Nostalgia & History > Amtrak Steam Heat/HEP Renumbering?

Hi all

T'was wondering if someone in the TO community might have or know where to find a cross reference to renumberings applied to Amtrak's Heritage fleet when it was converted to HEP.

I would appreciate if someone could refresh my memory ... about what year(s) did this program start, and how long did it take to complete? Would I be correct in thinking some cars were dropped from the roster instead?

Thank you!

* JB *

Amtrak initiated the program to convert steam/DC genemotor cars to HEP in about 1976 or 1977 with a pair of 10&6 sleepers converted to HEP to operate with Amfleet I cars on the Night Owl between Washington and Boston. All of the steam/DC/genemotor cars were off the active roster by March 1980 or March 1981 when the last steam/DC consist ran on The Silver Star. The majority of the cars retained and converted to HEP were Budd stainless steel cars.

Most of the cars that were not converted to HEP were eventually sold to new owners thru a series of auctions between the early 1980s and mid/late 1990s.

Some additional cars (such as some dome cars and 11 double bedroom sleepers) that had been placed in storage were pulled out of storage and converted to HEP later in the 1980s for service on Amtrak's Autotrain and other pre-Superliner consists such as the Capitol Limited and City of New Orleans.

The series of Amtrak Car Spotter books edited by Robert Wayner and published by Wayner Publications of New York are the best reference to the before-conversion and after-conversion car numberings. These books are long out of print, but usually available from after-market sources online or at railroadiana shows.

Jack_Deasy Wrote:
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> Amtrak initiated the program to convert steam/DC
> genemotor cars to HEP in about 1976 or 1977 with a
> pair of 10&6 sleepers converted to HEP to operate
> with Amfleet I cars on the Night Owl between
> Washington and Boston.

This initial fleet eventually numbered 100 baggage, sleeping and dorm cars. These cars were used on LD trains otherwise composed of HEP Amfleet coaches and lounges. The original Pioneer, Desert Wind and the National Limited were among trains using these cars.

The Heritage Fleet HEP rebuilding program started about 1979 and ran thru about 1985. The Heritage Fleet cars were distinctively different from the original HEP conversions in that the original cars were not completely refurbished. Most of the earlier HEP rebuilds were later given the full HF treatment.

Santa Fe's Topeka Shops also did HF rebuilds on most of the Hi-Level cars 1979-1981.

All of the
> steam/DC/genemotor cars were off the active roster
> by March 1980 or March 1981 when the last steam/DC
> consist ran on The Silver Star. The majority of
> the cars retained and converted to HEP were Budd
> stainless steel cars.

True. I believe the Florida trains were steam heat thru 1982. They were the last trains to be converted to HEP and powered solely by SDP40Fs.

> Most of the cars that were not converted to HEP
> were eventually sold to new owners thru a series
> of auctions between the early 1980s and mid/late
> 1990s.

Or left to rot!

> Some additional cars (such as some dome cars and
> 11 double bedroom sleepers) that had been placed
> in storage were pulled out of storage and
> converted to HEP later in the 1980s for service on
> Amtrak's Autotrain and other pre-Superliner
> consists such as the Capitol Limited and City of
> New Orleans.

Yes and these cars were in the shop when I toured Beech Grove in 1983. I think the last cars to be converted to HEP were the six Santa Fe Hi-Level diners which came out around 1985.

> The series of Amtrak Car Spotter books edited by
> Robert Wayner and published by Wayner Publications
> of New York are the best reference to the
> before-conversion and after-conversion car
> numberings.

Jack has it nailed. My copy is Amtrak Car and Locomotive Spotter, 4th Ed, Wayner Publications, 1980. Also useful are several books by RPC Publications, W. David Randall. The best Randall series for your needs were the Railway Passenger Car Annuals. These volumes give the complete car number history.

These books are long out of print,
> but usually available from after-market sources
> on line or at railroadiana shows.

