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Nostalgia & History > SFZ on the Burlington


Date: 09/15/20 08:09
SFZ on the Burlington
Author: gcm

March 77
The San Francisco Zephyr is westbound just east of Denver on the BN (CB&Q) after its all night run from Chicago.
Looks like a buffer car ? after the engines.
A rescan.

Gary

 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/15/20 08:09 by gcm.




Date: 09/15/20 08:15
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: WAF

Yes, its a buffer car. The year is early 1977 and Amtrak did this to help with derailments of its locomotives



Date: 09/15/20 08:39
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: refarkas

Beautiful. They certainly placed the pole line perfectly.
Bob



Date: 09/15/20 08:58
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: dwatry

Lots of crazy angles going on in that photo!  Nice shot!



Date: 09/15/20 09:42
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: RodneyZona

Old BN RR McCook, NE based passenger train and engine crews worked to and from Denver.  Denver based engine crews worked to and from  Akron, CO.



Date: 09/15/20 09:50
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: dan

I-76 is brand new



Date: 09/15/20 11:37
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: trainjunkie

I rode the SFZ from Salt Lake City (connecting from the Desert Wind out of LA) all the way to Chicago in 1982. The ride was fantastic until we got on the BN. You could hardly eat in the diner wthout holding onto your dinner plate and coffee cup. The wait staff seemed amused at the scene but they were clerly used to it. It must have been their regular evening entertainment. Great experience though, I wouldn't trade it for the world. When I returned to LA from Chicago I went via the Southwest Limited on the Santa Fe. MUCH better ride.



Date: 09/15/20 12:12
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: PHall

trainjunkie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I rode the SFZ from Salt Lake City (connecting
> from the Desert Wind out of LA) all the way to
> Chicago in 1982. The ride was fantastic until we
> got on the BN. You could hardly eat in the diner
> wthout holding onto your dinner plate and coffee
> cup. The wait staff seemed amused at the scene but
> they were clerly used to it. It must have been
> their regular evening entertainment. Great
> experience though, I wouldn't trade it for the
> world. When I returned to LA from Chicago I went
> via the Southwest Limited on the Santa Fe. MUCH
> better ride.

And which railroad had problems with the SDP40F's?  Makes you wonder...



Date: 09/15/20 12:53
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: WAF

PHall Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> trainjunkie Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I rode the SFZ from Salt Lake City (connecting
> > from the Desert Wind out of LA) all the way to
> > Chicago in 1982. The ride was fantastic until
> we
> > got on the BN. You could hardly eat in the
> diner
> > wthout holding onto your dinner plate and
> coffee
> > cup. The wait staff seemed amused at the scene
> but
> > they were clerly used to it. It must have been
> > their regular evening entertainment. Great
> > experience though, I wouldn't trade it for the
> > world. When I returned to LA from Chicago I
> went
> > via the Southwest Limited on the Santa Fe. MUCH
> > better ride.
>
> And which railroad had problems with the
> SDP40F's?  Makes you wonder...

BN. SP followed with 50 MPH slow orders on curves greater than 3 degrees



Date: 09/15/20 13:47
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: Hou74-76

> And which railroad had problems with the
> SDP40F's?  Makes you wonder...

Gary, it is a great photo.  The landscape matches the consist, flat and rolling.

As to the railroad problems, yes it does make me wonder, was it really the track that affected those engines?  I know the few times I rode in the SD40PFs over the Santa Fe Southern Div. at speed (between Rosenberg & Cleburne) they felt like a cart full of lead on a roller coaster.  The engineers seemed nonplussed about it, perhaps because they had just gotten used to it.  But I wonder how much of the luck we had was just that - LUCK. And we always topped off the water tanks before the train left Houston.  After all the forensics about those derailments and design came out I still think, luck was factor.

Thanks for posting this.



Date: 09/15/20 16:17
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: WAF

It was said the water tanks were located at the top of the engine room that affected the balance of the locomotive on curves with water sloshing around. Certainly the type of truck they rode on was suspect as late model EMDs SD40-2 and SD45T-2 had these in common



Date: 09/15/20 17:33
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: HotWater

WAF Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It was said the water tanks were located at the
> top of the engine room that affected the balance
> of the locomotive on curves with water sloshing
> around.

Not true, as the auxiliary boiler water supply tank was mounted directly on the underframe, in the rear of the engine room. There were shut-off valves so that on those railroads not wanting the extra weight, the auxiliary boiler water supply tank (inside the engine room) would NOT fill when taking on water.

Certainly the type of truck they rode on
> was suspect as late model EMDs SD40-2 and SD45T-2
> had these in common

Just what would have been "suspect" with the HT-C 3 axle truck????

The whole problem eventually proved-out to be CRAPPY TRACK!!!   The Santa Fe NEVER had any issues with the SDP40F units, even at speeds to 100 MPH.



Date: 09/15/20 19:15
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: chakk

WAF Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, its a buffer car. The year is early 1977 and
> Amtrak did this to help with derailments of its
> locomotives

How does this car help prevent derailments?  Wouldn't the regular baggage car do the same?



Date: 09/15/20 19:23
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: WAF

That and the baggage and probably the dorm will come off and the rest stay on the track



Date: 09/15/20 19:30
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: UP951West

Gary, that's a classic slide !  Thanks for sharing. --Kelly



Date: 09/16/20 00:29
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: dan

UP and SF didn't have problems with the big brutes



Date: 09/17/20 00:40
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: Evan_Werkema

chakk Wrote:

> How does this car help prevent derailments? 
> Wouldn't the regular baggage car do the same?

One of the many theories advanced to explain the SDP40F-related derailments were unfavorable dynamic interactions between the final SDP40F and the well-worn "heritage" baggage car behind it on curves at speed, resulting in one or the other derailing.  The non-baggage "buffer car" weighed more than a baggage, and it was hoped that that would result in things staying on the tracks better.  There have been so many theories and "now the real story can be told..." articles about the SDP40F's over the years that, even if one root cause was finally identified, it will never be accepted as definitive.  The SDP40F's were derailed by a second shooter on the grassy knoll...



Date: 10/03/20 18:26
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: MEKoch

five coaches in March!!



Date: 10/03/20 18:59
Re: SFZ on the Burlington
Author: texchief1

Excellent shot, Gary!

RC Lundgren
Elgin, TX



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