Eastern Railroad Discussion > VW Chattanooga workers vote in unionization

Third time is the charm, I guess:

UAW wins big in historic union vote at Volkswagen Tennessee factory | Reuters

Governor Bill Lee (TN) and Governor Brian Kemp (GA) warned workers last week that they risk killing their own jobs if they vote in unions to represent them in auto or energy firms. Keeping workers in line is a key part of the southern economic miracle.

I guess the membership heard that, and saw the 40%-45% contracts at GM, Ford, Stellantis, etc and made up their own minds.   There's an upcoming election at Mercedes in Alabama which is being closely watched.

Are working conditions so awful that they felt their only resolution was to vote in the union to enforce PTO earned and overtime rules - or other labor laws?   Or was it solely based on the thought that they could make so much more money before the plant is moved elsewhere that it would be better for them?

Honest question - since unionization in recent decades seem to have accelerated outsourcing factories to other countries - leaving almost everyone without a job.  

People seem to not understand that the lower cost of labor is what won these factories at their rural or southern locations in the first place.  

P Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> People seem to not understand that the lower cost
> of labor is what won these factories at their
> rural or southern locations in the first
> place.  

Well, if we go back to the slave system then everybody will have a job, and live onsite in worse than 3rd world conditions. Companies would love that...

Some things in the union's favor that likely contributed to a win at VW:

1) Large UAW gains at the Big Three, leaving the foreign transplants behind the curve.
2) Automaking is not easily outsourced, esp. overseas, which is precisely why the Asian carmakers and others all decided to assemble here.
3) VW is largely unionized, esp. in Europe, and they're not as vehemently opposed to unions.
4) The southern assembly complexes are "campuses," meaning they're newer and with many integrated operations and suppliers onsite or next door. These aren't moving anytime soon.
5) Unions have problems, but they have lost ground because of the giant forces working against them and the fact that too many workers are stupidly intimidated into falling in line, which has started to result in a labor revolt of sorts against wildly profitable taskmaskers that are reveling in constantly improving profits while extracting more and more from labor in the process. Many more people have had enough of the rigged system and seek reasonable relief.

While you may agree with this or not, one thing about certain industries like carmaking (and booze, groceries and cigarettes), people will always buy cars and need skilled workers to make them. Labor does have more power in certain industries. Rail labor could probably learn a few things from the recent UAW stance...

JG



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/23/24 10:09 by jgilmore.

jgilmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some things in the union's favor that likely
> contributed to a win at VW:

Good summary. How overwhelming the vote was is interesting.

I don't think that political conservatism has changed with the southern worker, but perhaps the view on large corporations has.
 

The VW workers turned down the union twice before. I've read summaries which suggest the 40%-45% pay boosts were a big factor. But, so was a tougher management approach.

Many younger workers are not standing for the management nonsense. Grad students, medical interns, Starbucks and Amazon workers, there are a lot of folks pushing back.

Posted from Android

Let's see what happens with MB. Traditionally, Alabama has the highest industrial union membership in the South -- especially in the northern half of the state where the steel, aluminum, and mining industries have a strong union legacy. The UAW says over 30% of workers at the Hyundai plant in Montgomery have signed cards. It could be next, if workers unite at MB.
 

I don't hold out much hope for this plant, and I live in Chattanooga. It's future is heavily vested in EVs and I don't have to point anyone to statistics on demand for those. I didn't have a good feeling about the place even before the UAW vote. I'm even less optimistic now.

 

ShortlinesUSA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't hold out much hope for this plant, and I
> live in Chattanooga. It's future is heavily vested
> in EVs and I don't have to point anyone to
> statistics on demand for those. I didn't have a
> good feeling about the place even before the UAW
> vote. I'm even less optimistic now.

Thanks for saying that. I was thinking that, too. 

In my state of Georgia, a lot of public money has been spent bringing EV related industries to the state. 

To me, it looks like a big time bust coming.
 

jgilmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> P Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > People seem to not understand that the lower
> cost
> > of labor is what won these factories at their
> > rural or southern locations in the first
> > place.  
>
> Well, if we go back to the slave system then
> everybody will have a job, and live onsite in
> worse than 3rd world conditions. Companies would
> love that...
>
> Some things in the union's favor that likely
> contributed to a win at VW:
>
> 1) Large UAW gains at the Big Three, leaving the
> foreign transplants behind the curve.
> 2) Automaking is not easily outsourced, esp.
> overseas, which is precisely why the Asian
> carmakers and others all decided to assemble
> here.
> 3) VW is largely unionized, esp. in Europe, and
> they're not as vehemently opposed to unions.
> 4) The southern assembly complexes are "campuses,"
> meaning they're newer and with many integrated
> operations and suppliers onsite or next door.
> These aren't moving anytime soon.
> 5) Unions have problems, but they have lost ground
> because of the giant forces working against them
> and the fact that too many workers are stupidly
> intimidated into falling in line, which has
> started to result in a labor revolt of sorts
> against wildly profitable taskmaskers that are
> reveling in constantly improving profits while
> extracting more and more from labor in the
> process. Many more people have had enough of the
> rigged system and seek reasonable relief.
>
> While you may agree with this or not, one thing
> about certain industries like carmaking (and
> booze, groceries and cigarettes), people will
> always buy cars and need skilled workers to make
> them. Labor does have more power in certain
> industries. Rail labor could probably learn a few
> things from the recent UAW stance...
>
> JG

