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Canadian Railroads > c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question


Date: 06/07/19 05:48
c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: goneon66

out on the shushwap sub, what train symbols are most likely to be in excess of 10,000 feet with 2 sets of dpu's?

thanks for any info..........

66



Date: 06/07/19 10:11
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: mp35mountain

Not completely sure but on the Shuswap Sub only intermodals like #100/#101 to and from Toronto, #112/#113 to and from Montreal and #198/#199 to and from Bensenville would ever be that long.  Manifests like  #200/#201 to and from Edmonton and #400/#401 to and from Calgary might at times be that length but generally not.  Potash trains have 170 cars but still are less than 10,000'.

Tim 
mp35mountain



Date: 06/07/19 11:29
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: KickingHorse

198 - Deltaport to Bensenville is the most likely. It is regularly over 11,000 ft and has 5 locos in a 2+1+1+1 configuration. Normal transit of the Shuswap Sub s/b early morning.

The normal westbound Canpotex potash trains are indeed 170 cars with 4 locos (2+1+1) in the summer and 5 locos (2+2+1) in the winter. They are 8900-9000 ft. I watched one go by the other day that had 5 locos which surprised me for June. However, when it went by the scanner it reported 838 axles = 202 cars! Test run perhaps? The next one was the usual 704 axles.



Date: 06/07/19 13:43
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: spwolfmtn

I wonder how much shorter CP intermodal trains that primarily carry international/marine containers would be if CP used mostly the shorter/articulated 5 pack well cars (for 45 foot containers) on those trains and for that business and kept the longer well cars for 53 foot domestic containers (usually 3-paks) on domestic intermodal trains/business?

BNSF tries to do this with there intermodal operations, results in more containers for a given length of train.



Date: 06/07/19 14:08
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: KickingHorse

spwolfmtn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder how much shorter CP intermodal trains
> that primarily carry international/marine
> containers would be if CP used mostly the
> shorter/articulated 5 pack well cars (for 45 foot
> containers) on those trains and for that business
> and kept the longer well cars for 53 foot domestic
> containers (usually 3-paks) on domestic intermodal
> trains/business?
>
> BNSF tries to do this with there intermodal
> operations, results in more containers for a given
> length of train.

They already do. 198/199 has lots of 5-packs (no domestic containers on them). 5-packs are rare on 100/101 and 112/113 even though both pairs are mixes of domestic and marine. I don't think CP has access to very many 5-packs.
 



Date: 06/07/19 14:58
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: goneon66

thanks for the great info gents.  much appreciated........

66



Date: 06/07/19 20:54
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: spwolfmtn

KickingHorse Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> spwolfmtn Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I wonder how much shorter CP intermodal trains
> > that primarily carry international/marine
> > containers would be if CP used mostly the
> > shorter/articulated 5 pack well cars (for 45
> foot
> > containers) on those trains and for that
> business
> > and kept the longer well cars for 53 foot
> domestic
> > containers (usually 3-paks) on domestic
> intermodal
> > trains/business?
> >
> > BNSF tries to do this with there intermodal
> > operations, results in more containers for a
> given
> > length of train.
>
> They already do. 198/199 has lots of 5-packs (no
> domestic containers on them). 5-packs are rare on
> 100/101 and 112/113 even though both pairs are
> mixes of domestic and marine. I don't think CP has
> access to very many 5-packs.

It's not the number of wells that I'm talking about but the sizes of the wells.  On the Revelstoke camera, I see a lot of well cars that fit 53 foot domestic containers loaded with 45 foot marine containers - you can see a lot of wasted space there, which added together for the length of a train, can add to a lot of extra footage.  I also see quite a bit of empty 45 foot wells because CP has to put a 45 foot marine container in the well, then a 53 foot domestic on top, then the can't put anything in the wells on each side of that well because the domestic container hangs over them.  If a train has fifty 53 foot wells with 45 foot marine containers in them, that's 400 feet of extra train length - might be the difference in fitting into many of those sidings for meets.

If CP kept more of its domestic and international (marine) business seperate (note, doesn't necessarily mean seperate trains) and with their associated cars, they would get better car and train footage utilization.  Look at some BNSF container trains on the web cameras, they are usually pretty solid with little space in between the double stacked container.  Since BNSF is still more than willing to accept customers TOFC trailers, their domestic intermodal trains don't tend to have that "solid" look to them.



Date: 06/08/19 07:50
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: inCHI

KickingHorse Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 198 - Deltaport to Bensenville is the most likely.
> It is regularly over 11,000 ft and has 5 locos in
> a 2+1+1+1 configuration. Normal transit of the
> Shuswap Sub s/b early morning.

There are 3 sets of DPU's on it? When I see it coming near Bensenville it is usually 2+1 or 1+1, same for 199, but still commonly 10k. Is there a big block that gets set off in Canada somewhere along the way?



Date: 06/08/19 15:29
Re: c.p. shushwap sub 10K' question
Author: KickingHorse

Maybe some come off in Calgary but the more important factor is the mountains. The ruling grade for the westward loaded unit bulk trains (grain, coal, potash, sulphur) is 1%. Westbound intermodals like 199 are mostly empty containers so they don't need extra power added.

The ruling grade for eastbounds is 2.2%. The unit bulk trains are empties so no big deal. However the eastbound intermodals, especially the ones with mostly matine containers, are loaded and need extra power. It's mostly downhill from Calgary to Chicago so the excess power can come off in Calgary or Moose Jaw.



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