Passenger Trains > 1941 Empire State Express

Hello....would any of you fine folks know where I can find a consist list for the 1941 ESE, or a complete consist list for the New York Central passenger trains of the 1941-1948 period...Thanks in advance.

Joe

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Hope this is what you are looking for.
NYC
EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS
New York – Cleveland - Detroit
(December 7, 1941)
New York – Cleveland 605 miles
New York – Detroit 687 miles

The New York Central System inaugurated the two train sets that comprised the lightweight streamlined EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS on December 7, 1941 between New York City at the one end and both Cleveland and Detroit at the other. This date is best remembered as the date the United States Naval base at Pearl Harbor and other military installations in Hawaii were attacked by Imperial Japanese forces plunging the U. S. into WW II. The Detroit and Cleveland sections of the EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS split at Buffalo with the Detroit section operating across Southern Ontario to its destination. This section was generally anywhere from one to three Parlor cars a dining car and two or more coaches. The remaining cars operated through to and from Cleveland the two New York Central EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS lightweight streamliners departed from their respective terminals and after exchanging their Electric Locomotives at Harmon and the outskirts of Cleveland on the west. The new J3A streamlined 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotives and Tenders took over for the run to the opposite electrified territory. The two streamlined J3A Hudson Locomotive and tenders were 5426 and 5429 with stainless steel installed on the tenders to match the trailing consists and stainless steel installed on the boiler Jacket cover. The roofs of the otherwise all stainless steel Budd built consists were painted black and the top of the Tender and Locomotive were painted black to match. The EMPIRE STATE EXPRESS consists shown below were between Buffalo and New York City on December 7, 1941. The named cars in each train set were named for former Governors of the State of New York.

FIRST CONSIST

5426 Streamlined J3A 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotive & Tender

ALONZO B. CORNELL Baggage 60’ Railway Post Office Car

GROVER CLEVELAND Baggage Buffet 36 seat Lounge Car

CHARLES E. HUGHES 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

HERBERT H. LEHMAN 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

NATHAN L. MILLER 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

GEORGE CLINTON 44 seat Dining Car

REUBEN E. FENTON 56 Revenue seat Coach

2569 56 Revenue seat Coach

2567 56 Revenue seat Coach

2566 56 Revenue seat Coach

HAMILTON FISH 56 Revenue seat Coach

DEWITT CLINTON 44 seat Dining Car

DAVID B. HILL 56 Revenue seat Coach

MORGAN LEWIS 56 Revenue seat Coach

WILLIAM L. MARCY 56 Revenue seat Coach

THEODORE ROOSEVELT 56 seat Tavern Bar Lounge Observation

SECOND CONSIST

5429 Streamlined J3A 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotive & Tender

JOHN A. DIX Baggage 60’ Railway Post Office Car

MARTIN VAN BUREN Baggage Buffet 36 seat Lounge Car

LEVI P. MORTON 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

ALFRED E. SMITH 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

SAMUEL J. TILDEN 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5 seat Parlor Drawing Room

JOHN JAY 44 seat Dining Car

2564 56 Revenue seat Coach

EDWIN D. MORGAN 56 Revenue seat Coach

2565 56 Revenue seat Coach

2568 56 Revenue seat Coach

WILLIAM H. SEWARD 56 Revenue seat Coach

HORATIO SEYMOUR 44 seat Dining Car

DANIEL D. TOMPKINS 56 Revenue seat Coach

CHARLES S. WHITMAN 56 Revenue seat Coach

SILAS WRIGHT 56 Revenue seat Coach

FRANKLIN D. ROOSEVELT 56 seat Tavern Bar Lounge Observation

Al - in - Stockton

Wow, what a train! We'll be taking a train from Syracuse to NYC in January--sure wish it looked like this one!

passengerfan Wrote:
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> > LEVI P. MORTON 30 Revenue seat Parlor Car with 5
> seat Parlor Drawing Room

That car is owned by the Western NY Railway Historical Society and is in Hamburg, NY awaiting restoration. When Amtrak got their hands on that car, they converted it into a coach.

If anyone is interested I have compiled similar information to the Empire State Express on every streamliner from the M-10000 and Pioneer Zephyr to Amtrak complete with inaugural consists. This has taken over twenty years of research and I am willing to share with anyone needing information on any streamliner. In some cases the actual consist was rather difficult if not impossible to find especially on some of the postwar streamliners. In those cases I have compiled what was either thought to be the inaugural consist or what a consist actually ran as a inaugural consist probably looked like.I am going away for a few days so will not be near my computer but after sunday will be glad to share the info with anyone interested.
Al - in - Stockton

Thank you very very much. That was exactly perfect! I'll contact you after the holiday to discuss other consists, real or reconstructed.

Best regards and have a great Thanksgiving.

Joe Bille

Long live the NYC!
What project are you planning?

Isn't the NY-NARP chapter promoting the extension of one of the existing NYC-Niagara Falls trains to Cleveland. I doubt a day trip could begotten from Detroit-Toledo-Cleveland-Albany-NYC routing, even though one would expect this should be faster and more convenient than the 1940s!

Hi...Well for now I'm just trying to assemble a reasonably accurate HO ESE consist including one of the Dreyfus designed ESE Hudsons...Personally, I think they are the most beautiful streamlined steamers ever and anywhere.