Fake news…. Your opinion and statement “automaking” is not easily outsourced is just flat out false. The overwhelming vast majority of parts and components to assemble an automobile in the United States is indeed outsourced.

Someplace soon in Mexico will probably become the next or what was Detriot to the automotive industry.

Posted from iPhone

Comment was made during one of the discussions on the outcome that VW is running that plant on pretty thin margains so
it doesn't take much of a stretch to consider what might be the final outcome. There's a divide between what the workers think
their jobs are worth and the actual value to the manufacturer. Sure they make cars but at a loss it doesn't matter how well good
or otherwise that their work might be.

Out 

Outsourcing in the auto industry is difficult?  Please.  Buick now sources every vehicle except one from Asia.  Buick - the original brand of GM is now largely a collection of Asian sourced vehicles.  

VW has tried not to sway employee's in either direction.  However, that being said, it's plant in Pueblo, MX is far more critical to the North American market.  And as they demonstrated at New Stanton, PA in the mid 1980's, they aren't afraid to pull the plug on an investment that is not creating favorable returns.

Interesting to read how certain parts of the country are incentivizing EV makers to locate in their states.  I've been reading almost daily how EV sales continue to decrease, and today I see where Tesla, after dropping some prices by as much as 50%, will be laying off 6,000 workers in Calif and Texas.  Also, how Ford's CFO told an investor-conference that they will slow 2 major EV programs until they can stand on their own to show a profit.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/tesla-layoffs-company-plans-to-cut-nearly-2700-workers-at-austin-texas-factory/ar-AA1nwV5K

66

Georgia has invested a lot of taxpayer money in electric battery plants. Mr Kemp is right to be concerned about the future.

Posted from Android

P Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Are working conditions so awful that they felt
> their only resolution was to vote in the union to
> enforce PTO earned and overtime rules - or other
> labor laws?   Or was it solely based on the
> thought that they could make so much more money
> before the plant is moved elsewhere that it would
> be better for them?
>
> Honest question - since unionization in recent
> decades seem to have accelerated outsourcing
> factories to other countries - leaving almost
> everyone without a job.  
>


Was it unionization or corporate greed?

I suppose the exploitation of labor is extremely American, but I applaud these workers for pushing to get their share.

portlander Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I suppose the exploitation of labor is extremely
> American...

You're kidding, right?

Yah like Australia where the workers got their share and GM and Ford were unable to build cars at
a profit so they exited the market. Instead of well paid Aussie built cars you now have Asian imports.
I'm all for people getting paid the full value of the work they provide but that number has to be 
understood by both parties.

Out 

JOHNY5ALIVE Wrote:

> Fake news…. Your opinion and statement
> “automaking” is not easily outsourced is just
> flat out false. The overwhelming vast majority of
> parts and components to assemble an automobile in
> the United States is indeed outsourced.

Nice zinger, at least you're good at holding a grudge. I'm speechless...

Of course, if folks read more carefully they can see that I never mentioned parts making cannot be outsourced, only assembly, and even assembly is not outsourced overseas, which is what I originally stated. "Automaking" only occurs when the parts are put together and Mexico and Canada are not overseas, but people see what they want on here anyway...

EV was clearly being adopted too quickly, made much easier by the free government money. Even at a slower pace, with the billions already spent in places like Chattanooga, they will not be going away anytime soon. Too much push from too many governments and entities besides the big money already spent. Your worldview may be different...

JG

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Governor Bill Lee (TN) and Governor Brian Kemp
> (GA) warned workers last week that they risk
> killing their own jobs if they vote in unions to
> represent them in auto or energy firms. Keeping
> workers in line is a key part of the southern
> economic miracle.
>
> I guess the membership heard that, and saw the
> 40%-45% contracts at GM, Ford, Stellantis, etc and
> made up their own minds.   There's an upcoming
> election at Mercedes in Alabama which is being
> closely watched.

Interesting how state Governor’s are interjecting themselves into how labor should act like good little peons for their owners… I mean employers.

Hmmmm… sounds like Plutocracy (or is it corporatism?) to me. Isn’t that illegal in the good ol’ USA? 🧐

Governments should be afraid of their citizens, not the other way around.

Regards

Posted from iPhone