Passenger Trains > The Dismal Amtrak 448

Posted to another discussion board:

> I normally ride 449 (49) and (48) 448 between Boston and Chicago once
> or twice a year and connect to some western trains in Chicago. Nos.
> 449 and 49 have not been much of a problem. They can be an hour or
> two late but I have never missed a Chicago connection because of
> that. With no Boston-Chicago through cars for the past year or so,
> 449 is a bit of a pain because at Albany passengers are rousted out
> of 449 and have to go up to the station to wait before boarding 49.
> One time in May of 2015 the sleeping cars for 49 were on the rear and
> sleeping car passengers got to board first. In all other times I
> have been there the sleepers were at the front and coach passengers
> from 449 got to board 49 first and sleeper passengers had to wait for
> what seemed to be another half hour or so until 49 did a reverse move
> so that the sleeping cars were at a platform and they could board.
> An interesting class reversal.
>
> But coming east it is sad to see how often 448 just gets no respect
> and I wish the good folks at Amtrak, CSX and MBTA could confer and
> see if this could be improved. The completion of the monumental
> track work at ALB is supposed to resolve much of this problem but I
> have heard that before and who knows when this project will be
> completed (the present word is October, 2016).
>
> When I was on 48 on May 18, it arrived at Albany one hour and two
> minutes late at 4:02 P.M. and departed 44 minutes late at 4:29 P.M.
> Not too bad in my opinion.
>
> But 448 was another story. It was not at the station on the arrival
> of 48. Passengers for 448 were rousted out of 48 and sent to the
> station to wait, and wait and wait with no 448 in sight. Other
> trains to Niagara Falls, etc. were free to come and go and tie up
> the precious platform space at Albany. I have seen this happen
> before so I guess these other trains are considered far more
> essential than 448.
>
> Finally about 5:00 P.M. since there were evidently no other priority
> trains in the vicinity, 448 arrrived at a platform and passengers
> boarded and the train departed Albany 2 hours and nine minutes late
> at 5:14 P.M. Since the train was only about 2 hours late, I
> initially felt I might have some chance to catch the 10:15 P.M.
> Concord Coach lines bus to Maine.
>
> Station stops at Pittsfield and Worcester were handled quickly
> although we lost another ten minutes or so en route. I was no longer
> confident of making the 10:15 bus but was confident of making the
> last bus to Maine at 11:15 P.M.
>
> But then Worcester - what a disaster that place is. 448 stopped a
> mile or so west of Worcester about 8:55 P.M. We then waited for
> FORTY MINUTES before moving again and finally arriving at the station
> at 9:37 P.M. A westbound CSX freight went by about 9:15 but that did
> not appear to resolve anything. Instead it appears that MBTA 537
> arrives at Worcester at 8:55 P.M. and its equipment apparently ties
> up what must be the single station track there. The MBTA crew then
> goes on a break (according to a cell phone call from a person who was
> waiting at the station for his father who was on 448) and finally
> goes back on duty and departs as MBTA 540 at 9:30 P.M. This
> apparently is a common occurence and the track infrastructure at
> Worcester is evdiently so pathetic that there are no other options.
>
> The final insult was when we arrived near South Station and were held
> outside for two or three minutes while someone was evidently figuring
> out what to do. Arrival was 3 hours 8 minutes late at 11:09 P.M. and
> by some fast walking and prayers I was able to make the last Concord
> Coach lines bus to Maine at 11:15 P.M. and avoid a night in South
> Station to await the first bus to Maine the next day at 5:45 A.M.
> (My wife and I and about a dozen other passengers from 448 spent the
> night in South Station in May 2015 when 448 arrived at South Station
> at 1 or 2 A.M. It is not something to look forward to.)
>
> I know that at times 448 arrives early or on time. I have never been
> fortunate enough to ride it on those occasions. My impression is
> that Amtrak officials must never ride 448 to see what a dismal
> operation it is.

