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Model Railroading > More info behind Canstock cars


Date: 06/15/11 15:28
More info behind Canstock cars
Author: funnelfan

To understand the canstock cars, you need to understand the history behind tin cans used in canning. Prior to the widespread use of plastics in packaging, canning food was a common form of packaging. At the time there was number of can producing companies that would receive flat sheets of metal in boxcars. The can companies would punch lids and sides from the metal sheets in a variety of shapes and sizes. The cans (minus one lid) and lids would be delivered locally by truck to canning customers. In the 50's and 60's the canneries and can companies retooled in size moving into much larger buildings to take advantage of economies of scale. At the time the can companies were still receiving sheet metal on pallets in boxcars, so built their docks for boxcars. in the 60's the advantages of coiled steel swept through the canning industry. But since the docks didn't have a crane to lift coils out of gons, the coils were still delivered in boxcars and moved around by forklift much like the sheet metal. The B&O canstock cars were designed to increase the number of coils that could be hauled in each car. That lasted up until the late 80's early 90's when further innovation allowed for the cans to be made as part of the canning line. These days lids and narrow coils of steel are sent to the canneries mostly by truck, and most of the can companies have gone away. The canstock cars are still around, but not with the demand that they used to have.

Ted Curphey
Ontario, OR



Date: 06/15/11 16:38
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: cf7

Interesting information as I always thought all coiled steel was either hauled in
Gons, or on coil steel cars. This new model is certainly a beautiful one and
I hope they sell a bunch. cf7



Date: 06/15/11 17:08
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: toledopatch

So I presume, then, that the most likely corridors in which one would see these cars in prototype service would be between the various steel mills that the B&O served and can-making plants in agricultural areas producing canned foods and juices.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/15/11 17:09 by toledopatch.



Date: 06/15/11 17:44
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: needles_sub

There are/were also can manufactures in Southern California. There was one in Torrance, CA as well as other cities in the Los Angeles area. I think it would safe to think these cars made trips into the area.



Date: 06/15/11 17:48
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: toledopatch

Does anyone know the particular steel mills that made the can-grade steel?



Date: 06/16/11 07:30
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: drolsen

I mentioned in the other thread that there's a diagram and description in an old Model Railroading article about building a Canstock model that you can read on Trainlife's website:

http://www.trainlife.com/magazines/pages/214/15761/april-1991-page-19

The diagram does a nice job of showing how the coils are loaded, the issues with maneuvering the large forklift needed to move the heavy coils, and why the offset door design on the Canstock car works better for this type of cargo.

Dave



Date: 06/17/11 06:12
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: acltrainman

Yes, Bethlehem Steel Sparrows Point and Burns Harbor are 2 off the top of my head. J&L also made tinplate steel.
Stan



Date: 06/17/11 09:37
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: AfroRon

The B&O/CSX canstock cars were still in service as of 2005, I used to get them regularly. I'd have to run some numbers in UMLER to see if they still come up.

Somewhere I have a scanned copy of a B&O advertisement for these cars, When I find it Ill post it.



Date: 06/17/11 10:40
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: toledopatch

acltrainman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, Bethlehem Steel Sparrows Point and Burns
> Harbor are 2 off the top of my head. J&L also made
> tinplate steel.
> Stan

Thanks. I'm just trying to imagine if I could reasonably plot a route across upstate New York that these cars might have run 20 years ago. It would probably have to have been steel from Burns Harbor going to a can plant somewhere in New England or northern New Jersey. Not saying that Conrail would actually have handled such a move that way, just thinking about how "my" railroad might have received these cars in interchange from CSX and run 'em east out of Youngstown.



Date: 06/17/11 11:28
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: drolsen

AfroRon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The B&O/CSX canstock cars were still in service as
> of 2005, I used to get them regularly. I'd have to
> run some numbers in UMLER to see if they still
> come up.

No need - there's plenty of photos of them from the past year that are continuing to show up in the RR Picture Archives. I caught two last year, one in Atlanta and one at Point of Rocks, MD. The majority of them are still in service.

Dave



Date: 06/17/11 11:55
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: AfroRon

drolsen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> AfroRon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The B&O/CSX canstock cars were still in service
> as
> > of 2005, I used to get them regularly. I'd have
> to
> > run some numbers in UMLER to see if they still
> > come up.
>
> No need - there's plenty of photos of them from
> the past year that are continuing to show up in
> the RR Picture Archives. I caught two last year,
> one in Atlanta and one at Point of Rocks, MD. The
> majority of them are still in service.
>
> Dave


I wondered about that, they basically disappeared from the trains I used to get them on.



Date: 06/17/11 13:00
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: brfriedm

Dave I can check again but as far as I know, none are now in service. Some have been scrapped and some are being converted to MOW offices. I saw 2 in the last couple of months and they were heading to be converted to MOW cars. There is a bunch in storage too. Based on my observations, I would guess that the last timeframe of when these were really in revenue service was fall of 2010. Not to say they may not come out of storage.

Bruce


drolsen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> AfroRon Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The B&O/CSX canstock cars were still in service
> as
> > of 2005, I used to get them regularly. I'd have
> to
> > run some numbers in UMLER to see if they still
> > come up.
>
> No need - there's plenty of photos of them from
> the past year that are continuing to show up in
> the RR Picture Archives. I caught two last year,
> one in Atlanta and one at Point of Rocks, MD. The
> majority of them are still in service.
>
> Dave



Date: 06/17/11 14:22
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: drolsen

brfriedm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dave I can check again but as far as I know, none
> are now in service. Some have been scrapped and
> some are being converted to MOW offices. I saw 2
> in the last couple of months and they were heading
> to be converted to MOW cars. There is a bunch in
> storage too. Based on my observations, I would
> guess that the last timeframe of when these were
> really in revenue service was fall of 2010. Not to
> say they may not come out of storage.

Bruce - I ran through the CSX UMLER and still got good info on the following Pullman-Standard numbers - these may be the ones in storage:

CSXT 504000-504007, CSXT 504010-504015, CSXT 504017, CSXT 504019-504020, CSXT 504024, CSXT 504026, CSXT 504028, CSXT 504031, CSXT 504033, CSXT 504037, CSXT 504040, CSXT 504042-504046, CSXT 504048-504058, CSXT 504060-504062, CSXT 504064-504069, CSXT 504071-CSXT 504074

The last one I saw was in November 2010 in a train at Point of Rocks. That's a bummer if they're all at the end of the road. I'd love to find out where they're in storage to try to get some photos.

Dave



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/11 14:22 by drolsen.



Date: 06/18/11 15:13
Re: More info behind Canstock cars
Author: DrLoco

I'll have to check my records bak at home, but I know that Stolle Corp. Based in Sidney, Ohio on the old NYC Bee Line got boxcars for canstock. I have several reports that discuss lading damage from bad train handling, and if I recall correctly, the steel came out of Burns Harbor. I was told by the old heads on the job when I hired on and started there as a brakeman that they made tin cans for Campbell's soup among others.
NYC(and PC and CR) had an interchange in Sidney with the B&O (CSXT) that was used daily. So, you could in theory have these carstock cars come to interchange in Sidney, then on to the CR for spotting at destination.

When I get back to my home terminal (someday) I'll see if I can round up the appropriate data!
YOu may also want to try over at the car card yahoo group if you want to try to do a prototypical routing for these cars on your layout!



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