Passenger Trains > IL: Wait for 110mph rolls into 2018

Local business notes: The wait for 110-mph Amtrak rolls into 2018
State Journal-Register
By Tim Landis
Business Editor
Nov 18, 2017

The Illinois Department of Transportation is now looking at 2018 for the start of AMTRAK service up to 110 mph on the Chicago-St. Louis corridor.

Early on in the seven-year, $2 billion high-speed rail project, the goal was faster service on much of the corridor by the end of 2017. But as is often the case with major projects, construction has taken longer than anticipated. A big piece of remaining work is along the Third Street/Union Pacific rail corridor in Springfield. Five crossings were shut down in the last few weeks toward plans for safety fencing, signal and gate upgrades, and crossing improvements along the corridor from Stanford Avenue to Sangamon Avenue. The city of Springfield has started the process of applying for a federal “quiet zone” of no train horns, once safety improvements are completed.

The state has not set a target date for 110 mph service, other than sometime next year. Trains began running at speeds up to 110 mph in 2012 between Pontiac and Dwight.

http://www.sj-r.com/news/20171118/local-business-notes-wait-for-110-mph-amtrak-rolls-into-2018

GenePoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Local business notes: The wait for 110-mph Amtrak
> rolls into 2018
> State Journal-Register
> By Tim Landis
> Business Editor
> Nov 18, 2017
>
> The Illinois Department of Transportation is now
> looking at 2018 for the start of AMTRAK service up
> to 110 mph on the Chicago-St. Louis corridor.
>
> Early on in the seven-year, $2 billion high-speed
> rail project, the goal was faster service on much
> of the corridor by the end of 2017. But as is
> often the case with major projects, construction
> has taken longer than anticipated. A big piece of
> remaining work is along the Third Street/Union
> Pacific rail corridor in Springfield. Five
> crossings were shut down in the last few weeks
> toward plans for safety fencing, signal and gate
> upgrades, and crossing improvements along the
> corridor from Stanford Avenue to Sangamon Avenue.
> The city of Springfield has started the process of
> applying for a federal “quiet zone” of no
> train horns, once safety improvements are
> completed.
>
> The state has not set a target date for 110 mph
> service, other than sometime next year. Trains
> began running at speeds up to 110 mph in 2012
> between Pontiac and Dwight.
>
> http://www.sj-r.com/news/20171118/local-business-n
> otes-wait-for-110-mph-amtrak-rolls-into-2018

Note that Illinois and UP are not Washington and BNSF. On December 18, we start new service as a result of about 800 Megabucks of projects that were finished on time and within budget. The start of service was delayed for two months for a Sound Transit project (that DelMonteX is covering so well) that was started after the rest and is needed for the rest of it to work.

TAW

IF and when 110 mph service is inaugurated over a significant portion of the Chicago - St. Louis corridor, those high speed Charger locomotives will still be dragging tired, inadequate Horizon cars up and down the line. The mismanagement of this project has been disgraceful, if not criminal.

Really, what does the State of Illinois have to show after years and years of "investment"? Certainly not a service that is attracting substantial numbers of new riders.

stuporchief Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> (SNIP) The mismanagement of
> this project has been disgraceful, if not
> criminal.
>
> Really, what does the State of Illinois have to
> show after years and years of "investment"?
> Certainly not a service that is attracting
> substantial numbers of new riders.

Back to Ray LaHood when he was asked about this as Transportation Secretary.

"It's a jobs project, not a transportation project." That's at least the second rail improvement project he's had his hands in.

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> stuporchief Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > (SNIP) The mismanagement of
> > this project has been disgraceful, if not
> > criminal.
> >
> > Really, what does the State of Illinois have to
> > show after years and years of "investment"?
> > Certainly not a service that is attracting
> > substantial numbers of new riders.
>
> Back to Ray LaHood when he was asked about this as
> Transportation Secretary.
>
> "It's a jobs project, not a transportation
> project." That's at least the second rail
> improvement project he's had his hands in.

