Passenger Trains > Adirondack - time for business class?

Is it time for the Adirondack to offer business class? Personally, I think it is, as even travelling from NYC or Albany to upstate can be more comfortable in a 2-1 half business and half cafe car. Yes, I realize Amtrak tried this before and there were complaints when table space was cut in half. However, I also noticed recently on the Adirondack, that a lot of tables are taken up by the crew, unnecessarily. However, why not have the full cafe car with tables on both sides and then tack on a car that has half table seating and half business class seating - even if only offered on the NY side (i.e. car gets emptied out and locked up for travel over the Canadian border). Then there's the question that people will ask or state - Amtrak doesn't have these cars available? Well it's funny how they operate on the Albany-NYC route (exclusively) even though no food service is offered. How about getting some more "miles" out of these cars by running them on the Adirondack and still not offering food service in them. And these cars could strictly be for business class passengers - the tables and the seating. I am sure Amtrak can find a full 2-2 business class car to operate in its place on the "Albany-NYC" run.

Riding on the Adirondack in the past to upstate NY or Canada, one regularly got a seat on two of the train's Amfleet II cars. But this is not always the case any more - as I experienced. And I certainly didn't enjoy the high density Amfleet I cars for this "long" journey from NYC to upstate NY (once again!). This was common on the Adirondack before, and it sees to have returned - having more Amfleet 1 high density cars in the mix. At one time - after they had to pull the former Amfleet Metroliner train sets off this train to substitute them for Acela Expres train sets that were sidelined - the high density cars were all that one had.

Now with the mix once again apparent, would I have paid for business class on the Adirondack (using the Amfleet business class car mentioned above), even knowing I'd have the smaller Amfleet I windows and such - ABSOLUTELY!

I feel there is so much potential for this train - be it the service amenity, experience offered, or equipment used etc. And this is NY State's only "403B" train that they contribute to funding......

I just think it is time for Amtrak to finally put a business class car on this train - particularly a 1/2 business class and 1/2 cafe car, but still keep the full cafe (with tables on both sides) part of the consist to appease what should be a regular "lounge" car on this train.

The Adirondack had Business Class in the mid-1990s. A full Metroliner coach with extra legroom over Coach was used. I rode it several times and there were never any more than a few passengers in the Business Class car. For much of the trip I had it almost to myself.

Business Class disappeared a few years later when the Adirondack's Amfleet was replaced with high-density Clocker coaches. That, to me, was a downgrade; the windows were bigger but the seating became more cramped, less comfortable. That change came about because the NE Corridor wanted to be able to trainline the Clocker doors, which could not be done with Heritage Fleet cars; so they traded cars with the Empire Corridor. Along with the Clocker coaches came a better Lounge car; a Heritage lounge car replaced the Amdinette. Without Business Class, I rode in the Lounge and nursed a soda or two or three for the duration!

The times have changed and the ridership on the Adirondack is up...or at least it seems more full, now. I'd welcome the return of Business Class.

Note: in that same mid-90s timeframe, the Adirondack ran out of Washington DC. That made for a 6am departure; a Washington-Montreal trip was more marketable than with today's extremely early 315am departure time. Yes, you can take a 5am Acela and change trains at New York; but that's a railfan's errand, not something a regular passenger would do.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/10 16:53 by GenePoon.

Allegedly US Customs will not allow business class. There is much that doesn't make sense about this but that is the official line.

Ptolemy Wrote:
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> Allegedly US Customs will not allow business
> class. There is much that doesn't make sense
> about this but that is the official line.

Doesn't the Maple Leaf have business class?

hsr_fan Wrote:
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>
> Doesn't the Maple Leaf have business class?


Only as far as CBN (Canadian Border NY). Beyond, to Toronto, only Coach. But note that beyond CBN, it's a VIA Rail Canada train. Not Amtrak. The Adirondack handles no intra-Canada traffic and is an all-Amtrak operation.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/10 19:56 by GenePoon.

HOLD UP! My suggestion was basically to put business class in place for those traveling between NYC and Rouses Pt, for example (not in service over the border) - for customs reasons mentioned that don't seem to make sense to me either. For the most part, Amtrak an fit "Montreal" passengers in the Amfleet II cars (there are two in the Adirondack consist at present). But travel from NYC to say Plattsburgh or Saratoga is popular and I think would hold up with descent business class travelers - but only with the 1/2 cafe and 1/2 business class. Amtrak should be able to find two of these cars for the Adirondack, especially since they are used for the short "Albany to NYC" runs on certain Empire Trains and Amtrak has largely removed these cars from Northeast Regional servie. And I stress "Northeast Regional" service. For example, the Vermonter or Palmetto is not your traditional "Northeast Regional" service since it travels "off the NEC."

I had this same thought about adding business class to this train a couple of years ago when I first rode the Adirondack. For what it's worth, I took the Vermonter up to Essex Junction ("Burlington") last week, and the business class section of the cafe car was completely filled prior to our arrival at ESX. That should be a worthwhile comparison datapoint.

GenePoon Wrote:
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> hsr_fan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >
> > Doesn't the Maple Leaf have business class?
>
>
> Only as far as CBN (Canadian Border NY). Beyond,
> to Toronto, only Coach. But note that beyond CBN,
> it's a VIA Rail Canada train. Not Amtrak. The
> Adirondack handles no intra-Canada traffic and is
> an all-Amtrak operation.

Technically true. But in fact you can book BC from
TWO to NYP and you will be boarded in the BC car in
TWO.

If you book Coach from TWO to NYP you will not be
boarded in the BC car. OTOH, if you travel only
between two points within Canada, you can travel in
any car on that train, since there VIA does not do
Business Class.

Jishnu.

People do ride across the border on the Maple Leaf in Business Class.
On the Montreal route, Customs doesn't allow it since they want the entire car cleared for interviews, and Amtrak hasn't the spine to stand up against them.

joemvcnj Wrote:
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> People do ride across the border on the Maple Leaf
> in Business Class.
> On the Montreal route, Customs doesn't allow it
> since they want the entire car cleared for
> interviews, and Amtrak hasn't the spine to stand
> up against them.


This is exactly the reason there is no Business Class on 68/69. Although I have been told by crew that its Canadian Border Protection who demands the full use of the cafe car for their "interviews," not US Customs. They even kick the Amtrak employees out while they do their work. We need the same system they use in Vancouver BC for the Cascades here on the Adirondack.