Nostalgia & History > Top 5 US Rail Museums

Ernest Robl, a noted railfan and transportation writer from North Carolina, posted this query on another board. With his permission, I am posting it here as I think it provokes some good thoughts and views.
Herewith:
Okay, I think it may be time to have a discussion of what people who participate here think are the five best railroad musuems in the U.S.
I would put the California State Railraod Museum at the top of my list, but then I have only been to a relatively small number of musuems in the U.S. -- though I have also been to a few railroad museums in Europe.

The Colorado musuem at Golden would also make my list as would the B&O museum at Baltimore.

Arguments can be made bothe for and against diversity at a museum. If a museum has a very good collection focusing on a single area, company, etc., that focus should not be counted against it.

Among the things that I look for at a museum:

-- How well is the equipment displayed?

-- How good a shape is the equipment (paint, exterior parts, etc.)?

-- How well is the equipment explained, either through signs at the displays or some type of guide brochure?

-- Is there any operating equipment? (That may not fit for all museums.)

-- How well are other railroad topics such as dispatching, equipment maintenance, track maintenance, intermodal operations, etc., presented and explained?

Okay, what are the other opinions -- and on what basis are you listing a museum in the top five?

-- Ernest

Carol Voss
Bakersfield, CA

I can only comment on the really two big ones I have visited, one being of course Sacramento. The other is the B&O Museum in Baltimore, MD, quite the display of equipment from all the Eastern roads.

I've heard Steamtown really is worth visiting, and I'm sure there are others, someday I'll get around to it :)

I would have to nominate the Illinois Railway Museum, in spite of the fact that I haven't been there for years--it has an amazing variety of equipment, and some of it is operated.

OK, Cal State Rail is on the list. I would have to include Steamtown and Strasburg near the top as well. That's all I've been through in the states, but although not a musuem per se the Brooklyn roundhouse is the top of the list. A working roundhouse with some of the best equipment to be found on iron rail anywhere and a great bunch of craftsman to keep it all going.

Butch,,,,,here we go

Just some observations. Illinois Rail Museum and the B & O museum in Baltimore, and the National Museum of Transport ( Kirkwood Mo ) all have the the most drool-worthy collection of stuff IMO, and is fairly photograph-able ( at least with a wide-ish angle lens ) even if it all isn't in pristine shape. Not to say they have a lotta' junk, but I'll take a cosmetically complete ( if somewhat faded ) 4-8-4 or 1st generation diesel over a jewel-like 4-4-0 tea kettle any day. That's just me. IRM has a fair amount of their own "mainline" to run on too.

California ( Sacramento ) is probably the spiffiest, and does the best job of covering all aspects and history, ( It's almost like a RR-oriented Smithsonian ) but good "roster shot" type photos are hard to get.

CarolVoss Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ernest Robl, a noted railfan and transportation
> writer from North Carolina, posted this query on
> another board. With his permission, I am posting
> it here as I think it provokes some good thoughts
> and views.
> Herewith:
> Okay, I think it may be time to have a discussion
> of what people who participate here think are the
> five best railroad musuems in the U.S.
> I would put the California State Railraod Museum
> at the top of my list, but then I have only been
> to a relatively small number of musuems in the
> U.S. -- though I have also been to a few railroad
> museums in Europe.
>
> The Colorado musuem at Golden would also make my
> list as would the B&O museum at Baltimore.
>
> Arguments can be made bothe for and against
> diversity at a museum. If a museum has a very good
> collection focusing on a single area, company,
> etc., that focus should not be counted against it.
>
>
> Among the things that I look for at a museum:
>
> -- How well is the equipment displayed?
>
> -- How good a shape is the equipment (paint,
> exterior parts, etc.)?
>
> -- How well is the equipment explained, either
> through signs at the displays or some type of
> guide brochure?
>
> -- Is there any operating equipment? (That may not
> fit for all museums.)
>
> -- How well are other railroad topics such as
> dispatching, equipment maintenance, track
> maintenance, intermodal operations, etc.,
> presented and explained?
>
> Okay, what are the other opinions -- and on what
> basis are you listing a museum in the top five?
>
> -- Ernest

Carol,

This can really be a multifacited question. First there is, All Volunteer vs. Paid Staff. Second is, Historical vs. Tourist Railroad. And those can be further broken down, Type of collection, How is the collection interpeted etc.