Yup. Good luck. If you want detail on any particular car or series, let me know.
Bob

Amtrak Heritage Fleet Car Information

JB

Here's some info from my notes; I have more detail info on renumbering but its too detailed to post - if you are looking for a specific car or groups, please contact me by e-mail.

Also, not all the passenger cars in the final group of 258 of mostly Budd Cars, that Amtrak set aside for head end conversion were given new number series, for example several Dome Sleepers, Dome Coaches and Dome Lounges never had new series identified.


Take Care

EC
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Converted 38 Cars for Baggage Service on or with Amfleet Cars approximately 1975

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1350 – 1379 50ft Baggage SLC 30 US ARMY Amfleet Trains HEP & Steam
1450 – 1455* Baggage Dorm SLC 6 US ARMY Amfleet Trains HEP & Steam

Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase I Paint with Pointless Arrows
*Note – These cars were rebuilt for use as Baggage Dorms on the Montrealer and James Whitcomb Riley

Converted 4 Cars for Sleeper Service on or with Amfleet Cars approximately 1977

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
2900 & 2917 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 4 UP Panama LTD HEP
2920 & 2923 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 4 UP Panama LTD HEP

Note – These cars were rebuilt for use as Sleepers on the Panama LTD starting on 9 Dec 1977 after the severe winter of 1976-77 forced a conversion to Amfleet cars with no Sleeper or Dining Service
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase I Paint with Pointless Arrows

Converted 25 Additional Cars for Sleeper Service on or with Amfleet Cars approximately 1978

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
2903 – 2941 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 7 UP Amfleet Trains HEP
2980 – 2997 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 18 ATSF Amfleet Trains HEP

Note – These cars were rebuilt for use as Sleepers on the Cardinal, InterAmerican, Montrealer, National Limited, Night Owl, Pioneer, and other Trains with Amfleet cars after the severe winter of 1976-1977 forced a conversion to Amfleet cars with no Sleeper or Dining Service
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase II Paint

Converted 55 Cars for Long Distance Service on the Lake Shore Limited - Cars Converted 1979

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1150 – 1154 Baggage ACF 5 PC-NYC Lake Shore LTD HEP
1610 – 1613 Baggage Dorm SLC 4 US ARMY Lake Shore LTD HEP
2050 – 2053 Slumber-Coach Budd 4 PC-NYC Lake Shore LTD HEP
2880 – 2883 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 4 UP Lake Shore LTD HEP
3100 – 3105 Lounge SLC 6 AMTK-USA Lake Shore LTD HEP
4600 – 4626 Coach 44Seat SLC 27 UP Lake Shore LTD HEP
8500 – 8504 Diner Budd 5 BN-CBQ Lake Shore LTD HEP

*Note – These cars were rebuilt for use on first fully converted Heritage Train – The Lake Shore LTD
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint

Converted 60 Cars for Baggage Service on or with Amfleet & Superliner Cars approximately 1977-78

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1203 – 1249 Baggage Budd 47 ATSF LongHaul Trains HEP & Steam
1250 – 1272 Baggage ACF 13 ATSF LongHaul Trains HEP & Steam
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase II Paint

Converted 68 Cars for Long Distance Service on the Broadway Limited - Cars Converted 1980

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1155 – 1158 Baggage ACF 4 PC-NYC Broadway LTD HEP
1614 – 1617 Baggage Dorm SLC 4 US ARMY Broadway LTD HEP
2080 – 2088 Slumber-Coach Budd 9 BN-NP&CBQ Broadway LTD HEP
2884 – 2894 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 11 UP Broadway LTD HEP
3106 – 3111 Lounge Budd 6 ATSF Broadway LTD HEP
4700 – 4729 Coach 48Seat Budd 30 ATSF Broadway LTD HEP
8505 – 8508 Diner Budd 4 BN-CBQ&NP Broadway LTD HEP

*Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint

Converted 64 Cars for Long Distance Service on Superliner Trains - Cars Converted 1979 to 1981

