Nostalgia & History > Early VO1000 question

Anybody know of a comprehensive roster of early, "round front" VO1000's? Most Santa Fe rosters show them having six, 2201-2206, with side radiators and Batz trucks, looking like this:


http://yardlimit.railfan.net/baldwindiesels/magazine-1939-4/pic1.html

The 2206, built in 1941, looked a little different - the front opening was smaller and the headlight was lower, with its top even with the top of the hood, see page BLW-289 of The Second Diesel Spotters Guide.

Santa Fe VO1000's starting with (supposedly) 2207, built in 1942, had the more familiar later carbody with a rectangular front opening, front radiators, and Type-A switcher trucks:

http://cdm16079.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15330coll22/id/82547
http://cdm16079.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/ref/collection/p15330coll22/id/82550

There's a photo of the 2207 in Santa Fe Car and Locomotive Plans for Model Railroaders showing this carbody style. However, a friend recently showed me a builder's photo of a different ATSF 2207, one that had the same round front, side radiator carbody and trucks as 2206. I've never seen another photo of that 2207, and I'm curious what became of it. Anybody know?

Here's another photo of a Santa Fe round front V01000, number 2203:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3339913

Here is a comprehensive VO-1000 roster:

http://www.american-rails.com/vo1000.html

I'd go to George Elwood's "Fallen Flags" website after using this.

Bob

ATSF100WEST......Out

ATSF100WEST Wrote:

> Here is a comprehensive VO-1000 roster:
>
> http://www.american-rails.com/vo1000.html

Thanks Bob, but what I really need is an itemized roster of all known round front VO1000's to try and figure out which one was the mysterious first-2207.

For what it's worth, american-rails.com roster isn't entirely correct - it shows Santa Fe's VO1000's as 2202-2259, but 2201 was definitely also a round-front, side-radiator VO1000. There's a picture of it waist deep in water at Argentine during the 1951 flood on page 70 of Santa Fe Heritage v.2.

> I'd go to George Elwood's "Fallen Flags" website
> after using this.

Been there, tried that, no dice. Unfortunately, pictures of Santa Fe's round front VO1000's are surprisingly scarce. I've never seen a photo of 2206 other than its builder's photo.

Here is the #2203 in a 1940 advertisement.

JMW
http://waidephoto.smugmug.com/Trains

---

ATSF100WEST Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here is a comprehensive VO-1000 roster:
>
> http://www.american-rails.com/vo1000.html
>
> I'd go to George Elwood's "Fallen Flags" website
> after using this.
>
> Bob
>
> ATSF100WEST......Out


Comprehensive? Sorry, I don't think so! The one you linked to doesn't list builder numbers, and only has a year for the build date, not even a specific month in which they were built!

For a truly "comprehensive" Baldwin VO-1000 roster, complete with spotting Phases, see David Thompson's website. Go to the bottom for an explanation of the Phases:

http://www.trainweb.org/jaydeet/vo-1000.htm

More original owner diesel rosters, complete with builder numbers and Phases (in most cases), are found here:

http://www.trainweb.org/jaydeet/rosters.htm

"Phases" are railfan applied and not officially recognized by the locomotive builders. They're a way of denoting visual differences over the production life of specific locomotive models. In the study of diesels, the mention of "Phases" began in the very early issues of Extra 2200 South, the now defunct locomotive newsmagazine.

Evan, note the "round front" style VO-1000s are listed by Phase, meaning you should be able to determine specific units you're looking for. I recommend bookmarking the site for future reference.

Albrae Wrote:

> For a truly "comprehensive" Baldwin VO-1000
> roster, complete with spotting Phases, see David
> Thompson's website. Go to the bottom for an
> explanation of the Phases:
>
> http://www.trainweb.org/jaydeet/vo-1000.htm

Thanks. Looks like I want to find "Phase Ib1" VO1000's...and unfortunately ATSF 2206 built 6/41 is the only one listed. The "Phase Ib's" listed are:

EJ&E 475 built 1/41
Iowa Ordnance Plant 120-1 built 5/41
MILW 1680 and 1681 built 10,11/40
Oliver Iron Mining 907-909 built 7-8/40
Patapsco & Back River 70 and 71 built 10,12/40
Reading 80 and 81 built 8,9/40
Union 500 and 501 built 10/40

All of those were built before ATSF 2206, and none have Batz trucks, which makes it unlikely that any of them are the mysterious 2207. Hmmmmmmm.........

> -----
> > Here is a comprehensive VO-1000 roster:
> >
> > http://www.american-rails.com/vo1000.html
> >
>

I find the fluffy "american-rails" site to be just two notches above "trains and locomotives wikia"
http://trains-and-locomotives.wikia.com/wiki/EMD_SD40-2

and one notch above "locomotive wikia"
http://locomotive.wikia.com/wiki/ALCO_S1

You might find just about everything you might want to know about model changes in Baldwin diesels in Gary and Steven Dolzalls book Diesels from Eddystone: The Story of Baldwin Diesel Locomotives.

There were several variations in the appearance of the round opening and headlight placement. Of course! What else would you expect from Baldwin?

According to Dolzalls book, prior to 1941, Baldwin used hand assembled radiators mounted behind shutters on the flanks of the nose, and the round opening at the front fit the shroud for the fan. Problems with leakage caused by coupling impacts caused a redesign, using specifically designed commercial radiators in a rectangular opening in front of the fan, and redirecting the fan exhaust upward to smaller exhaust registers on the sides. This change took place in early 1941. By 1942, these registers were rerouted to the roof.

