Passenger Trains > Speeds Finally Increased Between Alton & St. Louis

Effective June 2, 2020 passenger speeds on the UP between Lenox and Q (simplified summary):

- Lenox to WR on track 2 mostly increased from 30 to 79 mph (track 1 has always been 79).
- WR to Q on track 2 mostly increased from 60 to 79 mph.
- WR to Venice on track 1 mostly increased from 40 to 79 mph (Venice to Q still mostly 25 mph).

Note that the "High Speed" track work was completed on this segment several years ago, but UP just now got around to raising some of the speeds.
 

How many hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars went to the UP for the Chicago-St Louis 110mph higher speed passenger line? UP got a freight line rebuilt. The rest of us are still waiting for higher speed Amtrak trains.

Note that this is the fairly short section from Alton to St. Louis, which is not even part of the "high speed rail" initiative.  The 110 mile section from Alton to Joliet remains at the 79 mph, now going on 10 years after construction was started.

GN 1969

I wish it were only "hundreds of millions".  I think it was $2 Billion.

Even with the good news above -- I noticed the NB track from Venice is still 25mph (used to be 79mph).,
This is painful because I think this track (owned by the KCS) has been rebuilt also -- and it's arrow straight FOR THE MOST PART.

But, this doesn't mean Amtrak will be allowed by UP to increase speeds.  The entire route from Alton to Joliet has been rebuilt to 110
years ago -- but no speed ups allowed.

Getting the speeds up to 79 from St. Louis to Alton is definately a start. Hopefully travel time will be reduced off the schedule and passengers will see the reflection in the timetable. Now for the 110 mph running-that has been long promised and it still hasn't happened yet. Much of the Lincoln Corridor is very straight with plenty of spacing between stations to get Amtrak trains up to 110 mph. That's where business travelers heading from CHI-STL and all points in between will notice substantial improvements in the travel time.

Only 110 MPH? ZZZzzzz

I think before the 110 mph, the stretches that are supposed to be 110 are going to be 90 first.

This is good news. The trackage between Lenox, WR Tower in Granite City, and Q Tower at the north approach to the MacArthur Bridge over the Mississippi has just been torture to ride for years. Ridden it many times, and it has always been painful. I can't count the number of times I've heard Mr. or Ms. Average Passenger wonder aloud and complain about it

Now for the rest of the line...... Realizing the results of the outlandish expenditure is still so apparently far away. But hey, it's a classic Illinois pork barrel project, so what the heck? (Former resident and well-bled taxpayer, so I can say it). And I still want to know who got to line his pockets with pure gold from the fencing contract.....I didn't know there was so much black-painted ornamental fencing in the galaxy.

MC
Muskegon, Michigan

Ironmtn:

You have described this situation beautifully.  Like you, I have ridden between Alton and St. Louis many  times (grew up there).  And I know
how painful it is to drag along at 25mph on track that used to be 79mph.. 

Let me describe the Chi-St.Louis re-build --so everyone can see  that something is seriously wrong here,

. the track between Joliet and Alton has been completely rebuilt to a high standard..  The track is beautiful--as good as anything on the NEC.
4-quadrant gates are everywhere; many new stations; many miles of hi-quality fencing; many road crossings completely rebuilt.
In short--the line is georgeous.

$2B spent to speed up trains--yet no trains have been seeded up -- even after 10 years of work.  WHY?  Something is SO wrong.

My personal view is -- since no sane person would accomplish all this rebuilding (a damn good job,too), and then not use it.  Something is stopping it.
It might be the airlines flying the route (Southwest, mainly) are afraid of fast trains here, because they know what Acela did to them,

(if the U.P. is stopping it--then, I hope the Federal Government files suite against them to get their $2B back, for obstructing the intended purpose of this rebuilding).

 

ronald321 Wrote:
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> $2B spent to speed up trains--yet no trains have
> been seeded up -- even after 10 years of work. 
> WHY?  Something is SO wrong.
>

As I have said many times the political interest in the project ended
with the photo op of Durbin and Quinn pointing to the speedometer
in the office car reading 111mph.  

