Nostalgia & History > WAG running extra (#57): Zebra on the UP

The fascination of a “then & now” comparison runs deep in this railfan photography hobby. We all love to see how the inexorable march of time & advancing technology brings about changes in the RR scene in a given spot. Art Gibson shot a routine pair of to & fro shots of this AT&SF train on the UP in New Cambria, KS in the summer of 1959. Under overcast conditions many photographers would have passed up shooting this scene. A Zebra-painted Alco switcher acting as road power was very likely a common sight in the Abilene ~ Salina corridor of the Middle Division’s Salina District. Even if it did involve running rights over Union Pacific between those same two points.

I for one am thrilled that Art shot these slides of my Santa Fe working territory. He couldn’t know he was shooting them for me because it wouldn’t become my territory for another 19 years. In June of 1959 I was but 4 years old. I would have to grow up, graduate from high school and put in a 4-year stint with the US Postal Service before hiring on with the Santa Fe. Only then (in June of 1978) would I make my first AT&SF road trip over these very UP rails as a student brakeman. Of course I hired on way too late to see any Santa Fe zebras. And I regret to say I can’t produce a shot of a Santa Fe train at New Cambria from my own camera. But I did get to see blue-trimmed-in-yellow 1500 Class Alco S-4s in service before time & technology took them away for ever…

1. AT&SF 1506 has charge of 15(?) cars in this scene on the Union Pacific at New Cambria, KS.

2. Mineral brown waycar AT&SF 1834 brings up the rear end as this eastbound train has crossed N Weaver Rd at the west edge of New Cambria.
2 photos taken in June of 1959 by William A. [Art] Gibson (WAG) Jr.

Thanks for looking back!
Lance Garrels (santafe199)
Art Gibson (wag216)



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/14/22 21:02 by santafe199.

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cool pics. I spent some time in Salina and enjoyed seeing the varied RR action of the time. UP, ATSF, OKKT and MP.  I too wish I could have seen that train in real life but this is certainly better then no picture at all.  Thanks to both of you for sharing.
 

Lance, is that a signal disc on top of the cupola? Neat pics, KCRW287

KCRW287 Wrote: > ... is that a signal disc on top of the cupola ...

I believe it is. At one time I understand they were used to signal the head end crew to "highball, proceed". I never saw one in person, and I'm not sure when they fell out of use on the SFe. I'm sure Evan can help us out here.

As an a side: I was on the phone with Art a while ago. He was able to fill in some interesting details concerning the 1500s running over the UP. It was Lloyd Stagner that had tipped him about the Alco switchers operating outside of regular yard service. Art told me "somebody at Abilene" had decided the 1500s could be used between there & Salina, presumably to shuttle cars back and forth between the 2 yards. But it seems UP powers that be put the kibosh to this practice. Apparently Uncle Pete was very UN-impressed with the slow pace of a Santa Fe zebra hauling significant tonnage across its busy KP main line... :^)

Lance

I love bothe shots but for different reasons. The Alco shot looks like a painting, and the going away shot details just plain blows me away! Very nice post!!

Bill Rettberg
Bel Air, MD

I old Emporia engineer I used to know, (REAL old, retired when he was 76) told me Santa Fe had their own line between Abilene and Salina at one time. He was firing on a steam engine, and sustained a back injury when his engine went down on a partially collapsed bridge. Rather than put in a new bridge, they started running on the UP.

Posted from Android

Great photos.  In addition to the caboose in the wonderful going away shot, check out what appears to be a mid-1950s International dairy delivery truck on the road.  Also the Ford truck at the elevator.

Thanks Lance!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/16/18 09:47 by MILW16.

santafe199 Wrote:

> I believe it is. At one time I understand they
> were used to signal the head end crew to
> "highball, proceed". I never saw one in person,
> and I'm not sure when they fell out of use on the
> SFe. I'm sure Evan can help us out here.

