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Passenger Trains > West Quincy Zephyr Wye


Date: 06/27/20 01:02
West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: justalurker66

Each night the Illinois Zephyr wyes at West Quincy Missouri and spends the night on a special stub siding in the BNSF yard before returning to Quincy Illinois in the morning to begin passenger service. I am looking for more information on the wye operation.

The wye appears to be manual ... no CPs on the connection track. I am assuming that the train stops at the wye just west of the West Quincy CP, the conductor reverses the switch, the train passes, the conductor normals the switch and walks around the curve to the next switch, reverse switch, let train pass, normal switch, then board and ride the train as it backs in to West Quincy. (Good so far?) I have seen a few pictures of Amtrak using the wye and it appears that the first move is on the connector track. The challenge comes when approaching West Quincy. The legs of the wye run parallel in to West Quincy and the train would need to run past the CP, back east through the CP, then back west through the CP to reach the stub siding. Is this procedure correct?

The other thought looking at the layout would be to pass through West Quincy first then back down the Hannibal Sub past the wye, go forward over the connector back to the Brookfield Sub, then back through West Quincy to the pocket track. Still four moves. There does not seem to be a left hand crossover before the pocket track that would allow a train to wye in two moves.

So, am I reading the layout correctly?



Date: 06/27/20 01:40
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: Sp1110

Do Amtrak conductors have keys to unlock BN padlocks?



Date: 06/27/20 05:27
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: mp51w

Sp1110 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do Amtrak conductors have keys to unlock BN
> padlocks?

Yes!



Date: 06/27/20 06:43
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: MNNRfan

Amtrak T&E Crews are given switch keys to the railroads they operate over. (Ex. A crew out of St Cloud, MN would have keys for BNSF and CP).



Date: 06/27/20 06:55
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: 4552

Your 2nd scenario is the way it's done. Your 1st scenario was the way it was done about 10 years ago.

justalurker66 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Each night the Illinois Zephyr wyes at West Quincy
> Missouri and spends the night on a special stub
> siding in the BNSF yard before returning to Quincy
> Illinois in the morning to begin passenger
> service. I am looking for more information on the
> wye operation.
>
> The wye appears to be manual ... no CPs on the
> connection track. I am assuming that the train
> stops at the wye just west of the West Quincy CP,
> the conductor reverses the switch, the train
> passes, the conductor normals the switch and walks
> around the curve to the next switch, reverse
> switch, let train pass, normal switch, then board
> and ride the train as it backs in to West Quincy.
> (Good so far?) I have seen a few pictures of
> Amtrak using the wye and it appears that the first
> move is on the connector track. The challenge
> comes when approaching West Quincy. The legs of
> the wye run parallel in to West Quincy and the
> train would need to run past the CP, back east
> through the CP, then back west through the CP to
> reach the stub siding. Is this procedure correct?
>
> The other thought looking at the layout would be
> to pass through West Quincy first then back down
> the Hannibal Sub past the wye, go forward over the
> connector back to the Brookfield Sub, then back
> through West Quincy to the pocket track. Still
> four moves. There does not seem to be a left hand
> crossover before the pocket track that would allow
> a train to wye in two moves.
>
> So, am I reading the layout correctly?



Date: 06/27/20 11:01
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: symph1

Would it make sense to go another 20 miles to Hannibal? It's not a huge town (17,000) but with all the Mark Twain stuff, it's a tourist draw.



Date: 06/27/20 11:14
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: ats90mph

symph1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Would it make sense to go another 20 miles to
> Hannibal? It's not a huge town (17,000) but with
> all the Mark Twain stuff, it's a tourist draw.

Possibly, but Illinois pays for the train, and Hannibal is in Missouri. The only reason the train crosses into Missouri now, it's closest location that trains can be turned, and yarded at a suitable layover facility...



Date: 06/27/20 12:16
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: GP25

And if it did enter Missouri in revenue service. 
I think Missouri will have to pay for it.
And I am not sure if Missouri will pay for it?


ats90mph Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> symph1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Would it make sense to go another 20 miles to
> > Hannibal? It's not a huge town (17,000) but
> with
> > all the Mark Twain stuff, it's a tourist draw.
>
> Possibly, but Illinois pays for the train, and
> Hannibal is in Missouri. The only reason the train
> crosses into Missouri now, it's closest location
> that trains can be turned, and yarded at a
> suitable layover facility...

