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Eastern Railroad Discussion > What things require signals?Date: 02/02/25 07:39 What things require signals? Author: dadonatrain Newbie here. No idea how things work but I like to learn.
What configurations or physical situations require signals? I’m at MP 510 on the NS Greenville District, in Central, SC, looking east which is NB for the railroad. It’s two tracks. There are signals facing NB and also SB on the same tower. I have openrailwaymap in front of me and I don’t understand why those SB facing signals would be required at this point. There is an end of two track NB at MP 508 and signals there in both directions. There’s an end of two track SB two miles the other direction from me but I can’t see that. I can only assume that point would have the proper signals. Just ahead of where I am NB there is a siding into a mfg plant, so maybe the pair of NB signals I see at MP510 are for that. But there’s nothing at all SB till MP508 so why would there need to be signals facing SB where I am? I know it’s impossible for anyone reading this to explain the exact location I’m at, but my question in general is: if there’s nothing but uninterrupted tracks ahead for a couple miles , why would there be signals at all? Posted from iPhone Date: 02/02/25 07:54 Re: What things require signals? Author: engineerinvirginia Signals without a switch or other appliance are an intermediate signal...it simply creates a block wherein a trains movement can be governed and several trains can maintain safe separation.
Date: 02/02/25 08:35 Re: What things require signals? Author: halfmoonharold The train crew needs advance notice of what is going to happen at the ends of double track you mentioned. They can't be rolling along at maximum speed and suddenly stop if they are not lined off the double. This is in addition to the concept of subdividing the block into smaller sections. Signals with a number plate on them are intermediate or automatic block signals. Signals at control points do not have number plates. There is usually a sign with the name of the CP.
Date: 02/02/25 09:18 Re: What things require signals? Author: ctillnc In addition to traffic management, signals contribute to safety. An open switch, a car that has rolled free onto the main track, a broken rail (sometimes), etc can cause a signal governing entry into a block to indicate stop.
Date: 02/02/25 11:25 Re: What things require signals? Author: dadonatrain Thank you, all! Once again, I ask a Q and I know I’ll get several smart answers! Thanks for helping me learn.
Posted from iPhone Date: 02/02/25 11:29 Re: What things require signals? Author: Notch7 The SOU South Charlotte District is where you are at. I believe it was the first of the four SOU Eastern Lines districts to be converted from double track automatic block to CTC around maybe 1959. The signals and their placement and the trackage do not necessarily have to make any sense. Oldheads told me all that was solely decided by Exec VP/later President D. W. Brosnan. He ruled the SOU for years and his decisions were not to be questioned. My district, the North Charlotte,was the last to be converted in 1964; and parts of it retain Brosnan's unquestionable design to this day. Any design variations were later covered by timetable special instructions.
If I get time later, I'll pull out the division profile book and check out the situation where you are. Maybe one of the guys here on TO that run the South Charlotte District will comment. Posted from Android Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/02/25 11:32 by Notch7. Date: 02/02/25 12:09 Re: What things require signals? Author: ctillnc Date: 02/02/25 18:53 Re: What things require signals? Author: Notch7 Dadonatrain, the double track segment you are talking about extends from Johnson on the north end (MP 508) to Rowland on the south end (MP 511.9). The intermediate signals on each mainline to each control point are around MP 510 in Central. Many of these intermediate signals did not have names until we began calling signals on the radio. The interdivisional intermodal engineer I was able to get on the phone said the intermediate signals at Central are referred to as "Central". These intermediates indicate block occupancy and potentially whether the dispatcher is ready for you at Johnson or Rowland.
Posted from Android Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/03/25 23:30 by Notch7. Date: 02/02/25 19:24 Re: What things require signals? Author: OHRY engineerinvirginia Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > Signals without a switch or other appliance are an > intermediate signal...it simply creates a block > wherein a trains movement can be governed and > several trains can maintain safe separation. Not necessarily, there are some control points that are just for holding trains. CP Wall in the NS Harrisburg line is just that. Holding signals going east only. The opposing westbound signals are automatics. Posted from Android Date: 02/03/25 06:08 Re: What things require signals? Author: dadonatrain Notch7, that’s a perfect answer! Thank you.
Posted from iPhone Date: 02/03/25 06:48 Re: What things require signals? Author: engineerinvirginia OHRY Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > engineerinvirginia Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Signals without a switch or other appliance are > an > > intermediate signal...it simply creates a block > > wherein a trains movement can be governed and > > several trains can maintain safe separation. > > > Not necessarily, there are some control points > that are just for holding trains. CP Wall in the > NS Harrisburg line is just that. Holding signals > going east only. The opposing westbound signals > are automatics. > > Posted from Android Yes that's true....in many places too they might be left over from a time when a switch or crossover existed but was removed and the signal left as is...but Hold Out is the usual thing. |