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
39900 – 39921 Hi-L Coach-Drm Budd 22 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39923 – 39923 Hi-L Coach-Drm Budd 1 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39925 – 39938 Hi-L Coach-Drm Budd 14 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39940 & 39942 Hi-L Coach Budd 2 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39944 – 39950 Hi-L Coach Budd 7 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39952 – 39954 Hi-L Coach Budd 3 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39956 – 39964 Hi-L Coach Budd 9 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP
39970 – 39975 Hi-L Lounge Budd 6 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP

*Note – These cars were rebuilt for use on fully converted Superliner Trains as Transition Dorm&Coaches
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint

Converted 158 Cars for Long Distance Service on the Silver Meteor & Cresent - Cars Converted 1981

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1159 – 1172 Baggage Budd 14 CBQ & ATSF Meteor-Cresent HEP
1618 – 1621 Baggage Dorm Budd 4 SCL-SAL Meteor-Cresent HEP
1622 – 1625 Baggage Dorm Budd 4 SP-TNO Meteor-Cresent HEP
1626 – 1627 Baggage Dorm Budd 2 SCL-ACL Meteor-Cresent HEP
2089 – 2093 Slumber-Coach Budd 5 BN-NP&CBQ Meteor-Cresent HEP
2430 – 2441 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 12 UP Meteor-Cresent HEP
2442 – 2456 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 15 SP-TNO Meteor-Cresent HEP
2457 – 2460 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 4 ATSF Meteor-Cresent HEP
2461 – 2461 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 1 BN-CBQ Meteor-Cresent HEP
3112 – 3112 Lounge Budd 1 ATSF Meteor-Cresent HEP
3113 – 3117 Lounge Budd 5 SP Meteor-Cresent HEP
3118 – 3127 Lounge Budd 10 PC-PRR Meteor-Cresent HEP
4000 – 4026*** Coach 44Seat Budd 27 SP Meteor-Cresent HEP
4627 – 4645 Coach 44Seat Budd 18 UP Meteor-Cresent HEP
4646 – 4647 Coach 44Seat Budd 2 BN-GN Meteor-Cresent HEP
4648 – 4649 Coach 44Seat Budd 2 UP Meteor-Cresent HEP
4730 – 4739 Coach 48Seat Budd 10 ATSF Meteor-Cresent HEP
4740 – 4742 Coach 48Seat Budd 3 BN-CBQ Meteor-Cresent HEP
5000 – 5008** Coach 50Seat Budd 9 BN-CBQ Meteor-Cresent HEP
8509 – 8510 Diner Budd 2 BN-CBQ&NP Meteor-Cresent HEP
8511 – 8518 Diner Budd 8 PC-NYC Meteor-Cresent HEP
*Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint
**5000 – 5008 were never released for service as coaches – but were rebuilt to Buffet Cars 8710-8716
**4021 – 4026 were never released for service as coaches – Amfleet II Coach cancelled need of coaches

Conversion of the 258 remaining best cars for Long Distance Service on the Silver Star to Augment Amfleet II Coaches and for other Services - Cars Converted 1981 to 1985 –**Several never converted.