The project was nothing but a political stunt.  It was obviously not about
higher speed rail.  It was about jobs and contracts.  What does $2B matter to
a politician when it is not his money?  Especially if it buys him 5 railfan
votes in the next election.

I would much rather see the FBI investigating this travesty instead of
going after rich moms who bought their worthless kids way into college. 
 

kbmiflyer Wrote:
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> Note that this is the fairly short section from
> Alton to St. Louis, which is not even part of the
> "high speed rail" initiative.  

Goes to show the amateurishness and lack of railroad 
operating knowledge involved with the (never) higher speed project.

You should go after the "easy pickings" areas first where you get the
biggest bang for the buck.  Raise the 25's and 40's to 79.  Don't worry
about going from 79 to higher until you have the "permanent slow orders"
fixed.  

Of course, the project was really about spending lots of money, not high speed rail.

BTW, where are the new cars?

The "high speed" track will need new ties, grade crossing renewal and track resurfacing 
by the time any trains turn a wheel at high speed equipment is ready.  

Why is the UP not allowing 110 mph speed? Must be some issue  about frequency of track inspection is what I have heard.

Our government here in Illinois is really good at spending and wasting billions of dollars. We are at a 7 billion deficit this year and hundreds of billions in underfunded pensions. I've rode the train to Chicago and St Louis many times and just shake my head at the waste of my tax money
Joe

Don't miss the point.

This money was NOT WASTED.  It was spent  on building BEAUTIFUL TRACK from scratch.   The old GM&O track is in superb condition (Alton-Joliet)

It's been rebuilt.  The waste is NOT USING IT.. 

I've stated my view-- I think either Southwest or the U.P. have put pressure on Illinois politicians to stop  faster trains.-- and they have been doing this for 10 years.

Some will say this is conspiratorial -- but why else would you complete a project of this magnitude--and then not benefit from the the work.

There is the point stated earlier. Politicians love to spend our money period. Our property taxes just took another big jump here so they always want more of our money to spend.
Joe

With apologies to Roto-Rooter. “Booondogle! That’s the game, and away goes money down the UP drain!”
As Englewood stated the easiest way to go fast is to not go slow, but that ain’t fancy, so you get some of the “fastest” railroad in the USA to run grain trains on. Pretty neat photo ops and Lance Fritz thanks the nice people of Illinois for helping the operating ratio.

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Even if 110 mph isn't offered by the time this year is over, I hope that 90 mph speeds are offerred. I have ridden between CHI-STL twice and that was both on the Texas Eagle. The first time was in August of 2010 and it felt pretty good doing 79 mph almost nonstop from Joliet to Alton. The engineer was blowing the horn probably every few minutes at the most. The last time I rode the Texas Eagle in April of 2015, we did poorly on on time keeping the majority of the trip from CHI-STL. We had to sit in multiple sidings to await UP freights. UP was not generous to us. When we got south of Alton, things didn't get much better. 

It's great that several of the grade crossings use the quadrant gate system and that is very important when we are talking about a route that runs fast passenger trains. Here in the Northeast, there are still grade crossings on the north end of the NEC-one in Waterford called Minors Lane. The trains zip pretty fast through here. In New London, there are three grade crossings-Bank Street Connector, Water Street(I think), and Governor Winthrop Blvd. In New London, all of the NER trains stop there but many Acelas skip that station but are doing probably about 30 mph. The next few grade crossings after NLC are in Mystic with one of them being at the Mystic Station. This one is Broadway Ave Ext. East of Mystic, the last few grade crossings are in Stonington. I believe that Acelas do 65 through Mystic and Stonington. Much of the right of way through Mystic is a very sharp curve. Plus the trains have to cross the Mystic River Drawbridge which slows them down. It's understandable from an engineering perspective why they have to slow down a little.

Anyway the NEC in NLC and MYS and the Lincoln Corridor are two different stretches of tracks.

Before you start throwing blame around, take a close look at FRA orders on speed limits since the rebuild.  

Jmhemmer:

Don't tease us.  Tell  us what these FRA orders are.

I can't imagine the FRA would issue orders stopping the intended purpose of this major project.

 

The current hold up with speed increases is IETMS. Something that didn’t exist when this project was started.

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