Passenger Trains > Story: Missed Amtrak E-ticket scan leads to free trip

The following was posted on another forum, discussing the ethics of "taking advantage"
of travel providers' mistakes:

Passenger name deleted, as we know there are Amtrak lurkers here.


> I just resolved, albeit unethically, a problem I've had with Amtrak.
> In August, I booked online a trip, at regular price minus weekend
> senior discount, from BWI to NWK in first class on the Acela. They
> were just switching to an e-ticket system. I took my seat and put my
> print-out in the clasp on my seat back. It seemed like the conductor
> had passed me without scanning it. The car attendant was in front of
> me, so I mentioned this to her, but she assured me he had scanned it.
> That evening I received an e-mail that I had a credit for being a
> no-show and I could get a partial refund or a full voucher.
>
> I immediately called and told them that I had taken the trip and was
> not due a voucher. Only my (Guest Rewards) points for having traveled were
> due me. I was told they would fix it. Well, 3 months later, after some heavy
> back-to-back traveling, I looked for my points, but they weren't in
> my account. There is a 90 day window in which you must discover a
> problem and I was just over that. I called and spoke to someone, who
> said I didn't get the points because I never took the trip. I still
> had a voucher waiting for me. After explaining the situation to her I
> was told I needed to call another number, but she could transfer me.
>
> After being on hold for 20 minutes, a recording told me I could leave
> a number and be called back. I decided to hang on. After another 20
> minutes, when the recording came on, I left my number. About a week
> later, they called me back, while my phone was recharging, and left a
> message with a phone number to call. I did, and waited on hold,
> expecting another directive to leave my number. None came. So, I set
> a timer for another hour. When it beeped, I hung up.
>
> I just finished using my voucher for another first class Acela trip.
> Unethical? Yes, but I don't have any guilt. I tried and my time is
> important to me. Ironically, the conductor went by me again without
> reading my ticket. (I must be invisible on a train.) This time I
> called him back over and he scanned it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/13 15:16 by GenePoon.

Sometimes this happens. On a non-rail matter, we bought some furniture here in New Mexico while we were still living back east, and my credit card was never charged despite their running it. I called this to the card company's attention, and they assured me they had receive nothing from the company. I called the company, and they were adamant they had run the card and all was OK. I then sent them a check, which they returned. At that point I gave up, although I feel a little funny whenever I see our piece of free furniture which is now back here in New Mexico.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/13 15:47 by Ptolemy.

You showed a lot more dedication to getting the problem resolved than I would have.

Sometimes conductors miss a ticket here or there, or think they've already done the scan, etc.

Ptolemy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sometimes this happens. On a non-rail matter, we
> bought some furniture here in New Mexico while we
> were still living back east, and my credit card
> was never charged despite their running it. I
> called this to the card company's attention, and
> they assured me they had receive nothing from the
> company. I called the company, and they were
> adamant they had run the card and all was OK. I
> then sent them a check, which they returned. At
> that point I gave up, although I feel a little
> funny whenever I see our piece of free furniture
> which is now back here in New Mexico.

========================================================================

Goes to show...stuff happens. I'm sure the author of the Amtrak E-ticket item knows it, too...the prime topic of the
blog item was ethics, not mistakes made by Amtrak. In her case, it was very early in the E-ticketing process and
there were, definitely, teething problems in the first few months. What's a little harder to comprehend,
for me and apparently for her, is that when she as a customer wanted to make it right with Amtrak, she couldn't
do it because the "customer service" desk was unreachable.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/13 17:30 by GenePoon.

I personally feel that guilt is not in order. The computer systems were devised to further profits for the credit card bank-owners and their business clients. Moreover, they were designed to hopefully get the customers to spend more overall. So, if the computer systems makes costly errors, the owners are fully responsible, not the customers. If they had kept the old systems that depended more on personnel, then there would be less such errors. So, in the words of Liberace when he was denounced by the critics: "I cried all the way to the bank."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/23/13 17:30 by railwaybaron.

I personally don't see any lack of ethics on the part of the traveller. He tried more than 99.99% of us would to get Amtrak to check him off as having travelled. The company basically told him they wanted him to take another trip on the house. End of story.

Posted from Android

God giveth and God giveth again ... you can't fight superior authority

Same thing happened to me right after E-ticketing came out. The conductor scanned my phone and after arriving in STL I got an email saying I was a no show. Made 5 phone calls to try and get my AGR points. To no avail. So I used the voucher. I even advised the ticket agent when getting my ticket she said many had encountered the same problem. If they would have simply credited my points I would have never used it.

Keith Hunter
FOREST CITY, IA

I wonder when Amtrak will figure out that 10 trips are becoming 11 and 12 trips because of confusion over scanning, punching, lifting, and validity by the conductors.

I once paid my water bill with a $25 check but the water company accidently deposited it as a $50 check and the Bank cashed it as such, deducting $50 from my account. When I brought this to the attention of both the water company and the Bank, both apologized repeatedly and both credited me $25. I attempted to get the water company to drop the refund, but after six months, I get up. I did get $25 in free water for my troubles!!!

