Model Railroading > Bowser comments on the new motor on their Facebook page

Hello Everyone and Happy Friday,

So not sure if folks noticed but Bowser DID comment on these new motors on their Facebook page. WMD's.

So this is good news and I give kudos to them for making these changes. Now with that stated, this is Bowser, and Atlas and Intermountain still use these WMD's so I do recommend that you constructively tell the IM and Atlas folks that you would like this improved motor also in future runs. Speak up!

Thanks Bruce

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From Bowser's Facebook page:

Question - Well, what about the motor weakness/cheapness? Explanations abound?

Bowser response - The motor is getting replaced but wasn't available for these production runs. The new motor will be first seen in an upcoming batch of C628's and the new GMD SD40-2's. We have just gotten samples and test run them and they will pull ( Drag) other brands of locomotive's whether running in the opposite direction or not running at all. We tested it running a 2% grade and it pulled an other brand backwards up the grade while the other was trying to pull it down the grade. We will not be posting any video of the test out of courtesy for the other brand. If you feel that your specific loco is running too slow or weak please call us at 1-800-327-5126 to discuss the issue so we can ensure there isn't another reason or cause that needs to be fixed in the loco.

Question - Will you make it available as a retrofit kit???

Bowser response - That has not been decided yet as the motor has different dimensions and at a minimum requires different drive shafts and motor mounts and may possibly have a modified frame well dependent on the type of chassis. In any case if we were too have a retrofit package it would most likely not fit all previous generations of all the older models of locomotives or even previous runs of the newer locomotives with out needing to modify your existing frames to fit. Once a drive train has been modified for the newer motor the parts used in that drive train will most likely become available as individual repair/replacements parts on their own. Just keep in mind that it usually takes sometime after the release of the new project until parts are available for sale separately.

-------------------------------------------

Finally, they did respond to the small fuel tank concern.

Question - How about a Larger more prototypical replacement fuel tank for us nitpickers!

Bowser response - We are designing a new fuel tank for these that will be fatter and hang lower. It won't be available for some time though. The announcement of the 3rd run will come with the bigger tanks and the parts them selves should be available some time shortly after the announcement. Look for that announcement in 6 months or so.

Wow,
So they knew and still released product. That's not good business.

Joel Brazy
Coatesville, PA

Just to add to the class of this organisation, they are fantastic with warranty assistance too. One of my five models which just arrived yesterday has some shipping damage caused by mis-loading the loco at the factory. Lee English has responded to this issue right away.

Rick

Glad to hear the GMD SD40-2'S will have the upgraded motors.

Russ

Posted from Android

jobrazy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow,
> So they knew and still released product. That's
> not good business.


And if they didn't release them they would have gotten crucified for that! So it is a NO WIN situation for them. And Dealing with the Chinese you may not know what you are really getting till it gets here. And I bet 90% of the people don't care one way or the other. We on boards like this are less than 10% of the total model railroad population.

Andre

I read somewhere it may have been on their Facebook page that they were not aware of the motor switch until these were on the boat coming across.

That would explain why this group and the next are effected but ones further out are not going to be afflicted.

I've done business with Bowser on non-railroad projects and found them to be extremely professional. I would be very surprised to find out that
they knew about the change and went with it no matter the consequences.

Most likely in my opinion is that the factory made a switch and made note of it as a passing comment with other hit list items being covered at the
time. Trust me this happens more times than most manufacturers would care to acknowledge. While its the cost of doing business overseas, it's one
of the myriad of reasons some manufacturing has returned to the US or moved on to other countries. Labor rates are only a small portion of the equation.

Kris

The point is that the motors are defective, and Bowser should make available, at the very LEAST.....free of charge, a full motor conversion kit including a new driveline and a new motor and whatever electronics are needed for every single unit they shipped. Quality Control is up to the model rr company that ordered the units as much as the people who built them. We in the marine industry understand well that when you build a vessel in China, you sit right there on top of the shipyard day and night and oversee the work - if you don't, you will end up with the seagoing equivalent of Bowser's problem. I'm not willing to give them a pass on this. I will take my 636's to the club this week to run them....if they run poorly they are going back to the LHS for a refund. Ditto the new Atlas GE's.

As for them being criticized had they not delivered these - too bad. We are increasingly willing in this country to settle for mediocrity in order to protect people's feelings or to save them or their business from themselves. Bowser knows the problem, now they should fix it on their nickel. If necessary, go after the manufacturer in China to recover the cost. What is that you say? That would be impossible?

Two of these units cost well over $500.00. So tell you what....go buy a $500.00 refrigerator and after you get it home have it be unable to lower the temperature enough inside it to protect your food. Why? ...because as t turns it turns out that the motor driving the compressor was a cheap substitute and could not handle the load. Then go to the store and tell me how you'd react when they tell you that you are stuck with this one but the good news is that everyone who waited instead of buying, will get a motor that works and MAYBE some day you will be able to BUY one to fix your defective refrigerator. In the meantime, they hope you'll buy more appliances from them.

Right.

You know the irony? Had MTH done this people would have been beating them into the ground over it. But you know what? MTH DID have a run of bad motors and if your unit had one, they replaced it for FREE. I had 5 of them re-motored. The one time they did fail to do it and I complained.....an executive of MTH stepped in and got it done. Atlas replaced large numbers of defective trucks on GP38's and GP40's about 7 or so years ago with new ones for anyone who wrote in and requested them along with proof that they actually owned a unit, or even many of therm. (I received 9 pairs of trucks - free.)

