Model Railroading > Southern Pacific PFE Reefers

I just join here in the last day , I am looking for detail shots of SP PFE reefer cars from 1968 to 1985 . I need to know how air brake system was setup on SP reefers. 1968-1985 .
any photos would be great . I am detailing out few PFE cars with Details west parts , Part CC-1025 and Bs-1020 . I got new couplers Cushion pockets with kadee on both sides of these cars. I was hoping I could get some shot of someone model with all the pipes and rods for the brake system on SP PFE reefers .


Steven Presnal
Los Osos, Ca

Intermountain and Red Caboose both produced excellent models of PFE cars in recent years, and I bought several for what I consider to be good prices ($20~$25). These cars are fully detailed including the brake rigging and had etch metal screens with even a reefer engine. Sure beats the heck out of trying to upgrade older Athearn cars. Athearn Genesis produced a great model of a FGE reefer that even had a sound option.

Ted Curphey
Ontario, OR

Try this:

http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/spcars/byclass/reefer/index.htm

Great place!

Gary

Until 4/1/78 it was simply PFE, which was owned equally by SP & UP. On that date it was dissolved equally, becoming SPFE and UPFE.

Steven,

The following topic here has a good deal of nice photos which may be of some help:

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?11,2669368,page=1


Geodyssey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Until 4/1/78 it was simply PFE, which was owned
> equally by SP & UP. On that date it was dissolved
> equally, becoming SPFE and UPFE.

Reefers were marked SPFE years earlier however. I've seen a photo dated as early as 1974 with a reefer marked SPFE in the white letters over the white letter road number. There is a discussion in the link below where it is stated some R-70 reefers were marked SPFE and UPFE as early as 1973. I believe 1978 was more of a finalization of something that was already going on. Starting in 1978 the "Perishable" badge decals were placed over the UP herald on many of the SPFE reefers.

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2708725,3179780#msg-3179780

Cheers, Jim



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/16/14 05:27 by SPDRGWfan.

SPDRGWfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steven,
>
> The following topic here has a good deal of nice
> photos which may be of some help:
>
> http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?11,
> 2669368,page=1
>
>
> Geodyssey Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Until 4/1/78 it was simply PFE, which was owned
> > equally by SP & UP. On that date it was
> dissolved
> > equally, becoming SPFE and UPFE.
>
> Reefers were marked SPFE years earlier however.
> I've seen a photo dated as early as 1974 with a
> reefer marked SPFE in the white letters over the
> white letter road number. There is a discussion
> in the link below where it is stated some R-70
> reefers were marked SPFE and UPFE as early as
> 1973. I believe 1978 was more of a finalization
> of something that was already going on. Starting
> in 1978 the "Perishable" badge decals were placed
> over the UP herald on many of the SPFE reefers.
>
> http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2
> 708725,3179780#msg-3179780
>
> Cheers, Jim


Thanks for that link, Jim. Rob Leachman (Ex-UPRR management) is correct, and I need to dig out my Thompson, Church, & Jones "Pacific Fruit Express" book for more detail.

Geodyssey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SPDRGWfan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Steven,
> >
> > The following topic here has a good deal of
> nice
> > photos which may be of some help:
> >
> >
> http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?11,
>
> > 2669368,page=1
> >
> >
> > Geodyssey Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Until 4/1/78 it was simply PFE, which was
> owned
> > > equally by SP & UP. On that date it was
> > dissolved
> > > equally, becoming SPFE and UPFE.
> >
> > Reefers were marked SPFE years earlier however.
>
> > I've seen a photo dated as early as 1974 with a
> > reefer marked SPFE in the white letters over
> the
> > white letter road number. There is a
> discussion
> > in the link below where it is stated some R-70
> > reefers were marked SPFE and UPFE as early as
> > 1973. I believe 1978 was more of a
> finalization
> > of something that was already going on.
> Starting
> > in 1978 the "Perishable" badge decals were
> placed
> > over the UP herald on many of the SPFE reefers.
> >
> >
> http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2
>
> > 708725,3179780#msg-3179780
> >
> > Cheers, Jim
>
>
> Thanks for that link, Jim. Rob Leachman (Ex-UPRR
> management) is correct, and I need to dig out my
> Thompson, Church, & Jones "Pacific Fruit Express"
> book for more detail.


His book doesn't go beyond the breakup of PFE

Are there any books which cover the PFE fleet usage after the 1978 break up?

I need to invest in that PFE book although my main interest is from around 1970 and later.

