Passenger Trains > #48 Schedule Change

On the 11th on TO someone noted
that #48 will depart Chicago one
hour earlier at 9 pm. Yet if you
go to the Amtrak site and click
on reservations and "select a
train" 10pm still is listed for
June and even August.

Is 9 pm going to be the new
departure time after all ? Has
Amtrak simply not gotten around
to putting the info into the
computer ? 9:00pm would seem
to be a better time to depart.

Indeed a new earlier #48 schedule had been programmed in ARROW for a few days this week, but it has now been changed back to the existing (later) schedule.

My understanding is that an earlier #48 was Amtrak's goal, but several complicating factors got in the way, including:

CSX had not fully agreed to the change...

Penn Station adamantly did NOT want #48 showing up at ~6:00pm and taking up scarce platform/track space during rush hour.

Fortunately, the planned new 4:45pm departure of ALB-NYP train #244 is still in the system. It is VITAL that a reliable ALB originating train be available in late afternoon, for business travelers going back to the City.

Oh good grief - so we still have this train on its original schedule? NY Penn Station should not be a deciding factor - as that station can't even operate its rush hour trains (morning and afternoon) efficiently now. Coordination with CSX is more important. Then there's Boston Station facilities dictating what it can and can't handle in terms of Amtrak equipment. Amtrak often will use one platform for say an Acela Express and Keystone train. Same could potentially done with the arrival of the Lake Shore (sharing a track with another Amtrak train). And I've seen Amtrak literally "park" NJT trains and Amtrak trains unnecessarily at various platforms during rush hour. All this trouble because the Lake Shore Limited has to act as the "Chicago" cleanup train in the absence of the "Three Rivers" when the later was supposedly not needed. Well I guess it is. So perhaps Amtrak needs to negotiate the reinstatement of the Three Rivers.

Reminds me when VIA's train 50/51 Enterprise was on their reservation system as being routed thru Ottawa for about a day a few years ago. After they checked their facts ans saw it could not be done for a variety of reasons, they put it back.

As for 48, Amtrak is now suffering from their recklessness and stupidity in yanking train 40. It would be very expensive and difficult to scrape up resources to restart it, to say nothing of getting a slot from NS (it should not run on the ex-B&O). Making 48 a mop-up train has ruined their Indiana business, had bad times in Ohio regardless, gets in the way of Empire trains, and makes lousy connections with commuter trains in Boston and New York. At least 40 used to arrive NYP around 8pm and had about 2 hours fat in the schedule Youngstown-east.

That's the problem when Amtrak discontinues a train - like the Three Rivers - they will have to go back and try to re-negotiate with the host railroad to get the "slot back." That's why I was sad to see the Three Rivers discontinued. However Amtrak did convince NS to extend the Pennsylvanian at one time to Chicago. Perhaps it can "try again!"

It would be nice if Amtrak could restore an "enhanced" Broadway Limited - operating on the NS/NYC Water Level Route through Ohio, Indiana and Chicago. But Amtrak should perhaps go a step further and not just re-instate this train as just another "Amtrak" single level long distance train, but go the extra distance to put some additional amenities on this route to draw back ridership it once had. For example - a full service diner, a single level "utltra dome" (procured specially for this train would be great as a cafe/lounge for visitors to take in the scenic Pennsylvania countryside and horseshoe curve where it will spend most of its daylight running time). But this will likely only come about after Amtrak procures its 25 single level sleepers.

Potential schedule for a reincarnated Broadway Limited:

Eastbound:
Lv Chicago at 9 p.m. *
Ar Cleveland at 5:00 a.m.
Ar Pittsburgh at 7:30 a.m.
Ar Philadelphia at 2:30 p.m. **
Ar New York City at 4:15 p.m. ***

- serving breakfast and lunch.

* Allowing this train to become the cleanup train would allow the Lake Shore Limited to revert back to a 7:00 p.m. departure and the Capitol Limited to a 5:45 p.m. departure. Then the Lake Shore Limited could get into NYC around it's old time slot of 3:00 p.m. and allow for various connections there. This was give or take the eastbound departure time of the Capitol Limited, prior to when the Three Rivers was discontinued. I thought this departure time from Chicago and Washington DC (prior to 6:00 p.m. worked well for the Capitol Limited eastbound and westbound).