Long term, my goal is to eventually put together a "New England States", "Pacemaker" and "Wolverine"....As you might guess from my name, I'm more or less a Pennsy fan (no boos or hisses please) and I also have a strong affinity for the New Haven, more or less the home town railroad for Boston. I'm also trying to do something similar with trains from each of those railroads as well as the B&O...none of the really famous first class all Pullman trains....but not precisely second rate trains either. I have a complete C&O "George Washington" and an N&W "Powhatan Arrow" and a "Pocahontas". Given that I haven't got an operating layout yet, I probably ought to focus on that, but.....I do custom painting for myself and others, so I'm getting my train-fix working on cars and engines rather than on track-work....for now.

Here are the 1938 Twentieth Century LTD consists.
NYC
TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED
New York - Chicago
(June 13, 1938)
961 miles

On June 15, 1938 the most famous train in America the All
Pullman All Room Extra Fare pride of the New York Central System TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED began streamlined service. The all new all room Pullman Standard built trains numbered four so that if needed an extra section could be operated daily if needed. But not only did the NYC receive 62 new lightweight streamlined cars for the new TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED but also ten streamlined J3 4-6-4 Hudson Locomotives and Tenders for assignment pulling the new TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED numbered 5445 – 5454. The TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED was the worlds first lightweight all room sleeping car train. The rival PRR BROADWAY LIMITED inaugurated all room Pullman service on the same date but the consists had a couple of modernized heavyweight cars in each consist. The TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITEDS streamlined Hudson Locomotives were operated between Chicago and Harmon pulling fourteen car consists sometimes extended to sixteen cars. It was not at all unusual for two sections of fourteen cars each to be operated in each direction on ten-minute headway on the fast sixteen-hour schedule assigned to the TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED. The lightweight streamlined TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED was one of only four streamlined trains in the United States to ever carry Master rooms the most luxurious Pullman accommodation of all complete with private shower facilities and bathroom annex. The other streamlined trains that carried Master Rooms were the PRR BROADWAY LIMITED, PRR LIBERTY LIMITED, and the Southern CRESCENT. The NYC selected famed industrial designer Henry Dreyfuss to design the new paint scheme and interiors of the feature cars, not to mention the magnificent streamlining of the Hudson Locomotives. The completed train sets were among the most tastefully designed and decorated ever constructed. The paint scheme of the new TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITED was light gray overall with a dark Blue window band with two white stripes centered in this Blue band and a small white separation stripe between the Blue and gray at both top and bottom of the window band. The paint scheme was never repeated on any further NYC trains, management felt it was a little to gaudy for a train of the TWENTIETH CENTURY LIMITEDS prestige. The following is the four inaugural train sets of June 15, 1938.

First Section Departing Chicago

5450 J3A 4-6-4 streamlined Hudson Locomotive & Tender

5018 Baggage 60’ Railway Post Office Car

CENTURY CLUB 18 Crew Dormitory Barber Shop Bar 30 seat Lounge Car

CASCADE GLORY 10 Roomette 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

COOK COUNTY 13 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF DAYTON 17 Roomette Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL CANYON 4 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL FOREST 4 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

680 38 seat Dining Car

IMPERIAL GARDEN 4 Compartment 2 Drawing Room 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

WESTCHESTER COUNTY 13 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF CHICAGO 17 Roomette Sleeping Car

CASCADE ROCKS 10 Roomette 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CASCADE SPIRIT 10 Roomette 5 Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

MANHATTAN ISLAND 1 Double Bedroom 1 Master Room Bar 22 seat Lounge 10 seat Lounge Observation

Second Section Departing Chicago

5448 J3A 4-6-4 Streamlined Hudson Locomotive & Tender

5020 Baggage 60’Railway Post Office Car

CENTURY LOUNGE 18-Crew Dormitory Barber Shop Bar 30-Seat Lounge Car

CASCADE RIPPLE 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

LUCAS COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF ALBANY 17-Roomette Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL FALLS 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL BAY 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

682 38-Seat Dining Car

IMPERIAL CHATEAU 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

NIAGARA COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF TOLEDO 17-Roomette Sleeping Car

CASCADE GLEN 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CASCADE VALLEY 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

PELEE ISLAND 1-Double Bedroom 1-Master Room Bar 22-Seat Lounge 10-Seat Lounge Observation

First Section Departing New York (Harmon)

5452 J3A 4-6-4 Streamlined Hudson Locomotive & Tender

5017 Baggage 60’ Railway Post Office Car

CENTURY INN 18-Crew Dormitory Barber Shop Bar 30-Seat Lounge Car

CASCADE DAWN 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

ONANDAGA COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF DETROIT 17 Roomette Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL CASTLE 4-Compartment 2- Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL MANSION 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

681 38-Seat Dining Car

IMPERIAL ARCH 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

MONROE COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF CLEVELAND 17-Roomette Sleeping Car

CASCADE GROTTO 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CASCADE VALE 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

MAHATTAN ISLAND 1-Double Bedroom 1-Master Room Bar 22-Seat Lounge 10-Seat Lounge Observation

Second Section Departing New York (Harmon)

5449 J3A 4-6-4 Streamlined Hudson Locomotive & Tender

5019 Baggage 60’Railway Post Office Car

CENTURY TAVERN 18-Crew Dormitory Barber Shop Bar 30-Seat Lounge Car

CASCADE VIEW 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

DUTCHESS COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF BOSTON 17-Roomette Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL COURT 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

IMPERIAL PALACE 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

683 38-Seat Dining Car

IMPERIAL FOUNTAIN 4-Compartment 2-Drawing Room 4-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CUYAHOGA COUNTY 13-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CITY OF BUFFALO 17-Roomette Sleeping Car

CASCADE GLADE 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CASCADE WOODS 10-Roomette 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

THOUSAND ISLANDS 1-Double Bedroom 1-Master Room Bar 22-Seat Lounge 10-Seat Lounge Observation

Al - in - Stockton