From an old thread  :

According to Ellington's Caboose Cars of the Santa Fe, these "highball signals" were introduced in the early 1930's as a way for the conductor to signal to the engineer that, for example, the brakes were released, or that the rear of train in the clear at a siding, etc. Santa Fe drawings refer to these devices as "Wig Wag Signals," but use of that term these days tends to cause confusion and consternation versus the more familiar grade crossing signals of the same name. The earliest drawings date to 1928, but an article in the 1st quarter 1999 Warbonnet claims the earliest known photo of a waycar equipped with the devices dates to 1940. The large discs shown in Ed's photo were painted orange, and the two round objects near the center of the discs are the backs of a pair of lamps, one white and one red, to be used at night. These 30" discs are a later design; earlier discs were smaller, had a single lamp, and some were painted in a target-like scheme of unknown colors:

http://cdn.loc.gov/service/pnp/fsa/8d27000/8d27000/8d27002v.jpg

One thing missing from all the references I can find on these devices are exact rules of usage, even in the 1953 rulebook. Reportedly, the devices were operated from inside the cupola via a crank, and from the "storage" position shown in the photos, they could be swung outward nearly 180 degrees such that the discs were beyond the side of the caboose/train. The Warbonnet article indicates that they were "waved" when in use, while Santa Fe Waycars says more likely they were simply swung over to the outer position and left there until it was obvious the engineer had received the signal.

The advent of radio lead to the gradual removal of the Wig Wag signals during the 1950's. At least one car is known to have made it to 1960 with its Wig Wags intact.  I can't recall ever seeing a photo of a car with just one disc before - usually there was one on each side of the cupola.  I see the pivot point and the two rests for the missing disc on car 1834 in the photo, so it once had two discs as well, and the absence of one may well mean it had gotten damaged and was simply removed in the field and never replaced because the signals were no longer being used in regular operations.

The thing I wonder about in the first photo is what looks like a train order stand or mail crane on the right when their doesn't appear to be a depot or other staffed railroad facility at that location. 

Also, look at the mail hook on the platform in the first photo. Thanks for sharing. I presume there was a station here and the hook and a place for dropping mail bags on the fly was just a distance beyond it for safety reasons?

Victor A. Baird
http://www.erstwhilepublications.com

MILW16 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Great photos.  In addition to the caboose in the
> wonderful going away shot, check out what appears
> to be a mid-1950s International dairy delivery
> truck on the road.  Also the Ford truck at the
> elevator.
>
> Thanks Lance!

I think it is a UP signal that is on the other side of the train with just the top of it showing over the top of the caboose. upkpfan

My first thought when I saw the 2nd picture was the top of a signal showing.  In looking at the signals in the 1st picture, the height would be correct for it being the top of a signal and it is located fairly close to the clearance point of that track going off to the right.  Doubt we will ever know for sure.



upkpfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think it is a UP signal that is on the other
> side of the train with just the top of it showing
> over the top of the caboose. upkpfan

On Google Maps the old ATSF right of way can still be made out.
LocoPilot750 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I old Emporia engineer I used to know, (REAL old,
> retired when he was 76) told me Santa Fe had their
> own line between Abilene and Salina at one time.
> He was firing on a steam engine, and sustained a
> back injury when his engine went down on a
> partially collapsed bridge. Rather than put in a
> new bridge, they started running on the UP.
>
> Posted from Android

Lance and I got our wires crossed. (is not the first time either). The AT&SF 1500s (Alco S4) were regular power at that time on the Abilene - Salina local (on the UP). The power that the UnPac did not  NOT like, was the AT&SF's 460class (GE 44tonner) on their freight trains! I do not think any photos are around of the 44tonners on that local service .wag216

A conductor friend (now deceased) told me that one night they had just gotten their speed up after departing Salina when the brake rigging broke on the car just ahead of the waycar and it was kicking up ballast against the front of the waycar.  He was aware the caboose radio did not work but no problem, he would pull the air on the train.  As he reached for the brake valve he noticed the air gauge was on "ZERO".  Fortunately they made Abilene without derailing.  He stated he had learned his lesson on short cutting any required air brake test.

Mark

The #2 photo object is not the top of a signal.  Notice the holes clearly showing, no UP color light signal backgrounds were constructed with holes.  In addition the size is proportionally larger than the radius of the color light UP signal shown in the other photo.