** Tighten up the schedule between Pittsburgh and Philadelphia (nearly on the current Pennsylvanian's schedule with limited stops etc. and move the Pennsylvanian to an afternoon departure from Pittsburgh/NYC). This would allow some key connections once again at Philadelphia for taking the even the "Chicago cleanup train" or taking a re-scheduled Capitol Limited. For example, connections could be made to long distance trains heading to the south, particularly the Crescent, Silver Meteor etc. which is currently missed by the Lake Shore Limited, even if it were to arrive at it's old 3:00 p.m. eastbound slot at NYP.

*** This would get the Three Rivers into NYC before rush hour - allowing for a descent arrival time for further connections as well. By operating the Three Rivers over the NS southern route, or ex-NYC water level route, it would allow for a faster time schedule than what the Three Rivers used to have.

Course a Three Rivers could be put back on the schedule now using an Amfleet Diner-Lite and using 3 Viewliners that Amtrak currently doesn't operate (remember only 39 out of the 50 are required on a daily basis - this would boost the Viewliner utilization up to using 42 if just one Viewliner was used). Then once a new order of single level sleepers is placed, it could be reincarnated as the Broadway Limited with extra amenities, sleepers, full service diner and descent lounge/cafe car for a single level train set.

Westbound:

Re-instate this train as close to a 2:00 p.m. departure time as possible (so the Pennsylvanian could pickup the slack as a morning riders, and this train for afternoon riders to Pittsburgh, beyond).

Lv NYP at 2:00 p.m.
Lv Philly at 4:00 p.m.
Depart Pittsburgh at 10:45 p.m. *
Depart Cleveland at 1:30 a.m.
Ar. Chicago at 8:00 a.m.

- serving dinner and breakfast.

* Re-instate the Capitol Limited to leave at its old time schedule of 5:30 p.m. out of Washington DC.

I am sure this is a pipe dream - reinstating service over the ex-PRR mainline from NYC to Pittsburgh and then on other routes to Chicago - but it would allow

1) At least three main Midwest-East Coast trains to get back on the map.
2) Establish additional frequency west of Harrisburg to Pittsburgh (which is really needed).
3) Trying to include Cleveland with a somewhat descent arrival/departure time east and westbound (than compared to present).
4) Establishing an overnight "hotel on wheels" between Chicago and Pittsburgh (this was once a market that people looked towards).

Put Cars on 42&43 onto the Capitol Limited at Pittsburgh say 2 sleeping cars and 2 coaches?

Not that easy unfortunately.

It has been done before, done since with Superliner and Surfliners convey to the east coast, can be done again, and they are no MHC cars to switch around, which they did separately from the coaches (they wanted them on the opposite ends of the Amfleet train). Amtrak's attitude, inability to understand connecting revenue with product-line mentality, and disinterest in LD trains in general is the main culprit. NS has to play nice on the NEC and Harrisburgh line. They should be negotiable with Amtrak in Pittsburgh station.

It solves the "Pittsburgh problem", and recaptures most of 40/41's business, but does not address the mop-up train issue out of Chicago.

This is a good time to buy a slot from NS with freight business down, and not likely to go back to where it was for a long time, if ever, given Chrysler's, GM's, and Saturn's imminent, partial demise.

I'm all for the LDs, but feel parts of the network need a good "tweeking". With freight business down this might be a good time to reinstate a "Three Rivers" type train. The "Cardinal" really needs it, too. Too many "hand-offs" between Cincy and Chicago
to run reliably. How about making St.Louis its terminus? That would make the new St.Louis station a real hub. A Throughway bus service could cover Cincy-Chicago

I wouldn't do anything (i.e. make daily) to the Cardinal until the following happens:

1) Take 2 hour out of the schedule by getting off the Bubba RR in Virginia
2) Upgrading the broken down ex-Monon ROW,
3) Streamline their entry into Chicago,
4) Stick a 4th coach on the tri-weekly consist and fill it.

Otherwise you have to add 2 trainsets to run a daily schedule.

The train is now a schlep, seldom on-time, and has completely unmarketable times north of Philly. Truly ironic that it has survived, yet the Bway Ltd is totally gone, unless you think of the Capitol Ltd as its Washington Section.