"Sir, please don't confuse me with the facts, my mind is made up!"

RailNet802, owevaaaah

And Amtrak Julie says, Got it!

Amtrak leaving money on the table ? AGAIN ? (I'm shocked, shocked).
They'd rather cut costs $1 than gain revenue $2.
They would have gotten one phone call from me and nothing more.

There was no need to even call.

Consider this a frequent rider discount.

Back when long distance could be a little pricey, I would wait until I was at work and in a hotel before settling down and making phone calls. It was not particularly cost effective, but I needed the printed record for tax records. In the morning, I would pay the bill, and get a printout from the hotel, in this case the New York Sheraton. On every occasion when I was in the hotel, the calls would not show up on my bill in the morning! I would have them recheck, but never was there any record. I would get them to print a receipt showing I had paid in case it came up later, and go on my way. Also, at this same hotel, I would occasionally have a meal in their restaurant and about once a year, when I paid with American Express, nothing would appear on my bill the following month, or ever. I would always query both the hotel and American Express but nothing ever appeared.

Later the Sheraton left the building and the Omni took over and I don't know what it is now, but it was quite a nice older hotel.

If the original (original) poster made a stink to get their guest rewards points and plans to use them that would be unethical. If they did not and simply used the voucher, then I see no problem. Using the voucher vs the guest points is basically a wash ( yeah he's getting a little more value out of the voucher than the points) but if this person takes Amtrak as much as it seems, it will pay off for Amtrak in the long run.

a737flyer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Back when long distance could be a little pricey,
> I would wait until I was at work and in a hotel
> before settling down and making phone calls. It
> was not particularly cost effective, but I needed
> the printed record for tax records. In the
> morning, I would pay the bill, and get a printout
> from the hotel, in this case the New York
> Sheraton. On every occasion when I was in the
> hotel, the calls would not show up on my bill in
> the morning! I would have them recheck, but never
> was there any record. I would get them to print a
> receipt showing I had paid in case it came up
> later, and go on my way. Also, at this same
> hotel, I would occasionally have a meal in their
> restaurant and about once a year, when I paid with
> American Express, nothing would appear on my bill
> the following month, or ever. I would always
> query both the hotel and American Express but
> nothing ever appeared.
>
> Later the Sheraton left the building and the Omni
> took over and I don't know what it is now, but it
> was quite a nice older hotel.

Many outside phone management systems will only batch their records and update the hotel every 24 hours, etc. If you miss their cutoff window at your check out, there's a delayed charge on your card. Much like a hotel charging you for damage to your room after you've checked out, or a rental car company finding that bloody body in the trunk of the rental car, or 20 parking tickets you accumulated.

TS2010 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Using the voucher vs the guest points is basically
> a wash ( yeah he's getting a little more value out
> of the voucher than the points) but if this person
> takes Amtrak as much as it seems, it will pay off
> for Amtrak in the long run.


The way I calculate the value of the Guest Rewards points vs. the full value
of the voucher, it is far from a wash.

The voucher is worth far more. You do not get a 100% return on Guest Rewards points
value, vs. the price of the ticket you bought and used to earn them. That would amount
to a Buy One-Get One Free situation.

Information is that Amtrak has tightened up on policies and rewritten procedures since
the early days of E-Ticketing, which were fraught with more problems than had been
anticipated.

I took a RT Springfield to Chicago in October, and when I switched from coach to the NY sleeper to be at the rear of the train, the conductor never scanned my ticket. 2 hours later, I found him and explained I didn't want the computer to treat me as a no-show, thereby cancelling the rest of my reservation. He said he talked with my sleeping car attendant if #2 had showed up. Upon his confirmation, he simply marked it 'scanned' in his computer.

As Amtraks' noshow policy has been tightened since the e-ticket startup, I definitely want to make sure I get my ticket scanned every time I board. With my luck, if I didn't get it scanned, I'd probably lose both the money paid for the ticket (sleeper, often), and have the AGR points -subtracted- for the trip I didn't take.

BRAtkinson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I took a RT Springfield to Chicago in October, and
> when I switched from coach to the NY sleeper to be
> at the rear of the train, the conductor never
> scanned my ticket. 2 hours later, I found him and
> explained I didn't want the computer to treat me
> as a no-show, thereby cancelling the rest of my
> reservation. He said he talked with my sleeping
> car attendant if #2 had showed up. Upon his
> confirmation, he simply marked it 'scanned' in his
> computer.
>
> As Amtraks' noshow policy has been tightened since
> the e-ticket startup, I definitely want to make
> sure I get my ticket scanned every time I board.
> With my luck, if I didn't get it scanned, I'd
> probably lose both the money paid for the ticket
> (sleeper, often), and have the AGR points
> -subtracted- for the trip I didn't take.


There has been some discussion on other boards that Amtrak has in some cases done a complete scan of all tickets issued for a particular train run, without regard to individual ticket scans of passengers on board. That would solve this problem, but create a new one, to the extent Amtrak wishes to offer more lenient terms to persons who have a reservation but do not travel. Perhaps Amtrak should simply require people in that situation to cancel before train departure time, with all other ticket revenue forfeited through a complete scan.