Eastern Railroad Discussion > Hunt's Point Market (NYC) to get improved rail access

Hunt's Point Market in NYC is getting its rail spurs rebuilt, and a new rail unloading facility. This should result in more reefer and carload food shipments from various U.S. points.

http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/20150205/hunts-point/hunts-point-produce-market-getting-22-million-rail-improvements

22 million dollars ... whole lotta money to be spenf to increase freight from 6 cars a day ...

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Out_Of_Service Wrote:
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> 22 million dollars ... whole lotta money to be
> spenf to increase freight from 6 cars a day ...
>
> Posted from Android


It's not just for rail. And if you consider the statistic that rail accounts for 6 percent of the inbound shipments, that means that trucks bring in the equivalent of 94 carloads a day. Wouldn't it be wonderful if rail got a greater share? Certainly would take a lot of trucks off the streets of the South Bronx, and the freeways that lead to them.

I just have to comment on this. It would take some research of my personal files but back in the 1980s when I worked for 'Big Blue'. I do think it was when I was still on the transportation side of things rather than marketing. Because of favoritism I usually got the projects that were already pre-determined to fail rather than succeed. One of these came from an outside consultant that had the idea to run perishable Roadrailer trains from Florida thru the ex-PRR already then AMTK's New York City tunnels and over Hell Gate Bridge direct to the ex-New Haven's Oak Point yard. There the trains would be split up and taken to Hunt's Point terminal. The concept was not that absurd from the standpoint that Roadrailers would fit thru the tight clearances of AMTKs tunnels providing a direct route from Florida to Hunts Point. By this time all other rail service from the south to Hunts Point was already routed from the New Jersey side of the Hudson River 145 miles north to Selkirk then back down the other side of the Hudson River to New York City, adding 300 miles of circuity. Poughkeepsie Bridge and car float service were long gone.

This required a trip to Oak Point yard and Hunts Point. Once at the yard office there it was arranged to have a switcher and a caboose for the trip to Hunt's Point. To get there the switcher goes a mile north toward New Haven alongside what is now the NEC, then there is a switch and a backup move down a trash infested branch 3/4 mile to get into the Hunts Point Terminal complex thru the worst parts of the Bronx. I took pictures of it. The complex is huge. Back then CR was still doing 30 cars a day or so. But the issue was that each produce broker had certain sections of the docks and reefer cars unload from the side and trucks from the rear. So it was and still is a zig/zag of trucks blocking RR tracks. When it was built in the fifties almost all produce arrived by rail direct via NYC and by floats from all the other NY area railroads.

One of the advantages of the Roadrailer plan was that the RR train could be broken up just outside the building area and moved by jockey trucks anywhere in the complex. I think I even have a RR map of the place. I pushed the concept as far as I could, but it ultimately failed when we started to run costs and consulted with AMTK. Of course they had to put an electric loco on the train in New Jersey for the tunnels and they wanted so much money for that it killed the economics. Also, the Roadrailers had to be 'backed up' in several places and there were questions about that. I don't know if I have that project in my files or not.

So look at Google Earth today and see what Hunts Point looks like. I see the east end has about 80 CH's of product at a transload terminal. Then you can see less than 20 reefer cars scattered in the terminal; one even looks like a 'half car'! re they scrapping them there? I agree it seems like a lot of money, and if they could just assign the north end of the terminal docks for rail service seem to me simple. Seems to me most reefers would unload into tracks anyway so that can be done in the open. It would also be interesting to know how many of the 'trucks' at the terminal actually came by rail on CSX and NS to terminals across the Hudson River as there are a lot of reefer trailers on New Jersey bound trains from the west and a few I see on CSX from the south. Oak Point yard is devoted to trash trains now.

It is amazing that New York City with its opera and plays and art museums is actually fed thru the mess at Hunt's Point. Most New Yorkers do not see or even know that!

I don't know its current state, but New York legend is that Hunts Point also was one of the most crime-ridden spots in the city: organized crime. If you didn't pay your fees, the wiseguys made sure your perishables perished.

And if some of the New Haven Line trains go into Penn Station in the future, Hunts Point is supposed to be one of the stops in the east Bronx. Anybody have a quick idea how many people are employed at Hunts Point?

Hunt's Point cannot be a stop if Commuter trains go into Penn Station, as my description says it is on a spur off the main line, but only about 1/2 mile due east. The stop would have to be at or near Oak Point yard, but all that area is in a cut with many bridges overhead, might be hard to plan or build. As for a high crime area; would not surprise me a bit, then or now. Almost all the railcars at Hunts Point are the Waste management trash cars and other re-cyclables, But Google shows more locos there in the yard than i remember Conrail having.

Yes, the market itself is on a spur off Amtrak's Hellgate Line, but there is a neighborhood in the East Bronx that is called Hunts Point. I'm just relaying what I read some where else. Personally, I can't see people getting on and off to go to work at the Hunt's Point market, but IIRC, that's why the stop would be there.
It's part of the East Side Access Plan, if that ever gets finished!!

Thanks for the correction. I hope that area does see improvement and better access for all involved. Commuter rail access has been known to improve the economic well being of the communities involved and having been there years ago I hope it happens here too.