Passenger Trains > 1105 Confusion

I admit to being a little confused about 1105. Here is what I think I have been told:
1.1105 operates to Denver essentially at the old timetable.
2. 1105 takes a two hour pause at Denver then departs on the original #5 route to Emeryville.
3. On Tuesdays 1105 will not stop at Salt Lake City.  (why?)
4. No mention of #6 (1106) so #6 operates as scheduled with stops at SLC

Assumption being that work on the Moffat Tunnel is cause for delay. #6 arrives after the work day is over.

fredstout Wrote:
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> 
> 3. On Tuesdays 1105 will not stop at Salt Lake
> City.  (why?)
>
I think today is only Tuesday that the Zephyr doesn't serve SLC, and that's because the Zephyr leaves early Wed monting as opposed to late Tuesday. Still serves SLC but just 2 hours later

If 1105 runs every day, then why is SLC only served after midnight on Wednesday mornings? To me, this implies that 1105 only departs Denver on Tuesdays.

Posted from iPhone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/20 16:49 by stanhunter.

stanhunter Wrote:
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> If 1105 runs every day, then why is SLC only
> served after midnight on Wednesday mornings? To
> me, this implies that 1105 only departs Denver on
> Tuesdays.

Either 1105 or 5 departs daily from Denver.

The track work causing the delayed departure from Denver is not continuous.  When the "work week" starts, as shown below, is when the 1105 schedule comes in, and in each work session Tuesday is the first day of the delayed departure from Denver.  So there is no train on those Tuesdays in Salt Lake City and when the work week ends there are two trains on the same day in SLC, 1105 and 5.  (I think that's right!)

Here is part of the Amtrak announcement from the Amtrak Long Distance Alerts.  Trains 1105 would be operating on these dates from Chicago (and Denver the next day) and train 5 would be operating on the other dates in this time frame.  

I agree it is confusing.   


Amtrak Alerts
@AmtrakAlerts
Service Advisory: Track work being performed by Union Pacific Railroad on the Moffat Tunnel will affect California Zephyr Train 5 effective July 27 to Aug. 3, Aug. 10 to 17, Aug. 24 to 31, Sept. 7 to 13 and Sept. 21 to 24.

Amtrak's computer can not handle two trains with the same number at the same station on the same day, hence Train 1105.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/20 21:00 by GenePoon.

It's been poorly explained by Amtrak.

All trains will stop at Salt Lake City. I dont remember the days and dates for everything; I'd need to see the notice. But from what I recall on the days of the track work, train 5 operates two hours later west of Denver meaning that it will serve Salt Lake City after midnight (1:05am instead of 11:05pm; therefore the next calendar day). Hence why there will be "No service" on days where the train switches from the regular schedule to the track work schedule. The train will still stop there, it'll just technically be the next day.

Now, on the days that the schedule switches from the track work schedule back to the regular schedule, there will be two train 5s serving Salt Lake City on the same calendar day. One at 1:05am and the next at 11:05pm. We know from Daylight Savings that the booking system can't handle two trains with the same number operating at the same station on the same day, thus the number change to 1105 on those days.

Ok, by this explanation, the way I see it, 1105 will only operate on the five Tuesdays that fall on the day after the work window closes (aug 4 being the first of the five). And 1105 will run on 5’s regular schedule, since it would be the second train arriving SLC on that Tuesday. Does this make any sense?

OTG Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's been poorly explained by Amtrak.
>
> All trains will stop at Salt Lake City. I dont
> remember the days and dates for everything; I'd
> need to see the notice. But from what I recall on
> the days of the track work, train 5 operates two
> hours later west of Denver meaning that it will
> serve Salt Lake City after midnight (1:05am
> instead of 11:05pm; therefore the next calendar
> day). Hence why there will be "No service" on
> days where the train switches from the regular
> schedule to the track work schedule. The train
> will still stop there, it'll just technically be
> the next day.
>
> Now, on the days that the schedule switches from
> the track work schedule back to the regular
> schedule, there will be two train 5s serving Salt
> Lake City on the same calendar day. One at 1:05am
> and the next at 11:05pm. We know from Daylight
> Savings that the booking system can't handle two
> trains with the same number operating at the same
> station on the same day, thus the number change to
> 1105 on those days.

Posted from iPhone

stanhunter Wrote:
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> Ok, by this explanation, the way I see it, 1105
> will only operate on the five Tuesdays that fall
> on the day after the work window closes (aug 4
> being the first of the five). And 1105 will run
> on 5’s regular schedule, since it would be the
> second train arriving SLC on that Tuesday. Does
> this make any sense?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EeAUJG4WAAAjNgj?format=png&name=900x900

Based on the notice I think all the track work trains will be numbered 1105, not just the ones running at the end of the window, but the whole issue with stopping at Salt Lake City on a different day than scheduled (and the resulting clash with the regular #5) is ultimately the reason for the number change.

stanhunter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If 1105 runs every day, then why is SLC only
> served after midnight on Wednesday mornings? To
> me, this implies that 1105 only departs Denver on
> Tuesdays.
>
> Posted from iPhone

Check the schedule for DEN-SLC on Amtrak.com and you'll find that 1105 trains run on every day that the work window is in efect.  Returns to 5 in the non work-window periods.
WP17

Ok, I get it now.  Five work windows, starting on a Tuesday and ending the following Monday, with a week off between work sessions. 1105 does not stop at SLC on the Tuesday that the work period starts, as it arrives early on Wednesday morning.  On Wednedays, SLC will have two westward arrivals/departures.

By jove, I think he's got it!

Stan Hunter
 

Perhaps other than having two #5s in a station at the same time, another reason for the 1105 number is to make it 'more secure' in the scheduling computer.  It also simplifies temporary schedule changes which may include loss of some stops and creating others and a bus to missed stops.

In particular, if they were to modify the #5 schedule in the computer for Tue-Sat or whatever, then someone would have to 'modify it back' for Sun-Mon.  That opens up a can of worms from having someone always ready to switch it back as well as the possibility of entering an incorrect station or time (typographical error?) in the modified or restored schedule.  Also, if someone was too try booking travel 3 months out, they might be incorrectly presented with a modified schedule for #5 on Tuesday when all the construction work had ended a couple of months prior! 

In short, it's less work for everyone and always presents the 'real' #5 schedule for those days when 1105 is not running or the construction/detours are over.