Some examples:

Best Volunteer Museums:
1. Illinois Railway Museum
2. Orange Empire Railway Museum
3. Shoreline Railway Museum
4. Arden Trolley Museum (Washington, neart Pittsburg PA)

Best Musem with Paid Staff:
1. California State Railroad Museum
2. Pennsylvania Railroad Museum
3. Nevada State Railroad Museum (Carson City)
4. White Pine Railraod Museum (Nevada Northern RR Museum, Ely NV)

*NOTE*
Many Volunteer museums do have some paid staff but the governace is by volunteers. Also many Paid staff museums do have volunteers but the decision making is by the paid staff. That is the differential I use.

Best Collections (and reasons):
1. Illinois Railway Museum (this is with out a doubt one of the best collection to show ALL of the interactions between all of the forms of rail transport in the US)
2. Orange Empire Railway Museum (A sterling collection of Southern California, especially the Pacific Electric & LA Railways)
3. Baltimore Transit Museum (again a great regional collection, based mostly on Baltimore)

Best Interpitations (for the public)
1. California State Railroad Museum
2. Nevada State Railraod Museum
3. Pennsylvania Railroad Museum

Best Tourist Railway with varying degrees of historical accuracy:
1. Durango & Silverton
2. White Pass & Yukon
3. Steamtown National Historic Site
4. Strasburg Railway
5. East Broad Top Railway

*NOTE*
The above five toursit venues are very different and very similar in ways. The D&S and WP&Y are for proffit companies. Steamtown is a National Park. EBT is a family holding. Strasburg is a little of all the above.

As you can see, it is no easy task to say 1 or 5 are the overall besy museums in the US.

There are also so up anc coming organizations that deserve support, no matter where you are:

1. Hawaiian Railway Society, Eva HI. Restoring part of the Oahu Railway.
2. Spencer Shops
3. Southern Oregon Chapter, NRHS

This list could go on and on.

I too will be interested in the replies to this thread.

J.

For the record, here is my response to Ernest's initial query:

Off the top of my head, we have been to the York Museum in England which I think is the best of the best. Back to the US. We have been to the California, of course, to the B&O, to the Altoona Railroaders Museum, to Steamtown, to the Pennsylvania Museum, to the Colorado Rail Museum, Strausburg, to the Western Railway Museum here in California, to the Nevada Rail museum in Carson City. Each one has its own special charactistics. I am a guide at the Monterey Bay Aquarium and we have visited 15 aquariums in this country and England---yes, the Monterey Bay Aquarium stands head and shoulders above most, but each one features something special about either their area or a part of the world. So I guess I don't go to a railroad museum (or aquarium) looking for razzle dazzle so much as how do they present/interpret the area in which they are located and the fish/trains who live/lived there. And do their volunteer docents know about what is there and can answer my questions. I would say that all of the railroad museums I have noted above have met our expectations, no matter how simple. I went to an aquarium in Boothbay Harbor Maine which wasn't much bigger than my family room and they had a petting shark exhibit which made our Monterey effort look quite poor. Of course they didn't have 1.6 million people a year coming to pet the shark so you can see------------:-) Overall, aside from the York museum in England, I would give major honors to the B&O in Baltimore.
C.

Carol Voss
Bakersfield, CA

I nominate the Lake Superior Railroad Museum in Duluth, Minnesota at the Depot. Displays are
excellent, ( a special favorite, the DM&IR Yellowstone Mallet on which the drivers roll every twenty minutes)a diversity of steam, electric, diesel, heavyweight and streamlined passenger equipment, and freight cars. The equipment is well maintained, but above all the staff is knowledgeable, and friendly, and the building is awesome. The museum also operates the North Shore Scenic Railroad, with daily operations during the summer months.

