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Passenger Trains > Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?


Date: 01/25/23 05:01
Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Peter_Hawtrey

With PTC now installed and enforcing when to put the brake on, will a system similar to trip optimizer be developed next for the route and consist of passenger trains in the US ? 

This could eventually have the carrier forcing a combined craft in passenger service and simply let an attendant (OBS) handle passengers leaving two at most operating department employees on the head end.



Date: 01/25/23 05:38
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: PC1974

Ya think this is a new concept? Been done on VIA for years without PTC..



Date: 01/25/23 06:09
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: joemvcnj

Different country, different FRA. 



Date: 01/25/23 06:09
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: MEKoch

Engineers I know hate trip optimizer.  On CSX you are stuck at 40 mph for 200 miles.  

How does apply on passenger operations?  



Date: 01/25/23 06:38
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Typhoon

MEKoch Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Engineers I know hate trip optimizer.  On CSX you
> are stuck at 40 mph for 200 miles.  
>
> How does apply on passenger operations?  

It is a computer program, and does what it is programmed to do.  CSX leans towards fuel conservation, so it runs the trains slower.  If it actually saves fuel is a conversation for a different board.   However, if the programming was done for optimal speed, the results would not be the same.  



Date: 01/25/23 07:24
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: trainjunkie

Typhoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> However, if the programming
> was done for optimal speed, the results would not
> be the same.  

You can say that again!



Date: 01/25/23 07:35
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Jishnu

Typhoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MEKoch Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Engineers I know hate trip optimizer.  On CSX
> you
> > are stuck at 40 mph for 200 miles.  
> >
> > How does apply on passenger operations?  
>
> It is a computer program, and does what it is
> programmed to do.  CSX leans towards fuel
> conservation, so it runs the trains slower.  If
> it actually saves fuel is a conversation for a
> different board.   However, if the programming
> was done for optimal speed, the results would not
> be the same.  

Right. Most High Speed Trains of the world have trip optimizers that gives guidance to the operator. Some even can be used almost like an autopilot.Tthe operator can choose to use it or take over and operate manually..



Date: 01/25/23 07:58
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Macster

The bulk of passenger trains in the United States run with a conductor (with passengers) and an engineer. Some run with 2 engineers over x miles. Some have an assistant conductor depending on the number of passengers/cars

Brightline as an example, runs with an engineer and an ops(conductor) manager along with an OBS team member (passes out food, alcohol, etc)

Other countries on the flipside run with a driver (engineer) and onboard services, however, the OBS can also handle other tasks related to rail operations. There aren't many manual throw switches and virtually everything is power switches. 

You'll never, EVER see that kind of investment in North America to eliminate conductors that wouldn't catastrophically delay passenger or freight trains.



Date: 01/25/23 16:45
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: ATSF1129

You'd have to a real deep hatred of people to be able to be maniacal enough to put trip optimizer on a passenger train...



Date: 01/25/23 21:07
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Drknow

ATSF1129 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You'd have to a real deep hatred of people to be
> able to be maniacal enough to put trip optimizer
> on a passenger train...

Quote of the year.

Regards

Posted from iPhone



Date: 01/26/23 06:43
Re: Trip Optimizer to reduce crew size on Passenger Trains?
Author: Peter_Hawtrey

I agree but remember, this is the same industry that went from five man crews down to two thanks to technology.  I imagine a century ago, those guys were saying that it could never, ever happen.

When fuel and labor is the biggest annual burden compared to the start up cost of the technology. Look out.



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