Okay.  Worcester is slated to get a second platform, I think. 
I do have to wonder, though, that if this were an airline forum, how much Mr. Poon would be posting "disasters".  I think he'd be a lot busier than he is now.

sums007 Wrote:
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> I do have to wonder, though, that if this were an
> airline forum, how much Mr. Poon would be posting
> "disasters".  I think he'd be a lot busier than
> he is now.

US airlines carried 662 million passengers domestically in 2014, Amtrak 31 million.  If there were not more "disasters" a day on the airlines, Amtrak would really be doing something wrong.


Source for airline passengers:  http://www.rita.dot.gov/bts/press_releases/bts015_15

sums007 Wrote:
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> Okay.  Worcester is slated to get a second
> platform, I think. 
> I do have to wonder, though, that if this were an
> airline forum, how much Mr. Poon would be posting
> "disasters".  I think he'd be a lot busier than
> he is now.

I have heard nothing of a second platform for Worcester. I have seen in the past where the T will pull in, unload and pull west so Amtrak can get in, but I have only seen that done twice. Usually, Amtrak just has to wait. I have also seen the T push east to allow Amtrak to platform, then Amtrak backs out and proceeds down track 1, but again I have only seen that once too.

No one said this was a "disaster." "Dismal" is a pretty apt description. I think someone needs to die before it's a real "disaster."  Sadly, Amtrak leads in the "disaster" count in recent years even with their tiny share of the U.S. travel market as the only airline deaths have been from passengers expiring from natural causes on board. 

I'm not going to pretend to know what happened here. But from a passenger's point of view, this could be a "never again" type of trip. We are told these people don't exist by the Amtrak fans on here. Rest assured, they do. 

In the past, 448/449 have often been bustituted to allow CSX to perform track maintenance. I wonder why Amtrak doesn't make this permanent via use of Amtrak Thruway bus service with four dedicated buses: one each from A/R to Pittsfield, Springfield, Worcester, and Boston (Framingham could be reached via transfer to MBTA at Worcester). LSL 448 scheduled transit times between A/R and Springfield, Worcester, and Boston are 2.5 hrs, 3.5 hrs, and 5 hrs, respectively (there is a bit of padding in the Boston transit time). Peter Pan Bus Lines' schedules vary (they offer a few departures each day) but buses can make these same trips in 2 hrs, 2.5 hrs, and 3.5 hrs, respectively per schedule. Bus companies and Amtrak already use jointly Pittsfield's Joseph Scelsi Intermodal Transportation Center, majestic Worcester Union Station, and Boston South Station as terminals, and I think buses and Amtrak will be using the same terminal in Springfield as well when the new station constuction is completed. 

Because train passengers do not want to ride a bus.  I did the trip last fall during one of the CSX maintenance closures.  There were five(5) people on the express bus to South Station.  Five!  On even the slowest days there are many more than five folks detraining from 448 at Boston.  Folks just don't want to deal with the bus and they rebook to other dates if they are able, or they seek an alternate mode.

To my point, I considered canceling the return trip and flying home, but stuck with the bus.  It was not that bad, but let's face it, the bus is not so comfortable as the train and when people are taking the train somewhere they do not want to ride a bus instead.


JPB Wrote:
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> In the past, 448/449 have often been bustituted to
> allow CSX to perform track maintenance. I wonder
> why Amtrak doesn't make this permanent via use of
> Amtrak Thruway bus service with four dedicated
> buses: one each from A/R to Pittsfield,
> Springfield, Worcester, and Boston (Framingham
> could be reached via transfer to MBTA at
> Worcester). LSL 448 scheduled transit times
> between A/R and Springfield, Worcester, and Boston
> are 2.5 hrs, 3.5 hrs, and 5 hrs, respectively
> (there is a bit of padding in the Boston transit
> time). Peter Pan Bus Lines' schedules vary (they
> offer a few departures each day) but buses can
> make these same trips in 2 hrs, 2.5 hrs, and 3.5
> hrs, respectively per schedule. Bus companies and
> Amtrak already use jointly Pittsfield's Joseph
> Scelsi Intermodal Transportation Center, majestic
> Worcester Union Station, and Boston South Station
> as terminals, and I think buses and Amtrak will be
> using the same terminal in Springfield as well
> when the new station constuction is completed. 

