagine the tremendous learning opportunities at places 
like Strasburg locomotive shops, and similar outfits that are skilled
in fabricating & restoring steam engines to service, and pressured operation.

So, there are never any "wrong choices"  concerning restoration of any
extant specimens.   There are even greater skills required and to be honed
when new construction is a possibility.

All lucky workers are exposed to learning events everyday that they show-up
and go to work.  Those opportunities are rare, whether in "shop work",
on restorations, or in keeping locos operating in daily service.

​W.

wabash2800 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bread and butter? I don't think UP makes any money
> on this. Also, "Big Boy" has name recognition, not
> to mention UP can brag about running the largest
> steam loco in the world.
>
> Victor Baird

I think beyond being the biggest that actually runs....it should share equal billing with the C&O H8 class. They were build for different things so they can share equal billing for biggest. There's two H8's left...I'd like to see one of them steamed up and rolling...but I doubt it would happen. 

Oh boy, I better order extra popcorn...

I think the thing that’s irritating to many of us is that the 3985 was the sacrificial lamb at the altar of restoring the 4014. If UP had kept the 3985 along with 4014 and 844 it wouldn’t have been such a big deal.

Also has the Dear Leader ever said exactly what was wrong with 3985 other than everything on the engine wasn’t gold plated to his liking!?!?!

SF

Posted from iPhone

SantaFe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the thing that’s irritating to many of
> us is that the 3985 was the sacrificial lamb at
> the altar of restoring the 4014. If UP had kept
> the 3985 along with 4014 and 844 it wouldn’t
> have been such a big deal.
>
> Also has the Dear Leader ever said exactly what
> was wrong with 3985 other than everything on the
> engine wasn’t gold plated to his liking!?!?!
>
> SF
>
> Posted from iPhone

Well it seems 844 was also sacrificed for 4014

I think its a moot point until one of us owns a significant chunk of UP stock.

It’s all a matter of personal opinion. UP decided to trade up to a new machine no different than most of us do with our automobiles every so many years. Based on the public response and $16,000 cab rides they made a wise choice from a PR perspective. Personally, I prefer the look of the Challenger. Actually I prefer a smaller engine working like it was meant to be worked than an engine never given the opportunity to work up a sweat. We railfans aren’t the audience though. The general public who believes bigger is better is who the UP show is for. I have some opinions on the UP program but if 4014 is what it takes to keep the public interested and the program running then so be it.

Posted from iPhone

I think all rail fans should be grateful that UP has any steam locomotives in service.This isn't something they had to do. Had it been up to the bean counters, all the steam engines may have ended up as razor blades. All the staff dealing with steam on the UP have to work within the budget given them. They have to make hard choices that aligns with management's priorities. They are probably pretty far down on the totem pole and have to do the best they can with the resources given them.

SantaFe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think the thing that’s irritating to many of
> us is that the 3985 was the sacrificial lamb at
> the altar of restoring the 4014. If UP had kept
> the 3985 along with 4014 and 844 it wouldn’t
> have been such a big deal.
>
> Also has the Dear Leader ever said exactly what
> was wrong with 3985 other than everything on the
> engine wasn’t gold plated to his liking!?!?!
>
> SF
>
> Posted from iPhone

Keeping three in running condition wouldn't have done any good. Actually running them is getting more infrequent, so having three running would mean each one gets less road time. Not a good return on investment. Poor 844 hasn't even ran since 2019. So one could argue that a third steamer would serve no purpose other than making the program a fatter budget cut target. We got 3985 for almost 30 years at UP's expense. Then, they wanted a flashy new showpiece for the 150th anniversary events. They kept the hotrod that can still claim the 'never retired' title, and resurrected the biggest we were all led to believe would never happen. That would make 3985's description to the common folks something like "middle sized utilitarian engine, 2nd largest currently operating." Be glad it happened rather that grumpy it's not how it used to be.

Posted from Android



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/03/23 13:11 by A-1.

Engines set and the 15 year flu time still runs, on both.  And, UP is short on crews as well.

pennsy3750 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its a moot point until one of us owns a
> significant chunk of UP stock.

Translation: unconditionally moot. This isn't a small company where stock ownership actually matters.

I enjoyed the end of the 3985 era, and I'll proclaim that I can make a reasonable comparison with the 4014 era.

Anyway, NO ONE can change the fact that some people were born at the right time. If you're in a philosophical mood, it matters how you live your life, not when you are born or die. So moot is definitely the keyword here.

1940 was a GREAT year to be born..

I'm blessed with a wondrous life, and many years operating
big steam on American mainlines,   And I've had many true 
friends, been coached in railroading by some of the best,

Luckily, I still have many years to acquire more friends, and 
hang-out with life-long friends.  

I have immense memories, and no regrets, or acts that I'm  regretful of.
The mistakes I've made are too numerous to list, luckily I don't 
remember repeating the same mistake twice!

​W.