Nostalgia & History > a beaumont hill helper question for steamjocky

or anybody who knows . . .

i'll always found it interesting that, in the '60s and '70s, espee typically used gp9s on the hill as helpers--maybe in part because the railroad had so many available. they weren't really big power, though.

i'm sure it varied with the circumstances, but, generally speaking, how did the gp9s do, as helpers? wheel slip getting started very often? operating in short time? other operating eccentricities? what units that were on the roster at the time--even though not assigned to helper service--might you have preferred as helpers?

[man, i love this board! the ability to get "in-the-cab" info, from the guys who know, is priceless!]

many thanks, eljay

A 'heads up'... Mr. Jocky went to work early this morning. He should re-surface (aka 'Shamu') sometime very late Monday night or Tuesday morn. He's out "playing trains"!

Take Care, Stay Safe, Have Fun!

Larry

I'm just going to work also (MWCWC). So here's a nice set of helpers to tide you over. It's not Geeps, but there's more than enough horsepower to do the job. -Brian
Almost forgot, from August '76, at Garnet.-Brian

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UPNW2-1083 Wrote:
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> Almost forgot, from August '76, at Garnet.-Brian

Hmm, that looks like Palm Springs. Hope he has some of that power isolated. Too much behind the caboose.

larry, thanks for the heads up and brian, thanks for the "fix." eljay

BCHellman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> UPNW2-1083 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Almost forgot, from August '76, at
> Garnet.-Brian
>
> Hmm, that looks like Palm Springs. Hope he has
> some of that power isolated. Too much behind the
> caboose.
>
I agree, West Palm Springs...and a lot of power.

SOB

I stand correctd. I'm a Basin guy so not too familiar with the east end. Thanks.-Brian

eljay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> or anybody who knows . . .
>
> i'll always found it interesting that, in the '60s
> and '70s, espee typically used gp9s on the hill as
> helpers--maybe in part because the railroad had so
> many available. they weren't really big power,
> though.
>
> i'm sure it varied with the circumstances, but,
> generally speaking, how did the gp9s do, as
> helpers? wheel slip getting started very often?
> operating in short time? other operating
> eccentricities? what units that were on the
> roster at the time--even though not assigned to
> helper service--might you have preferred as
> helpers?
>
>
>
> many thanks, eljay


As far as I'm concerned, they did very well.

But there was one GP9 that has always stuck in my mind. That one is the 3421. I worked a helper 4 times in a row with engineer Jim Withers and we had that engine in our consist all 4 times as a west unit. I must admit, it was junk. You couldn't regulate the dynamics with it, the vibration made it sound like it was ready to fall apart, and, or course, the speedometer was not working which was pretty much standard in those days.

After the third trip with it Jim went into the roundhouse foreman's off to complain about this engine being on the west end of the consist and not being in the middle of a 3 unit consist or sent to LA to be repaired. The roundhouse foreman, Gene Detwiler, told Jim that he (Jim) would use whatever Gene decided to give him to use. Jim said, "We'll see about that."

Sure enough, on our next trip the 3421 was still on the west end of the consist. We had helped a train eastbound to Myoma and cut away from the caboose and went into the siding to wait for a westbound train to help over Beaumont. A westbound train, upon leaving Indio, called us and said that we were going to go on the point of his train and go all the way to Colton and cutoff there. Jim told him he couldn't do it because of the 3421 not being good as a lead unit but they could go behind the caboose. The conductor said that wasn't going to do that as they had a "rear ender" and one of the restrictions of this car was that any helper had to be ahead of the helper.

The conductor called the operator at Indio and told him to mention this to the dispatcher. Now, you have to realize that dispatchers rarely used the radio back in those days. They only did it when it was convenient for them. However, after the operator relayed this info to the dispatcher, he (the dispatcher) was on the radio faster than you could tell me the definition of restricted speed.

So, we ended up taking our two GP9s and cutting them in about 15 cars ahead of the caboose and ahead of the rear ender when we should have just gone on the point. But Jim stuck to his guns and would not go on the point. I didn't blame him a bit.

A few days later I noticed that the 3421 was nowhere to be seen. I asked my friend, Bob Ruffato, who was the electrician at Colton at the time, what happened to the 3421. He told me that the Master Mechanic from San Fransisco had called and ripped Gene's butt for keeping that 3421 as a lead unit. Apparently Jim had not only filled out the work reports day after day but kept carbon copies of those reports for himself. I never did find out if Jim had sent copies, or maybe the originals, to the Master Mechanic in San Francisco or not but I never did see the 3421 again. I was glad of it too.