Some folks at FRA were a bit miffed, let's say, at Washington State for developing their own program from scratch without federal help. (800 Megabucks on time and budget with the service improvements happening as promised) It appears that was a smart move.

TAW

TAW Wrote:

>
> Some folks at FRA were a bit miffed, let's say, at
> Washington State for developing their own program
> from scratch without federal help. (800 Megabucks
> on time and budget with the service improvements
> happening as promised) It appears that was a smart
> move.
>
Who needs FRA, anyway?

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> stuporchief Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
>
> Back to Ray LaHood when he was asked about this as
> Transportation Secretary.
>
> "It's a jobs project, not a transportation
> project." That's at least the second rail
> improvement project he's had his hands in.

LaHood, another Illinoisan who thinks we have a monarchy.
His sòn now holds a seat in congress after the rug was pulled
out from under his predecessor.

Hood the elder did nothing to help retain the hundreds of Amtrak jobs
that were lost in Chicago when the reservation office was moved to California.
His kind is only interested in job creation when there are "benefits".

My countdown clock is now set to December 31, 2018.

Lies, lies and more lies. I don't think any of the plans called for 110 mph on
Third St. through downtown Springfield, especially with a station stop. So that is
totally irrelevant to miles and miles of track through the corn fields that are not
now and never will be 110 mph. I hereby call for a Special Prosecutor!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/17 11:28 by Englewood.

7 years is just too much time to justify any excuses (other than political BS).

Yes, the 200+ miles of track between Joliet and Alton had to be completely rebuilt -- but modern track laying machines can accomplish about 1 mile per day of this work (i.e. removing the existing line, and laying a brand new railroad).

I'm not sure about the new signaling -- but, 200 miles is not that long. Not like 2,000 miles from Chicago to L.A. for example.

Anyway, how long did it ACTUALLY take Amtrak the complete similar 110mph work on the 90 miles they own to Niles, Mich.?

ronald321 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 7 years is just too much time to justify any
> excuses (other than political BS).
>
> Yes, the 200+ miles of track between Joliet and
> Alton had to be completely rebuilt -- but modern
> track laying machines can accomplish about 1 mile
> per day of this work (i.e. removing the existing
> line, and laying a brand new railroad).
>
> I'm not sure about the new signaling -- but, 200
> miles is not that long. Not like 2,000 miles from
> Chicago to L.A. for example.
>
> Anyway, how long did it ACTUALLY take Amtrak the
> complete similar 110mph work on the 90 miles they
> own to Niles, Mich.?


Wasn't part of the problem the UP's TRT 909 (track renewal equipment) wasn't available 24/7? Maybe the state of Illinois should have bought their own...

FWIR the City of Springfield has never really been in favor of the entire high speed rail project.



Allen



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/17 12:39 by bradleymckay.

This whole project has been so awful from the start. The original estimates were that high speed rail would be running by 2014, it has basically been delayed ever since. My understanding is currently even the Pontiac - Dwight leg which had been running 110 is now back down to 79 mph restrictions.

So what do we have after 7 years and billions of dollars?

Everyone town along the line has a pretty new station, except Springfield because they can't decide which line to run through town on. Normal managed to convince the federal government to build them a $50 million city hall and call it a train station.

Union Pacific has a top of the industry rail line with concrete ties and many additional new sidings. Before this project, there was virtually no freight other than locals, now UP runs at least two daily intermodals each direction and a mixed freight each direction each day, in addition to locals.

There are miles and miles and miles of black iron fence through every town along the line.

We have the exact same engines and cars running the exact same timetable. The new chargers are nice, but can't lead yet. We will eventually get new passenger cars but they will only be single level.

There is still the issue of congestion between Alton and St. Louis and Joliet - Chicago. Very little (if anything) has been done to this portion of the tracks. So the trains will run really fast through the farm country, then potentially crawl into the station.

while there are more sidings than in the past, the line is still principally single track. So you still have the issue of passenger trains sitting on sidings waiting for Amtrak trains in the opposite direction to pass. The southbound train 301 has to pass northbound trains 300, 302, and 22 every day on its journey to St. Louis.