> Best Collections (and reasons):
> 1. Illinois Railway Museum (this is with out a
> doubt one of the best collection to show ALL of
> the interactions between all of the forms of rail
> transport in the US)
> 2. Orange Empire Railway Museum (A sterling
> collection of Southern California, especially the
> Pacific Electric & LA Railways)
> 3. Baltimore Transit Museum (again a great
> regional collection, based mostly on Baltimore)
>

> Best Tourist Railway with varying degrees of
> historical accuracy:
> 1. Durango & Silverton
> 2. White Pass & Yukon
> 3. Steamtown National Historic Site
> 4. Strasburg Railway
> 5. East Broad Top Railway


IMHO...you forgot the Cumbres and Toltec on all of these above lists. The C&TS has a very LARGE volunteer structure that work to restore the vintage equipment. It's collection is not only vintage railroad equipment, but the equipment was specifically built for THAT railroad. Very FEW museums and railroads can boast of a fleet of rolling stock and locomotives that are built for that railroad.

I have to put a word in for the Mad River & NKP Museum in Bellevue, OH. They have a good collection relevant to their local area. Nicely preserved NKP RSD12 and GP30 and WAB F7 diesels, among others, also cars and cabooses, a crane, a W&LE depot, gate tower, and a building with indoor exhibits. It is situated right next to NS mainlines, which adds to the show for fans.

California State is Definately one of the top. Nevada State is also top notch. For a local favorite that gets better each time I go would be the North Carolina Transportation Museum at the old Southern Ry Spencer, NC shops.

This is a subjective list and includes museums only, no tourist railroads like the Strasburg, Cumbres & Toltec or Durango & Silverton.

The best railroad museum in the world is the National Railway Museum in York, UK.

The top five in the U.S. are, in order:

California State Railroad Museum
B&O Railroad Museum
Pennsylvania State Railroad Museum
Illinois Railway Museum
Steamtown

Honorable Mentions go to:
Spencer Shops/NC Transportation Museum
Museum of Transport, MO

A museum is more than simply a collection of stuff. It needs to include interpretation. Of course, all interp with no artifact is pointless too. Many railfans opt for the "railroad junkyard" sort of museum while most museum professionals tent to emphasize the interpretation part. When you get a good collection together with good interpretation, the results can be outstanding.

The previous remarks about volunteer vs. professional are well taken, and make such largely volunteer efforts as the Illinois Railway Museum and the guys at Portola (name?) all the more impressive.

Disclaimer: I have not been to any museums in California other than Portola and Sacramento, the Nevada State Railroad Museum, or the Lake Superior Transp. Museum. Al the others listed thus far I have visited at one time or other.

This is a very interesting thread. I guess I havn't really been to a musuem that I was disappointed with so it is hard to rank them. But I guess I could list them in order of my favorites.

Portola,Ca. Nice collection and very photographable.
Monticello,Il. Not a huge collection but very well maintained and they operate a nice looking Wabash F7
B&O museum. I look for collections that are good to take pictures of.
Lake Superior museum in Duluth. Nice people and very nicely maintained.
Cal State museum in Sacramento. Itw been 15 years since I've been there but I really liked it.
Illinois railway Museum. Big collection.
National Railway Museum in Green Bay. These people had the smarts enough to lease out Milw 261 to be operated by a great bunch of people and they still have a nice collection.
Steamtown. Nice to see taxdollars at work!

S. Thein
Waterloo,Ia

The best museum I have been to recently isn't advertised as a museum at all, but where else can you see two operating 4-8-4's, a 4-6-2 in restoration, one of two existing Alco PA's, an RSD-5, An FA, an ex-Amtrak F40PHR, an F-7, and many more interesting artifacts--the Brooklyn roundhouse in Portland, OR. I took the CA State museum off my list after seeing how they had let ATSF 2925 and 5021 deteriorate.

