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Passenger Trains > LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?


Date: 11/15/20 06:16
LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: cph

"The Pathing Study will provide a host of benefits to the broader San Diego and Southern California region including, but not limited to: 
  • Expanding COASTER service to the Downtown San Diego Convention Center, which serves as a major entertainment and employment hub for the region;
  • Extending service to a new Amtrak maintenance facility in National City that will aid LOSSAN Pacific Surfliner operations; 
  • Increasing freight services along the LOSSAN corridor to five roundtrips per day as part of the prioritized mid-term improvements; and
  • Minimizing rail crossing delays by extending signaling and Positive Train Control to improve rail speed and coordination with rail crossing gates."
https://www.metro-magazine.com/10130281/study-outlines-new-expansion-prospects-for-calif-s-lossan?utm_source=website&utm_medium=contentoffers&utm_campaign=111420



Date: 11/15/20 07:50
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: cchan006

I guess the article didn't want to mention the obvious, regarding what the major entertainment and employment hubs were, but the obvious ones are Petco Park (San Diego Padres) and the more "tony" part of Gaslamp Quarter.



Date: 11/15/20 08:03
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: webmaster

All these wonderful ideas for the low low price of $1 billion dollars.  

Looking over the plan it looks to me that the primary intent of the proposal is to increase capacity to support more freight traffic through the corridor. The Surfliner extension to National City looks to be a long term goal after all the other improvements have been done. My pessimistic opinion is there won't be any money left for the extension.

Todd Clark
Canyon Country, CA
Trainorders.com



Date: 11/15/20 08:57
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: cchan006

webmaster Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All these wonderful ideas for the low low price of
> $1 billion dollars.  
>
> Looking over the plan it looks to me that the
> primary intent of the proposal is to increase
> capacity to support more freight traffic through
> the corridor. The Surfliner extension to National
> City looks to be a long term goal after all the
> other improvements have been done. My pessimistic
> opinion is there won't be any money left for the
> extension.

I still remember the "new basketball arena" card Anschutz played to justify the new Sacramento Valley Station. It basically realigned the area to primarily favor the UP freight trains. The new basketball arena was never built next to the station as promised, but about 3 city blocks to the south. Don't think the realignment was all bad, but smells like corporate welfare.

Off topic, but there was a hotel tax measure in San Diego last March, to "improve" the convention center area. The measure exploited the homeless crisis, but it failed. Seems San Diego government wants to pour money into the convention center area regardless of what it is, but based on how San Diego citizens vote, I'm confident $1 billion won't be wasted. 



Date: 11/15/20 14:37
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: Passfanatic

That would be nice if Coaster was extended south to closer to where the Convention Center is. In fact, it's probably not a bad idea to have Amtrak trains stop there as well. Someday, I would love to see Miramir Hill eliminated and that would help save time off of the schedule.



Date: 11/15/20 15:16
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: PHall

Passfanatic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That would be nice if Coaster was extended south
> to closer to where the Convention Center is. In
> fact, it's probably not a bad idea to have Amtrak
> trains stop there as well. Someday, I would love
> to see Miramir Hill eliminated and that would help
> save time off of the schedule.


Must be nice to have fantasies. Eliminating the route over Miramar Hill would probably cost tens of billions of dollars.
Wouldn't be holding my breath on that one.



Date: 11/15/20 18:17
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: ProAmtrak

Especially where you have the constant threat of earthquakes!



Date: 11/15/20 18:53
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: PHall

ProAmtrak Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Especially where you have the constant threat of
> earthquakes!

And the fact that the earth next to the coast is former seabed that crumbles with just a stearn look.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/20 21:26 by PHall.



Date: 11/15/20 21:16
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: mundo

The   hopes to extend south to the convention center has been around almost from the day the center opened.  Back then it was to be a special event stop.

 For  35 plus years, the State of California, Cal-Trans has wanted a major facility south of San Diego to do maintenance now done in Los Angeles.
Its been on and off again, looking for land.  At the time the State was to pay for it, but now with the joint power folks, not sure who's pocket it will come out. Its tax-payers regardless.



Date: 11/16/20 07:04
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: MEKoch

If in fact the State of CA has a billion for rail, extending service east of Colton on the SP to Indio seems to me to be a much use of the money.



Date: 11/16/20 09:35
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: Klondyke

Some questions;
  • Can anyone explain how extending commuter service for 1 mile down existing track, and building a maintenance facility 4.5 miles down existing track will come to $1B?
  • How many Surfliner sets overnight in San Diego? (First S bound arrival is 10.00am, 2 N Bound have left prior to that) (Seems to be Coaster space in Oceanside?)
  • Isn’t PTC already in place?
  • Why does the state need to pay for BNSF to increase from 2(?) to 5 round freight trips a day?
  •  Who owns the line?
  • This link says you can build a 50’ bore tunnel for £50M/km (in 2010) or let’s say $100M/ mile. (p8).In the example given (p10) you need to add in $200M for bits and pieces for a 4.5 mile 25’ bore tunnel, total $600M. It’s 2 miles from the end of the straight stretch near I 805 south to near Genesee Ave. No NIMBYs as far as I can see. Where does the $100B estimate come from? I5 route is 3.5 miles if !805 route bends too much It’s Underground stations that cost $$$$. So hard luck La Jolla.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/434516/HS2_Guide_to_Tunnelling_Costs.pdf
Just curious. No axes to grind.
 



Date: 11/16/20 17:13
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: webmaster

The $1 billion is not just for the extension, it includes improvements north of San Diego such as signals, sidings, and mainline segements.  I suppose once the trains get to National City they could run the tracks onto Chula Vista where there is space to establish a maintenance facility.  Heck they could almost get to the border over old rusting right-of-way if they wanted to.  Bringing the trains further south is long overdo and would help Downtown San Diego congestion.  

Todd Clark
Canyon Country, CA
Trainorders.com



Date: 11/17/20 19:44
Re: LOSSAN extension south of San Diego?
Author: SanDiegan

cchan006 Wrote:

> I still remember the "new basketball arena" card
> Anschutz played to justify the new Sacramento
> Valley Station. It basically realigned the area to
> primarily favor the UP freight trains. The new
> basketball arena was never built next to the
> station as promised, but about 3 city blocks to
> the south. Don't think the realignment was all
> bad, but smells like corporate welfare.

The new alignment was great for frieght trains. Passengers now have to walk nearly a mile to the platform. It was a development scheme, passengers be damned. In fact, the original idea was to remove trains from the historic, and well-located S.P. station. Sound familar ?
 



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