I like Bowser units and I will keep buying. I have around 2 dozen different, recent Bowser units. But I will also send back units that do not run well or have problems like this. Just like I do with other manufacturer's products.

Bob


dcmkris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I read somewhere it may have been on their
> Facebook page that they were not aware of the
> motor switch until these were on the boat coming
> across.
>
> That would explain why this group and the next are
> effected but ones further out are not going to be
> afflicted.
>
> I've done business with Bowser on non-railroad
> projects and found them to be extremely
> professional. I would be very surprised to find
> out that
> they knew about the change and went with it no
> matter the consequences.
>
> Most likely in my opinion is that the factory made
> a switch and made note of it as a passing comment
> with other hit list items being covered at the
> time. Trust me this happens more times than most
> manufacturers would care to acknowledge. While
> its the cost of doing business overseas, it's one
>
> of the myriad of reasons some manufacturing has
> returned to the US or moved on to other countries.
> Labor rates are only a small portion of the
> equation.
>
> Kris

navarch1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The point is that the motors are defective, and
> Bowser should make available, at the very
> LEAST.....free of charge, a full motor conversion
> kit including a new driveline and a new motor and
> whatever electronics are needed for every single
> unit they shipped. Quality Control is up to the
> model rr company that ordered the units as much as
> the people who built them. We in the marine
> industry understand well that when you build a
> vessel in China, you sit right there on top of the
> shipyard day and night and oversee the work - if
> you don't, you will end up with the seagoing
> equivalent of Bowser's problem. I'm not willing to
> give them a pass on this. I will take my 636's to
> the club this week to run them....if they run
> poorly they are going back to the LHS for a
> refund. Ditto the new Atlas GE's.
>
> As for them being criticized had they not
> delivered these - too bad. We are increasingly
> willing in this country to settle for mediocrity
> in order to protect people's feelings or to save
> them or their business from themselves. Bowser
> knows the problem, now they should fix it on their
> nickel. If necessary, go after the manufacturer in
> China to recover the cost. What is that you say?
> That would be impossible?
>
> Two of these units cost well over $500.00. So tell
> you what....go buy a $500.00 refrigerator and
> after you get it home have it be unable to lower
> the temperature enough inside it to protect your
> food. Why? ...because as t turns it turns out that
> the motor driving the compressor was a cheap
> substitute and could not handle the load. Then go
> to the store and tell me how you'd react when they
> tell you that you are stuck with this one but the
> good news is that everyone who waited instead of
> buying, will get a motor that works and MAYBE some
> day you will be able to BUY one to fix your
> defective refrigerator. In the meantime, they hope
> you'll buy more appliances from them.
>
> Right.
>
> You know the irony? Had MTH done this people would
> have been beating them into the ground over it.
> But you know what? MTH DID have a run of bad
> motors and if your unit had one, they replaced it
> for FREE. I had 5 of them re-motored. The one time
> they did fail to do it and I complained.....an
> executive of MTH stepped in and got it done. Atlas
> replaced large numbers of defective trucks on
> GP38's and GP40's about 7 or so years ago with new
> ones for anyone who wrote in and requested them
> along with proof that they actually owned a unit,
> or even many of therm. (I received 9 pairs of
> trucks - free.)
>
> I like Bowser units and I will keep buying. I have
> around 2 dozen different, recent Bowser units. But
> I will also send back units that do not run well
> or have problems like this. Just like I do with
> other manufacturer's products.
>
> Bob
>
>
> dcmkris Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I read somewhere it may have been on their
> > Facebook page that they were not aware of the
> > motor switch until these were on the boat
> coming
> > across.
> >
> > That would explain why this group and the next
> are
> > effected but ones further out are not going to
> be
> > afflicted.
> >
> > I've done business with Bowser on non-railroad
> > projects and found them to be extremely
> > professional. I would be very surprised to
> find
> > out that
> > they knew about the change and went with it no
> > matter the consequences.
> >
> > Most likely in my opinion is that the factory
> made
> > a switch and made note of it as a passing
> comment
> > with other hit list items being covered at the
> > time. Trust me this happens more times than
> most
> > manufacturers would care to acknowledge. While
> > its the cost of doing business overseas, it's
> one
> >
> > of the myriad of reasons some manufacturing has
> > returned to the US or moved on to other
> countries.
> > Labor rates are only a small portion of the
> > equation.
> >
> > Kris

You have hit the nail on the head. Three serious defects: 1. ride height 2. fuel tank and 3. motor and so far they are only slowly acknowledging two of three. In fact the are in denial regarding height. As I said, take a trip to Cohocton , NY with a model in hand as I did and it will be clear there is something wrong. For Bowser, it would only be a 250 mile round trip!

Yes I am greatful they produced the C636. But for the price, they need to be better. And yes, I lowered many "blue box" Athearn GP38-2's in past but I only paid $35 for them.

As you said, MTH or Athearn would be torn apart for these errors. As I said earlier, a friend of mine who does not model said "wow they look terrible"! He is not letting his mind get in the way of his eyes!

Posted from Android

So I picked up my 3 SP&S units on Friday. I will mull around on what I might do about the height issues when I have time to handle them.

The units did not get a running test account being screwed to the shipping materials. The store owner had a BN unit out on the test track and it ran very smoothly. If you put a finger on the track ahead of the unit it would stop and all wheels would spin. It would seem the motor is powerful enough for the adhesion to the rail the model has.

Posted from Windows Phone OS 7