Dolzall's roster shows, "All oval grilled VO-1000's include: AT&SF 2201-2206, CofG 22, CMStP&P 1680-1681, EJ&E 475, Iowa Ordinance 1-120, M&StL D-340, MP 9103, P&BR 70-71, RDG 80-81, SP&S 30-31, OIM 907-909, Union 500-501.
All known VO-1000's delivered with Baldwin switcher trucks include: AT&SF 2201-2206, MP 9103.

-John

In case anyone is still following this thread...I pulled out John F. Kirkland's book on Baldwin diesels, and it contains no trace or hint- at least that I can find- of an earlier Santa Fe #2207.

As per what John wrote, ATSF #2200 was formerly Baldwin demonstrator unit #62000, built in 1935/1936 and sold to ATSF on 28 June 1937. In May 1939, Baldwin authorized constructing seven 1,000 horsepower switchers- Missouri Pacific and ATSF initially ordered one each, then ATSF increased its order to five units (#2201-#2205). Baldwin built all seven of these locomotives between November 1939 and early February 1940. The 7th unit in this batch became a Baldwin demonstrator, then was sold to the Spokane, Portland & Seattle as their #30.

In August 1939, Baldwin authorized constructing additional switcher batches that could be equipped with either GSC-type or Batz trucks, followed a short time later by another what Baldwin labelled the "Second Block of Orders"- 10 each 660- and 1000- horsepower locomotives built for stock. The Second Block featured an external design change, specifically "recessing the headlight housing into the radiator compartment" as "a very minimal attempt at streamlining the front end". ATSF #2206 was the last unit built of this Second Block, and it came about when Baldwin offered to exchange the #2200 for a duplicate of #2201-#2205. Baldwin later grouped the 39 660- and 1000- horsepower switchers built through the Santa Fe #2206 together as their "A Lot" switchers- all of these featured the side radiator design and rounded nose. Kirkland and other written sources state the ATSF #2206 was the last to be built to this design, as by this point the side mounted radiators had proven themselves generally unable to stand up to the railroad operating environment. Switchers built after the ATSF #2206 all had the front mounted radiators and flat nose and were grouped into the B- and later lots.

The back of Kirkland's book contains listings of every Baldwin diesel built, and it is interesting. Baldwin designated the VO-1000 switchers into two distinct classes, 8-DE-1000/1 E and 0-4-4-0 1000/1 DE. Baldwin's serial numbering (S/N) for this list spanned both classes. Class 8-DE-1000/1 E contains seven units, as follows:

S/N 1: ATSF 2201
S/N 2: MP #9103
S/N 3-6: ATSF #2202-#2205
S/N 7: Baldwin #307 (SP&S #31)

The changeover to Class 0-4-4-0 1000/1 DE happened in February 1940. There were some overlaps between the design change effected between the "A" and "B" Lot switchers. In the text, Kirkland indicates the first "B-lot" switchers were Northern Pacific #109 and #110, Baldwin serial numbers 24 and 25, built June 1941. Thus, the first of the Baldwin serial numbers for this class laid out as follows:

S/N 8-10: Baldwin #332-#334 (SP&S #31, Central of Georgia #22, M&StL #D340) A-lot design
S/N 11-12: Reading #80-#81 A-lot design
S/N 13-14: Union Railroad #500-#501 A-Lot design
S/N 15-16: Milwaukee Road #1680-#1681 A-Lot design
S/N 17-18: Patapsco & Black River #70-#71 A-Lot design
S/N 19: Elgin, Joliet & Eastern #475 A-Lot design
S/N 20: Iowa Ordinance Depot #1-120 A-Lot design
S/N 21-23: Oliver Mining #907-#909 A-Lot design
S/N 24-25: Northern Pacific #109-#110 B-Lot design
S/N 26: Patapsco & Black Rivers #72 B-Lot design
S/N 27-28: Southern Pacific #1320-#1321 B-Lot design
S/N 29: ATSF #2206 A-Lot design
S/N 30-32: Southern Pacific #1322-#1324 B-Lot design
S/N 33-34: Terminal Railroad Association of St. Louis #591-#592 B-Lot design
S/N 35-38: Union Railroad #502-#505 B-Lot design
S/N 39-40: Elgin, Joliet & Eastern #476-#477 B-Lot design

There is only one Santa Fe #2207 in the production list, it is S/N #95, built 7 November 1942. Construction of the Class 0-4-4-0 1000/1 DE carried on through Baldwin Serial Number 553, Tennessee Coal, Iron & Railroad #803, built 16 July 1946. The 1000-horsepower switchers then continued on under classes DS4-4-1000/1 NA and DS-4-4-1000/1 SC until 1951, when production shifted over to the Class DS-4-4-1200/1 SC, better known to railfans as the S-12.

Thus, the written record, at least as John and others present it, does not support the existence of an earlier ATSF #2207, especially one with side radiators and a rounded nose. The mystery deepens...are you sure the photograph wasn't fake or doctored in some way?

Jeff Moore
Elko, NV

JDLX Wrote:

> The mystery
> deepens...are you sure the photograph wasn't fake
> or doctored in some way?

It sure didn't look like it had been, but I asked my friend (who is working on a book) to see if he could read the serial number off the builder's plate on the original image. He found the original, and the road number there was...2206. Somewhere along the way, someone in the office had altered a copy of it to read 2207 without noting that the image was altered. Sorry for the wild goose chase, guys.