Jerry Martin
Los Angeles, CA
Central Coast Railroad Festival



Date: 06/27/20 19:01
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: tq-07fan

When my friend and I rode to Quincy and rode the Holiday Extra train back to Galesburg it took roughly forty minutes for the train to go from the station in Quincy go across and wye the train and return to Quincy.

Jim



Date: 06/27/20 19:06
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: Mudrock

http://www.trainweb.org/chris/13quin.html    This story show you how it done .


Chris



Date: 06/27/20 22:03
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: justalurker66

4552 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your 2nd scenario is the way it's done. Your 1st scenario was the way it was done about 10 years ago.

Thanks. 10 years ago explains the photographs I saw.
I was able to watch on ATCS tonight and see the moves.



Date: 06/28/20 15:52
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: RuleG

With sincere apologies to Robert F Kennedy

Some rail enthusiasts see how trains are turned and ask about the wye, I dream of trains being turned at West Quincy and ask wye not.



Date: 06/29/20 09:59
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: RutledgeRadio

symph1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Would it make sense to go another 20 miles to
> Hannibal? It's not a huge town (17,000) but with
> all the Mark Twain stuff, it's a tourist draw.

This was discussed and planned somewhat many years ago by Hannibal and state representatives, but I don't think there was enough government support at the time to make it happen. To me it seems like a no-brainer, and I wouldn't think it would cost Missouri that much. If I remember correctly, Hannibal already had a building on the riverfront that could be used as a station, and there's already a large parking lot there for visitors/tourists. There's also a siding just north of there that appears to be long enough to store the train before returning to Quincy/Chicago. It might need some shoring up, but it's there. I would think extending the train to Hannibal would be a win win to attract more ridership to the train, more tourism in Hannibal, and provide a direct link from there to Chicago. The rail line between Hannibal and Quincy appears in excellent shape (it handles coal trains on a daily basis) and looks straight enough for passenger speeds, though in such a short distance I'm not sure fast speeds would matter that much, as the rail line is already more direct to Hannibal than any highways are.

The turn-around process in West Quincy has always perplexed me, I'm not sure why they would want to bother turning the train every day when they could use an NPCU for push-pull operation, and just pull the train straight in and out of the siding. The trains have operated with NPCU's or engines on either end sometimes, but regularly they aren't. I presume this will change once the new CALIDOT cars arrive, as they're configured with coach/cab car sets.



Date: 06/29/20 10:19
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: justalurker66

If you want "straight" look at the track west of the Quincy station between Quincy and West Quincy. Trains don't need straight track.

The trains used to terminate in West Quincy where they now park for the night. The station was torn down and the track removed (with the train stored on an industrial siding). Then a storage track was added at the old station location. West Quincy is prone to flooding - so service would need to be cut back if there was any chance of serious flooding. Otherwise all it takes is money.

It would be difficult to add a reverse crossover to XO West Quincy. The current crossover from the Brookfield Sub to join the Hannibal Sub before entering the yard is long and is logically split into two segments. The short Amtrak train actually fits between the crossovers! Adding another crossover would save two of the four moves needed to wye the train, But that is another money thing. There is a crossover on the west side of the signals - but it is outside the CP and beyond the Amtrak storage track.



Date: 06/30/20 01:29
Re: West Quincy Zephyr Wye
Author: justalurker66

Fun Fact -

I was looking to see how old the wye was and found a complaint filed in 1916 from a passenger who wanted to travel between Alexandria MO and St Louis MO without being forced to travel to Quincy IL. The CB&Q routed the train from the Hannibal Sub across the river to Quincy then back to West Quincy. 90% of the passengers were traveling to or from Quincy and only 10% were passing through. The passenger alleged that the railroad routed the train through Illinois to make it an interstate train and avoid charging intrastate rates. It was discovered in the hearing that the interstate rate was actually lower for several years prior to the complaint. The train had run from Burlington Iowa to St Louis MO with a stop at Quincy IL.

"West Quincy is not a station or town, but merely the point on defendant’s line in Missouri across the river from Quincy, where a wye is constructed for the purpose of connecting with the track leading to the bridge across the river and to defendant’s depot in Quincy, Illinois. Defendant’s passenger trains both north and south bound have always been routed by way of Quincy."



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