Thank you Jim. Wherever you may be.

JE

PS...I'm going to post 2 more photos. I'm sure I've posted these in the past but maybe somebody who hasn't seen them would like these. All taken on a hot and ugly day. I wish the scans were as sharp as the photos.

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1 of 2

Can you see the rear of the KM camera car behind the roundhouse between the two geeps?

July 1969

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Ready to go...

2 of 2

July 1969

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Steamjockey,

Great story! Thanks for sharing the pictures.

Yardclerk

Steamjocky Wrote:
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> I worked a helper 4 times in a row with engineer Jim Withers > and .....

John,

Do you remember the name of the permanent Fireman that used to sleep in the bed of his PU behind the roundhouse? He was always dressed neat as a pin and used the locker room shower.


Quotable Notables:
Stinky Stamer
Jack Rothwell
Harold Bradberry
N. A. (Nasty Ass) Martin
Howard Pergler
Vestal Watson (Can't use his nickname in mixed company)
Charlie Pickett
Clarence Lambert
Jackie Hubbs (My first controlled runaway as a fireboy on a pair of lite Geeps departing Highland)

Ever skinny dip under the firehose at the east end of Myoma in August??

Great memories.

PigSnoot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steamjocky Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I worked a helper 4 times in a row with
> engineer Jim Withers > and .....
>
> John,
>
> Do you remember the name of the permanent Fireman
> that used to sleep in the bed of his PU behind the
> roundhouse? He was always dressed neat as a pin
> and used the locker room shower.
>
>
> Quotable Notables:
> Stinky Stamer
> Jack Rothwell
> Harold Bradberry
> N. A. (Nasty Ass) Martin
> Howard Pergler
> Vestal Watson (Can't use his nickname in mixed
> company)
> Charlie Pickett
> Clarence Lambert
> Jackie Hubbs (My first controlled runaway as a
> fireboy on a pair of lite Geeps departing
> Highland)
>
> Ever skinny dip under the firehose at the east end
> of Myoma in August??
>
> Great memories.


George McKinley. Better known as "Blinky". Don't forget Jimmy Anderson. He was the one that always wore the green pants, shirt, and hat. Want to know about a steam engine? Ask Jimmy or Mr. Hubbs and you'll feel like you're ready to take the written test for promotion to engineer on a steam engine. It's too bad that most of that information is now gone. I sure miss those guys. A few of them were like fathers to me.

Running through the thicket
Leaking like a spigot
Did ole' Charlie scratch his nose?
Or did ole' Charlie Pickett?
(I know. That's terrible)

Harold Bradbury? A Jekyl and Hyde. And a closet railfan too, I believe. A nice guy in the yard office but as soon as his hands touched the grab irons to get on the engine, he turned into a real anal vent. He was the only engineer I ever threatened to throw off of the engine at the east end of Myoma one night. Nuff said.

I'm surprised you remembered all of those names, RWF.

JE

Steamjocky Wrote:
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> the 3421.

As trivia, it was one of the four T&NO "passenger" Geeps that were transferred to the Pacific Lines.

Apparently it had had its boiler either deactivated or removed before it was sent west, as it was never used in passenger/commute service out this-a-way like the other three units were.

You didn't mention anything about it still having dual controls, so I guess they'd been removed by then.

PigSnoot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jackie Hubbs (My first controlled runaway as a
> fireboy on a pair of lite Geeps departing
> Highland)
>

Clearly this story needs to be told.

topper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steamjocky Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > the 3421.
>
> As trivia, it was one of the four T&NO
> "passenger" Geeps that were transferred to the
> Pacific Lines.
>
> Apparently it had had its boiler either
> deactivated or removed before it was sent west, as
> it was never used in passenger/commute service out
> this-a-way like the other three units were.
>
> You didn't mention anything about it still having
> dual controls, so I guess they'd been removed by
> then.


I don't remember the dual controls but it seems to me I do remember the boiler in the nose. It could be possible that I'm thinking of a different Geep with a boiler and not the 3421.

JE

Steamjocky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I don't remember the dual controls but it seems to
> me I do remember the boiler in the nose. It could
> be possible that I'm thinking of a different Geep
> with a boiler and not the 3421.

Further, per Strapac:

The T&NO 282 (SP 3421) came to the Pacific Lines on 11/17/60 and the boiler was removed in March 1962.

Should've looked like the 3417 here:

http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/gp09_photos/3417_sp-gp9-brian_paul_ehni.jpg