Like mentioned earlier in the thread. This project has created a whole bunch of high paying union jobs, and not much else.
The fact that no one can give an estimated new date other than "sometime in 2018" tells you how far we are from really having high speed rail.

kbmiflyer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> while there are more sidings than in the past, the
> line is still principally single track. So you
> still have the issue of passenger trains sitting
> on sidings waiting for Amtrak trains in the
> opposite direction to pass. The southbound train
> 301 has to pass northbound trains 300, 302, and 22
> every day on its journey to St. Louis.
>

Those meets should be in the timetable. However, this is America and we don't do that here. We know better than everyone else.

TAW

they actually are built in the timetable, I am just pointing out the fallacy of running 110 mph then running 0 mph for 5 minutes while you wait for a train to pass.

I'm sure there are folks who have lots to show for a billion in taxpayer investments. New houses, Swiss bank accounts, etc.

Posted from Android

kbmiflyer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> they actually are built in the timetable, I am
> just pointing out the fallacy of running 110 mph
> then running 0 mph for 5 minutes while you wait
> for a train to pass.


That would depend upon the skill of the person who designed the infrastructure and the one who timetabled it. Given everything else associated with the project, I don't have high hopes. In general, single track for that service is not necessarily bad practice. Not doing it right is.

TAW

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sure there are folks who have lots to show for
> a billion in taxpayer investments. New houses,
> Swiss bank accounts, etc.
>

...which would not include the people who actually did the work.

TAW

Things that should be noted.

1) On the Chicago-St. Louis route the Illinois Central was safely doing over 110 MPH with its "Green Diamond" in the 1930's.
2) There is no performance standard in the contract with the UP. Their long freight trains will not be compatible with higher speed service.
3) Our (Illinois) last governor was (and is) a moron who, I swear, was the inspiration for Homer Simpson.
4) Our (Illinois) governor before him is now doing 14 years in a Federal prison.
5) Our (Illinois) governor before the one doing 14 years in a Federal prison did six years in Federal prison.
6) Our state (Illinois) is basically controlled by the Speaker of The House. He's been there for decades. The chief law enforcement officer for our state (Attorney General) is his daughter.

Is there any question as to why this is screwed up or as to why many people are fleeing Illinois.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/17 18:08 by Greyhounds.

Exactly.

Greyhounds Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Things that should be noted.
>
> 1) On the Chicago-St. Louis route the Illinois
> Central was safely doing over 110 MPH with its
> "Green Diamond" in the 1930's.
> 2) There is no performance standard in the
> contract with the UP. Their long freight trains
> will not be compatible with higher speed service.
> 3) Our (Illinois) last governor was (and is) a
> moron who, I swear, was the inspiration for Homer
> Simpson.
> 4) Our (Illinois) governor before him is now doing
> 14 years in a Federal prison.
> 5) Our (Illinois) governor before the one doing 14
> years in a Federal prison did six years in Federal
> prison.
> 6) Our state (Illinois) is basically controlled by
> the Speaker of The House. He's been there for
> decades. The chief law enforcement officer for
> our state (Attorney General) is his daughter.
>
> Is there any question as to why this is screwed up
> or as to why many people are fleeing Illinois.

Best government money can buy...

Posted from Android

As for factoring actual delays with opposing Amtrak trains,
here it is from the horse's mouth

---

Thanks for pointing out the Friends of Railroad Administrators (FRA) are part of this. Former FRA Administrator Szabo made proclamations on Feb 15th, 2012 while riding the first 110 MPH Wolverine train between Porter Jct. and Kalamazoo...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qwQC2mq38PwbUt4gmKjngzVI-tQaz2kI/view?usp=sharing

110 MPH operation has never been extended east of the Zoo. And the small section of 110 MPH operation near Dwight, IL has now been terminated. It's five years later, and we have the same ole boondoggle after millions have been spent.

The full article also mentions ridership losses on the Saluki.. Do ya think OTP has a part in that? See the pdf for details, OPT is a big fat F.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1k7YdNnBFSXJYC3hlnknMEJ4Wdb2mNRRs/view?usp=sharing