Cheers, Jim Fitch

SPDRGWfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Are there any books which cover the PFE fleet
> usage after the 1978 break up?
>
> I need to invest in that PFE book although my main
> interest is from around 1970 and later.
>
> Cheers, Jim Fitch


Rob Leachman's article in UPHS magazine is the best coverage I have seen. The PFE book has pictures after 1978, but no text after 1978

WAF Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> SPDRGWfan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Are there any books which cover the PFE fleet
> > usage after the 1978 break up?
> >
> > I need to invest in that PFE book although my
> main
> > interest is from around 1970 and later.
> >
> > Cheers, Jim Fitch
>

> Rob Leachman's article in UPHS magazine is the
> best coverage I have seen. The PFE book has
> pictures after 1978, but no text after 1978.

Was Dr. Leachman's article spread over two issues? Do you have the issue number/date? He does great work, including photography.

Geodyssey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> WAF Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > SPDRGWfan Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > Are there any books which cover the PFE fleet
> > > usage after the 1978 break up?
> > >
> > > I need to invest in that PFE book although my
> > main
> > > interest is from around 1970 and later.
> > >
> > > Cheers, Jim Fitch
> >
>
> > Rob Leachman's article in UPHS magazine is the
> > best coverage I have seen. The PFE book has
> > pictures after 1978, but no text after 1978.
>
> Was Dr. Leachman's article spread over two issues?
> Do you have the issue number/date? He does great
> work, including photography.
Two parts Vol 26, part 2 and 3. Anything Rob writes is well researched. No disappointment on this

Guys , all of these Photos are great , but I am looking for Photos of the under frame with air bake system with all the rods and tubes . was the PFE cars brake system , like any other reefer car ??

if you guys did any model reefer car with AB brake system , please post them here ,

I hope this clear things up :)


Steven Presnal
Los Osos, Ca

It's clear. I don't think I've ever seen a photo of the underside of one but you never know.

Thanks, guys.

To follow up on one point: PFE went into negative cash flow starting about 1962 (i.e., the revenues from protective service surcharges became less than PFE's costs), so the railroads (UP & SP) bought all the PFE reefers after 1963 in order to utilize the investment tax credit. Beginning in 1971, the ownership of the two roads was reflected in changing the reporting marks on the reefers from "PFE" to "UPFE" and "SPFE". These reporting marks were a precursor to when PFE was split up in 1978.

Best regards,

Rob L.

rob_l Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks, guys.
>
> To follow up on one point: PFE went into negative
> cash flow starting about 1962 (i.e., the revenues
> from protective service surcharges became less
> than PFE's costs), so the railroads (UP & SP)
> bought all the PFE reefers after 1963 in order to
> utilize the investment tax credit. Beginning in
> 1971, the ownership of the two roads was reflected
> in changing the reporting marks on the reefers
> from "PFE" to "UPFE" and "SPFE". These reporting
> marks were a precursor to when PFE was split up in
> 1978.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob L.


Hi Rob,

Thanks for that info. I didn't realize that PFE went upside-down as early as 1962. Did revenues ever exceed expenses after that? Also, do you know what month in 1971 that cars started getting the UPFE / SPFE marks?

Thanks,
Robert Simpson
(also former-UPRR)

Geodyssey Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Hi Rob,
>
> Thanks for that info. I didn't realize that PFE
> went upside-down as early as 1962. Did revenues
> ever exceed expenses after that?

No. But this is just PFE profitability, which was more or less funny money. PFE was only getting paid according to the tariffs for protective service surcharges, and the railroads were pocketing the rest of the revenue.

> Also, do you
> know what month in 1971 that cars started getting
> the UPFE / SPFE marks?
>

I don't. But I think the remarking was a drawn-out gradual process, probably not finished for a year or two.

Best regards,

Rob L.

rob_l Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Geodyssey Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > Also, do you
> > know what month in 1971 that cars started
> getting
> > the UPFE / SPFE marks?
> >
>
> I don't. But I think the remarking was a drawn-out
> gradual process, probably not finished for a year
> or two.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Rob L.

Thanks, Rob.

Hi Rob - Not to take this too far off topic, but are there any articles, or maybe e-books, on the later UPFE fleet? I'm modeling an industry that received UPFE cars in the '90s and am interested in learning more about the roster and different classes and any rebuilds. I'm guessing your UPHS article would be a good starting point, but I'm not sure how much the UPFE changed after the timeframe it covers. Thanks!

Dave



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/18/14 10:23 by drolsen.

drolsen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Rob - Not to take this too far off topic, but
> are there any articles, or maybe e-books, on the
> later UPFE fleet? I'm modeling an industry that
> received UPFE cars in the '90s and am interested
> in learning more about the roster and different
> classes and any rebuilds. I'm guessing your UPHS
> article would be a good starting point, but I'm
> not sure how much the UPFE changed after the
> timeframe it covers. Thanks!
>

Dave,

I'm not an equipment expert and I have not paid attention to what literature there may be about the car fleet, so I'm not the right person to ask. Maybe Tony Thompson or other experts on the list will know and respond to your query.

Best regards,

Rob L.

Lot of photos, but not much meat