Many museums are in good locations from the point of view of land cost or being able to operate on a scenic line but suffer in their remoteness, the museums in Portola, CA and Campo, CA fit this category. Orange Empire Railroad Museum in Perris, CA was very remote when it was started but is now becoming enveloped by suburban growth. Other Museums are in downtown urban areas and were started with state and or corporate money, (Sacramento, CA; Baltimore, MD) Being accessible and affordable is a fine line to walk for museums especially in California with its incredible land costs. I attended the Southern Pacific Historical & Technical Society's convention in Oakland, CA last month. Part of the convention was a visit to the Niles Canyon Railroad (operated by the Pacific Locomotive Association). The location of Niles Canyon is very convenient to the large population center in the bay area, this is an advantage in recruiting members/volunteers and the visiting public. It seems incredible with all of the development in the bay area that Niles Canyon retains its ruralness. They may not have the impressive buildings of the other museums mentioned in this thread but they have a very good railroad to run on and a very nice collection.

Just a few favorites:

Sacramento,Ca.
Steamtown, Pa.
B&O, Md.
York, UK
Mulhouse,France

nycman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
I took the CA State
> museum off my list after seeing how they had let
> ATSF 2925 and 5021 deteriorate.

Yes. I can't even get near Sacramento before my blood begins to boil. With Jamestown, Rio Vista, Sunol and Portola in the vicinity who needs 'em.

Best Museums: Many are excellent, but the Illinois Railway Museum is the best. Some other favorites would be Golden, Green Bay, Pennsylvania at Strasbourg and B&O.

Museum most worthy of a repeat visit (and not just because it is close by): Orange Empire

Best equipment collection: The National Museum of Transport in St Louis has the best collection of equipment but it is in the worst condition. Going there is a sad experience.

Most disappointing: Steamtown. Where did all the money go?

Most overrated: Mid Continent at N. Freedom, WI

Bob

I am of the same opinion when it comes to the CSRM, I get mad just thinking about the place. The former director accepted the Santa Fe collection, then oversaw its virtual destruction. Opportunities were ignored to aquire the former SP shop facilities AND its equipment. WPGIII allowed those facilities to slip thru his hands while he poromoted his Museum of Railroad Technology (MORT) which was dead on arrival. No matter what is done now the damage can never be undone. Any inclusion of the California State Railroad Museum on ANY best of list is patently absurd.

I would have to say they are all good museums. Ever Museum is has challages in managing the collection it over sees. here my list

A. Big museum's (paid staff)
1. California state museum
2. B&O museum
3. r.r. museum of penn
4. museum of tran's in st lious
5. steam town nat part

B. Big museum ( nopaid staff)
1. orange empire ( I am a member so this is bias)
2. portola
3. illinois
4. monticello
5. gold coast in floria

c. tourist trains / history driven
1. Ely / nevada northern
2. White pass
3. Durango & silverton
4. cumbres & toltec
5. strasburg

d.Tourist trains / fun to ride
1. grand canyon
2. napa wine trains
3. verve caynon
4. texas state R.R.
5. cass

e. small but good.
1. state of nevada carson city.
2. fair plex at pomona ( big steam )

I'm a member of the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum, so I will keep my list to the museums I have visited.

The Lake Superior Museum is my favorite because:

* Nearly all of its collection is representative of equipment from the Upper Great Lakes region. The only major exception is the Milwaukee Road electric locomotive. But this is OK, because I believe it is the only Milwaukee Road electric kept under a roof.

* The collection is very diverse with everything from the diminutive NP Minnetonka to the giant DM & IR Yellowstone.

* The SOO FP-7, Great Northern NW-2 and DM & IR SD-18 locomotives have been beautifully restored and painted.

* The fact that these locomotives are used on the North Shore Scenic Railroad rather than just sit in static display makes the display much more special.

* The DM & IR business car Northland is a true gem. I had the pleasure of riding in this car on a 2004 NRHS trip.

* There is a nice collection of railway china.

* The museum is located in an train station which itself is centrally located in Duluth

A transit museum worthy of mention is the New York Transit exhibit in Brooklyn. It has an excellent collection of equipment and a nice set of displays.

My other top five include the B & O Museum, the California State Railroad Museum and the Allegheny Portage Railroad west of Altoona.

While not an railroad museum (although it has a railroad section), the Mill City Museum in Minneapolis sets a new standard for industrial museums.

Dave