Passenger Trains > Capitol Ltd nine hours late

I noticed Wednesday's eastbound CapitolLtd departed Toledo 8:53am today, nine hours late. What is going on ?

Another round of storms in the midwest? I guess that sounds like the predicament. Expected into Pittsburgh around 2:30pm.

We had alots of rain in Pittsburgh, Pa and cleaning up my flooding basement Today. Alot of Storms everywhere.

Yes but 48 overtook 30 between Waterloo and Toledo, so it must have been a train-related problem.

Engine breakdown or something similar. The train sat in Butler, OH for most of that time before one engine was set out. Of course, there is no spare engine kept in Toledo, and apparently NS doesn't have (or wasn't asked) to help out, so they sat... and sat.

timecruncher

timecruncher Wrote:
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> Engine breakdown or something similar. The train
> sat in Butler, IN for most of that time before one
> engine was set out. Of course, there is no spare
> engine kept in Toledo, and apparently NS doesn't
> have (or wasn't asked) to help out, so they sat...
> and sat.

Hmmm, I saw the train after it got moving again and I didn't even notice that it had just one engine.

They could have brought a new engine from Chicago in less than 9 hours.

Locomotive 49 had issues with the parking brake and was eventually set out.

How eagerly we await for this rain on the East Coast! Nothing but 90+ degree days of hmuidity, and dryness. We desparately need rain out here - along the Mid-Atlantic to Northeast Seabord.

before one engine was set out. Of course, there is no
spare

> Hmmm, I saw the train after it got moving again
> and I didn't even notice that it had just one
> engine.

..Found one somewhere, as it had two past work (Motor yard in Macedonia, Ohio). Very unusual to see Amtrak in daylight in my area. That's my local waiting off to the left.

RAD

---

Is that a genuine caboose in the left side of that picture? Or is that a railroad museum scene?

erie833 Wrote:
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> > Hmmm, I saw the train after it got moving again
> > and I didn't even notice that it had just one
> > engine.
>
> ..Found one somewhere, as it had two past work
> (Motor yard in Macedonia, Ohio). Very unusual to
> see Amtrak in daylight in my area. That's my local
> waiting off to the left.

You didn't happen to catch the trailing engine number, did you?

See my post on the eastern board for shots of the very late Cap in Connellsville PA:
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?2,2254168

Trailing unit was AMTK 176

stone23 Wrote:
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> Is that a genuine caboose in the left side of that
> picture? Or is that a railroad museum scene?

...the real deal, see :

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?2,2168462,2168462#msg-2168462

RAD

toledopatch Wrote:
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> You didn't happen to catch the trailing engine
> number, did you?

Sorry Dave, no I didn't. This was kind of a "quickie" grab shot outside the yard office.

Roger

Let's see the latest Capitol Limited I was on arrived into Washington Union Station just after midnight. We were scheduled for an 11:59 a.m. arrival per the schedule. This was about nearly 5 years back now when the former NYC Water Level Route was at a complete meltdown (however it was winter and freezing temps and snow was measured by feet in the area) in CSX territory. Amtrak combined, for one of the first times in a few series to come afterwards, train 48 and train 30 at Chicago to make the trip eastbound. They had heck of time trying to do the hookup due to the low temps and freezing rain that was settling in at Chicago that evening.

And yes, this was the train that detoured over the Michigan Line beginning at Porter, IN and then we made a southward turn down to Toledo to join back up with the main line. However, it took us from around 9 p.m. to the early morning hours just trying to weave our way to Porter, IN where the crew knew we would some how be "in the clear" once on the Michigan line. Only problem is Amtrak was hoping to use the Chicago crew all the way to the Detroit area before changing out. That didn't happen though. The crew went "dead" some time in the early morning hours on the Michigan line.

I woke up just as we were leaving the Detroit/Dearborn area and trying to make the southbound turn toward Toledo. Decided to sleep in that morning rather than head to the Diner as I knew we still had a long haul ahead of us. To this day, I don't think they hooked up any freight engine to the head-end of the train for this portion of non-regular passenger travel. Train 48 had two P42's behind the Capitol's consist, which also had 2 P42's. Whether this was some sort of emergency type of move because things were so bad on the former NYC Water Level route and the piled high snow you could see outside our windows or maybe they just put a NS or CSX engineer up in the cab - I don't know. But we did do a pretty good speed between the Detroit/Dearborn area and Toledo.