Chessie1963 Wrote:
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> Because train passengers do not want to ride a
> bus.  I did the trip last fall during one of the
> CSX maintenance closures.  There were five(5)
> people on the express bus to South Station.
>  Five!  On even the slowest days there are many
> more than five folks detraining from 448 at
> Boston.  Folks just don't want to deal with the
> bus and they rebook to other dates if they are
> able, or they seek an alternate mode.
>
> To my point, I considered canceling the return
> trip and flying home, but stuck with the bus.  It
> was not that bad, but let's face it, the bus is
> not so comfortable as the train and when people
> are taking the train somewhere they do not want to
> ride a bus instead.
>
>
Not sure I agree. I've ridden Go Bus between Boston area and NYP area in mid-town Manhattan and would do it again in a heartbeat. Sure, a train ride is more fun and the coach seat is roomier but if one is trying to get from point A to point B in an urban corridor on his own dime, a cheaper bus ride ($20 v. $100 fare purchased day before departure) of similar duration (or much shorter in case of A/R to BOS) will suffice. I'm guessing far more people ride Peter Pan's multiple bus trips in the A/R-Boston corridor v. 448/449's single trip of two coaches. And Amtrak Thruway apparently is a popular, sustainable means for connecting to Amtrak trains across the US network to cities not served by train, esp in California.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amtrak_Thruway_Motorcoach

As Chessie1963 clearly stated...train passengers do not want to ride a bus.  Living in the Springfield MA area, I've been 'first-class-only coach car substitute for sleeper SPG-ALB' once (prior to using a lounge/business class car in its place), and ridden the substitute SPG-NHV bus a good number of times while they are re-double tracking HFD-NHV.  More than a year ago, the 2 car shuttle trains I rode consistently had 20-30 passengers SPG-HFD and a good 30-40 board at HFD, and maybe another 10-20 board between HFD and NHV.  The northbound train 476 shuttle from NHV (5:20PM) was usually packed (150+ passengers)...sometimes with a couple of standees!  I rode the bus version of 476 last week.  We had maybe 15 on the (my) WND/WNL/SPG bus, perhaps 35 to Hartford (far from full), and another 20-25 on the Wallingford/Meriden/Berlin bus. 

In short, using buses instead of trains cuts the patronage by half or more!  I'm speculating as well that passengers that would have ridden from, say, WAS, PHL, or NYP to Hartford line stations but didn't want to be bused, drove their car to New Haven (and paid dearly for parking or had their wife drop them off/pick them up) or drove the entire way, thus depriving Amtrak of passengers on the connecting NEC trains.  Based on what I observed on Train 76 from NYP and it's lighter than usual load, I'm thinking those possible passengers opted for the interstate.

48 arrived Albany 5 minutes late today, 448 departed 32 minutes late.  

Sad.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/16 14:03 by Chessie1963.

Amtrak's NEC is very susceptible to passengers deciding to drive all the way, rather than drive to the train. 

I used to take the train from Newark NJ to Wilmington DE and Baltimore MD on a regular basis, at least twice monthly. It wasn't cheap, and there was a $25 parking fee at Newark Penn.  Wilmington was easy, get off the train and walk uphill to the office. Baltimore, too.

But, every once in a while, I'd have to go out to Owings Mills, etc. And, I'd drive.  Driving in from the suburbs, paying to park, paying for the train, paying for 2 cabs, that gets expensive right away.

The NEC is not a bottomless cash cow for other Amtrak operations, its customers can avail themselves of many alternatives. Plane, buses, private cars, or Skype...