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
1126 – 1126 Baggage -3Door PS 1 SOU Silver Star & Etc HEP
1127 – 1127 Baggage-3Door ACF 1 SOU-CNOTP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1128 – 1131 Baggage PS 4 BN-NP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1132 – 1132 Baggage PS 1 SCL-ACL Silver Star & Etc HEP
1133 – 1136 Baggage PS 4 BN-NP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1137 – 1138 Baggage ACF 2 UP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1139 – 1139 Baggage SLC 1 UP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1140 – 1145 Baggage ACF 6 PC-NYC Silver Star & Etc HEP
1173 – 1174 Baggage Budd 2 CBQ & ATSF Silver Star & Etc HEP
1175 – 1177 Baggage PS 3 BN-NP Silver Star & Etc HEP
1178 – 1195 Baggage SLC 18 AMTK-USA Silver Star & Etc HEP
1628 – 1630 Baggage Dorm SLC 3 AMTK-1400 Silver Star & Etc HEP
1631 – 1633 Baggage Dorm SLC 3 AMTK-1450 Silver Star & Etc HEP
2054 – 2056 Slumber-Coach Budd 3 BN-NP&CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2070 – 2077** Slumber-Coach Budd 2 SCL-B&O Silver Star & Etc HEP
2094 – 2095 Slumber-Coach Budd 2 BN-NP&CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2096 – 2097 Slumber-Coach Budd 2 B&O Silver Star & Etc HEP
2200 – 2204** Sleeper 6-5-4 Budd 3 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2220 – 2222 Sleeper 11DB Budd 3 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2223 – 2224** Sleeper 11DB Budd 1 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2225 – 2225** Sleeper 11DB Budd 1 SCL-SAL Silver Star & Etc HEP
2230 – 2234 Sleeper 11DB PS 5 UP Silver Star & Etc HEP
2235 – 2235 Sleeper 11DB PS 1 UP Silver Star & Etc HEP
2462 – 2473 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 12 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
2474 – 2476 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 12 SCL-SAL Silver Star & Etc HEP
2477 – 2478 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 2 SCL-SAL Silver Star & Etc HEP
2479 – 2482 Sleeper 10&6 Budd 4 PC-PRR Silver Star & Etc HEP
2871 – 2879** Sleeper 10&6 Budd 12 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
3128 – 3129** Lounge Budd 2 PC-PRR Silver Star & Etc HEP
3130 – 3132** Lounge Budd 3 BN-CBQ Silver Star & Etc HEP
3133 – 3138** Lounge Budd 3 SOU Silver Star & Etc HEP
7000 – 7006 Coach 85Seat Budd 7 PC-PRR Silver Star & Etc HEP
7600 – 7619 Coach 88Seat Budd 20 PC-PRR Silver Star & Etc HEP
7620 – 7629 Coach 88Seat Budd 10 ATK-4700 Silver Star & Etc HEP
8519 – 8520 Diner Budd 2 PC-NYC Silver Star & Etc HEP
8521 – 8525 Diner Budd 5 SOU Silver Star & Etc HEP
8526 – 8528 Diner Budd 3 SP Silver Star & Etc HEP
8529 – 8529 Diner Budd 1 AWP Silver Star & Etc HEP
8530 – 8530** Diner Budd 1 DRGW Silver Star & Etc HEP
8531 – 8531** Diner Budd 1 LN Silver Star & Etc HEP
8550 – 8559 Diner-Buffet Budd 1 ATK-8500 Silver Trains HEP
8600 – 8603 Table Car 80S Budd 4 ATK-4600 Auto Train HEP
8700 – 8704 Buffet Cafeteria Budd 1 ATK-3100 Auto Train HEP
8710 – 8716 Buffet Cafeteria Budd 1 ATK-5000 Silver Trains HEP
8750 – 8752 Diner-Buffet Budd 1 ATK-8500 Auto Train HEP
9300 – 9302 Big Dome Lge Budd 3 BN-GN-CBQ Auto Train HEP
9310 – 9312 Big Dome Lge Budd 3 MILW Auto Train HEP
9400 – 9411 Dome Coach Budd 12 BN-GN&NP Captiol & CofNO HEP
*Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint

Rebuilt 12 HEP equipped Cars for Medium Distance Service out of Chicago - Cars upgraded in 1981

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
9600 – 9601 Bi-L Snck Coach PS 2 CNW Shorthaul Trains HEP
9611 – 9620 Bi-L Coach 96S PS 10 CNW Shorthaul Trains HEP
9621 – 9624 Bi-L Coach 96S PS 4 ATK-9611-9614 Shorthaul Trains HEP

*Note – all cars in this batch were release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint

Converted 6 Cars for Long Distance Service on Superliner Trains - Cars Converted 1985

Car Series Car Type Builder Total Heritage Service Status
39980 – 39985 Hi-L Diner-Lge Budd 6 ATSF Superliner Trains HEP

*Note – These cars were rebuilt for use on fully converted Superliner Trains as Transition Dorm&Coaches
Note all cars in this batch were converted and release from Beech Grove in service in Phase III Paint