They cut the Capitol Limited loose first at Toledo and we were off. It was largely clear sailing from Toledo on East. Nice to see this area in daylight. I was surprised with the Cleveland area for some reason. We got dinner around Pittsburgh (this was also when the Capitol Limited was running with a full service Superliner Diner) and then greeted our nation's capital around midnight. They offered us a 3:15 a.m. train or something like that from Washington DC to our final destination north of DC, however our ride home was 40 minutes from the train station and I didn't have the heart to wake-up the poor soul that was going to greet us at the train station upon what was supposed to be like a 3:00 p.m. arrival earlier that day. Around Cleveland I had booked a hotel room in DC near Union Station so we could take a train the next day up the NEC and arrive at a more civilized hour.

This ranks as one of my longest delayed "long distance train journey experience." A Coast Starlight journey and California Zephyr ranks up there as well! But I'll save that one for another time.

After our 12 hour late train ride, I think they did operate the Capitol Limited and Lake Shore as a combined train from Toledo to Chicago a few trips afterwards, but eventually things were not improving and Amtrak just outright canceled the trains to allow CSX clear out the trains between Chicago and Toledo. Freight trains were either broken down or the crew had gone "dead." Plus I think there was nearly a mutiny by the freight engineers and conductors in trying to get the RR cleared up!

I believe the Cardinal was still running and the Three Rivers. But no additional Viewliners were added to the consist - which would have severely helped the situation Amtrak was in. It even would have been great if the Capitol Limited ran its Superliner train set over the route of the Cardinal as MANY were looking to get from terminal to terminal (i.e. Chicago to Washington DC or vice versa). Even airlines were having a lot of delays due to the weather, so Amtrak could have really shined in situation like this. But it didn't. And for what it is worth, the Viewliners were still holding up and not "freezing up," which is often a problem for them in the winter (or at least it was until they went through an overhaul program to get some maintenance they had lacked during the Warrington years). But western long haul trains were arriving into Chicago and had no trains to forward passengers on to the East coast.

I am surprised though that Amtrak couldn't have an extra P42 at Toledo or Cleveland. Granted it, only two trains pass through here any more, but they are critical to Midwest and East Coast travel at this point without the Three Rivers/Broadway Limited any more. Amtrak was keeping a spare P42 at Pittsburgh, but I think they have even done away with that. Not sure if that's a smart move or not. However, if an extra P42 is kept at Pittsburgh, that may explain why someone may have seen the Capitol with two P42's later on in its eastward journey.

Hope they kept the Diner well stocked during this 9 hour delay! Sadly, I think the Capitol Limited is still running with a Superliner Diner Lite (aka Cross Country Cafe), which is not as good as a Superliner full service diner.

I still think Amtrak should get their P42's in good working order and then strategically place them around the national system, so that if a unit has to be "set out" it can at least "limp along" to a nearby city along the route that may have a P42 waiting. For example I believe ABQ still has an extra P42 around. But at the same time. Amtrak should rotate these units out periodically.

Just my thoughts, for what it is worth!

PS - And I am sure my 12 hour delay on the Capitol Limited was surpassed on other trips this past decade. These delays do seem like an eternity - just like on Amtrak train 170 during "signal issues" this past week. The train took 2.5 hours to go from Trenton to Princeton Jct., and had about a four hour delay just from Trenton to NYC that day.

erie833 Wrote:
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> toledopatch Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > You didn't happen to catch the trailing engine
> > number, did you?
>
> Sorry Dave, no I didn't. This was kind of a
> "quickie" grab shot outside the yard office.

s'OK, Roger, Mike covered it.

jp1822 Wrote:

> After our 12 hour late train ride, I think they
> did operate the Capitol Limited and Lake Shore as
> a combined train from Toledo to Chicago a few
> trips afterwards, but eventually things were not
> improving and Amtrak just outright canceled the
> trains to allow CSX clear out the trains between
> Chicago and Toledo. Freight trains were either
> broken down or the crew had gone "dead." Plus I
> think there was nearly a mutiny by the freight
> engineers and conductors in trying to get the RR
> cleared up!
>


CSX does not own or operate the water level route between Toledo and Chicago. That would be the NS.

Ptolemy Wrote:
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> Yes but 48 overtook 30 between Waterloo and
> Toledo, so it must have been a train-related
> problem.


This would have been nice to catch! This is just one reason NS does not want Halftrak to run on their rails. It created a long stretch of single track, yes, NS should have worked with them to take a unit off of a freight and at least get them to Toledo to have someone to look at the unit. If I were a passenger on 48, I would have been really pissed!

The track NS wanted Amtrak to set the unit out on was blocked by an NS train, delaying the move further. Believe me, 99% of the time its an NS "Thoroughbred in Transportation" train that breaks in two, burst an airhose, goes into emergency, or the RR just plain congeals (as was the case around CP 107 last night on the Cleveland Line) that delays the 250+ happy passengers on 29/30 (400 pax on 48/49). Boxes and coal cars don't complain.....passengers do.

Having said that, most NS dispatchers make a decent effort to run Amtrak. Trains break down from time to time.