European Railroad Discussion > Quiz 2: Where is it?

What is it and where?

Most of you will say "oh yes, I would have known that" once you hear what this is...so give a guess! Let your imagination fly!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/11/14 04:13 by McKey.

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Let's put this the other way: what do you see here?

I think this might actually be an easy one, so give a guess and tell what you see in the picture!

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Let's zoom out a bit more...

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It's on the nosecone of a Eurostar.

Tor in the USA

Excellent work Tor! That is what it is.

Below the unit 3208 is under the famous Parisian train shed of Gare du Nord in France. Looks like someone managed to tag this iron horse with unicorn sticker!

Picture by Ilpo Ruissalo.

Torisgod Wrote:
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> It's on the nosecone of a Eurostar.
>
> Tor in the USA



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/11/14 07:58 by McKey.

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Not only tagged with a unicorn sticker, but apparently a bird as well.

Brian Ehni

Oh, that, it is unfortunate, and it happens occasionally...

twin_star_rocket Wrote:
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> Not only tagged with a unicorn sticker, but
> apparently a bird as well.
>
> Brian Ehni

Ha! I would not have guessed that even though my dad and I rode the Eurostar plus saw them whist waiting to ride East Midlands Trains before that. Eurostar has to be one of the most well known trains in the World. A number of people asked me if we were going to ride it last year, people that did not seam that Worldly in any way and who probably only rarely even get out of the state would ask. The idea of crossing under the Channel is intriguing to many.

Jim

Yes, say that! This whole Eurostar + Eurotunnel concept along with French world famous high speed network is very "media friendly", so I counted too that most people recognize the nose shape, at least from the third picture :)

And since some of these trains are now going to be scrapped, it was time to take a look at the famous curves of this EMU once more.

tq-07fan Wrote:
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> Ha! I would not have guessed that even though my
> dad and I rode the Eurostar plus saw them whist
> waiting to ride East Midlands Trains before that.
> Eurostar has to be one of the most well known
> trains in the World. A number of people asked me
> if we were going to ride it last year, people that
> did not seam that Worldly in any way and who
> probably only rarely even get out of the state
> would ask. The idea of crossing under the Channel
> is intriguing to many.
>
> Jim

SCRAPPED THIS SOON? How old are they?

Brian Ehni

They were built already in 1992-93.

Here is a lot more to the subject: http://www.4rail.net/fast_tgv1.php

Main page: http://www.4rail.net/fast_main.php

twin_star_rocket Wrote:
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> SCRAPPED THIS SOON? How old are they?
>
> Brian Ehni


I think the question is of efficiency:
- New units have much more room to the same space than the current ones, meaning they simply are more profitable. However I wonder how they go with the French access charges that are metering the axles rolling over certain points. Previous generation had coaches sharing bogies, the new ones don't, but as long as no one has done axle counting there is no telling how many axles there are under the new Velaro-UKs / Eurostar e320s.
- TMST-Eurostars never were NOT the reliability kings, this alone is a good reason for high speed train withdrawal.
- Newer units are (mostly) much less cramped, older Eurostars were built to British loading gauges. However, British High Speed 1 line now allows using "continental gauge" meaning normal rolling stock with some more room inside.

Not every train will be scrapped yet, but I doubt we will see many on the current main route London - Paris in one years time any more. Also the units running inside France have been scrapped or withdrawn. The lowest picture shows one of these, this unit has been spotted at Gare du Nord both in 2012 (in picture) and again in 2014, so it might still be there.

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The Eurostar trainsets due to be scrapped are the "North of London" sets. There isn't going to be Eurostar service to cities north of London and these sets have fewer cars and lower capacity, but still take up a valuable train path. Mostly they have been leased to SNCF for French domestic services, but now, even in France the train paths are too valuable in many areas for their low capacity.

If I read right this 3225 along with its 9 coaches are part of the endangered species. But, as we know French and exact information rarely go together in one sentence :(

3225 is one of the Capital units and has been running between Lille and Paris in France for years, along with 2 other Capital units.

Any whereabouts on TMST-NOL units you are talking about?

SOO6617 Wrote:
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> The Eurostar trainsets due to be scrapped are the
> "North of London" sets. There isn't going to be
> Eurostar service to cities north of London and
> these sets have fewer cars and lower capacity, but
> still take up a valuable train path. Mostly they
> have been leased to SNCF for French domestic
> services, but now, even in France the train paths
> are too valuable in many areas for their low
> capacity.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/12/14 10:27 by McKey.

If that is the case I would think they could find secondary lives joined together on other lines with longer platforms.

Jim

They might, the length (393 meters) is just that of the double TGV unit, which is almost always 2 x 200,2 meters. All platforms in any more developed network are at least this length. But it also looks like the most probable train operator candidates, except for the Deutshe Bahn) are saturated with super high speed trains for the moment. And DB likes German built trains so something second hand that was built by Alstom in France might sound bad to them. I think we could ask: have they ever bought anything second hand? They certainly would have the volumes to fill these huge trains.

One argument that makes resale unlikely is that the great length of the train makes it very costly to run when there are smaller amounts of travelers aboard. For example north of Paris the units are sometimes used with the other half closed down. But since the access charges for track usage are paid for axles, the train still pays for the same amount despite it being mostly empty. Very unprofitable...

You might think these were otherwise totally plausible units for Belgium and Netherlands to replace the Ansaldo-Breda V250 trains that left the operators without any high speed rolling stock.

Let's keep our thumbs up for resale to second hand user or secondary use by Eurostar. Their lower reliability (94% against 99% on normal TGV) should be easy to fix, even if the Eurostar strangely never bothered to install proper insulation against flying snow to them. For other reasons besides snow, I have no information so maybe some open minded British member of trainorders would have more info?


tq-07fan Wrote:
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> If that is the case I would think they could find
> secondary lives joined together on other lines
> with longer platforms.
>
> Jim

Below a Channel tunnel unit (Eurostar-Capitals) is seen in Lille, France.

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