Passenger Trains > Window Cleaning

The Hiawatha this afternoon. At least they are (attempting) to clean the windows so people can see out. Since they don't seem to want to take the train through the wash during its overnight slumber in the coach yard every other night. 

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Just more evidence of the utter incompetence of the current management team. They have a working car wash in Chicago . What would be so difficult about taking the train through it a couple times a week? These guys need to go

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Despicable

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Is it possible to send these photos to ARP or direct to Amtrak management?  If Amtrak management in DC saw this could anything change?  Management in Chicago seems not to care, but senior management maybe????

They had an job listing for the Chicago General manager position on the Amtrak careers page not too long ago!

fulham Wrote:
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> Is it possible to send these photos to ARP or
> direct to Amtrak management?  If Amtrak
> management in DC saw this could anything change? 
> Management in Chicago seems not to care, but
> senior management maybe????

Senior management recently said that washing trains is ‘difficult’. Never mind that every trucking company and bus company can manage to keep their equipment reasonably clean in the entire country. It seems like everything is difficult at Amtrak because their management likes to throw their hands up, instead of solving problems. I think people should be sending pictures of this to Wisconsin and Illinois DOT that are funding this shabby operation. And ask them why the train never gets washed.

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alan2955 Wrote:
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 I think people should be sending
> pictures of this to Wisconsin and Illinois DOT
> that are funding this shabby operation. And ask
> them why the train never gets washed.
>
Anyone know how often, if ever, someone from IDOT, WiscDOT or
MDOT ride what they pay for or even go down to the depot to see
what string of sh++ 14th St has put together that day  ?

Would think Amtrak might show the new equipment in a favorable manner not project deferred maintenance..

Rather pathetic that Flixbus-run Greyhound with all their misery and miserlyness can do something that Amtrak can't. 

That's a beauty. Great job boys!

alan2955 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fulham Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Is it possible to send these photos to ARP or
> > direct to Amtrak management?  If Amtrak
> > management in DC saw this could anything
> change? 
> > Management in Chicago seems not to care, but
> > senior management maybe????
>
> Senior management recently said that washing
> trains is ‘difficult’. Never mind that every
> trucking company and bus company can manage to
> keep their equipment reasonably clean in the
> entire country. It seems like everything is
> difficult at Amtrak because their management likes
> to throw their hands up, instead of solving
> problems. I think people should be sending
> pictures of this to Wisconsin and Illinois DOT
> that are funding this shabby operation. And ask
> them why the train never gets washed.
>
> Posted from iPhone

I bet paying upper level management bonuses is also "difficult" too.........There's a LOT of things that are difficult for Amtrak to do........Be nice to get some "solved" sooner than later. 

I do not know the implications, but I find the steaking patterns of interest.

Englewood Wrote:
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> alan2955 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>  I think people should be sending
> > pictures of this to Wisconsin and Illinois DOT
> > that are funding this shabby operation. And ask
> > them why the train never gets washed.
> >
> Anyone know how often, if ever, someone from IDOT,
> WiscDOT or
> MDOT ride what they pay for or even go down to the
> depot to see
> what string of sh++ 14th St has put together that
> day  ?

Seems like a sweet deal for Amtrak. The Passenger Rail Investment and Improvement Act of 2008 absolved Amtrak of any responsibility for routes of less than 750 miles. They are a contract operator, just like Herzog or Keolis, but with a nationally famous and misleading name. Apparently, states contracting Amtrak just let them do their thing because . . . well . . . they're Amtrak. When Keolis bid against Amtrak for Virginia Railway Express, they had a little problem - we're Amtrak. We own Washington Union Station and the tracks leading to it. Yup, you can operate VRE trains, just not on our tracks. Keolis and the VRE folks ultrimately won, but there was a bit of tense time. Dim memory: didn't Iowa Pacific have some similar difficulty with the Hoosier State?

Of course, Amtrak is a known entity to the 'freight railroads' and the monumental insurance and ability to indemnify the railroads that smaller operators don't. Chance of Amtrak losing state services to another operator? Somewhere around 1/n^n where n --> huge.

So, if, for example Herzog was running this service, would the state let them get away with this?

TAW

TAW Wrote:
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>
> So, if, for example Herzog was running this
> service, would the state let them get away with
> this?
>
> TAW

Herzog operates Tri-Rail operations in Florida, under contract to the SFRTA. The train exteriors are usually clean, the interiors are Spartan, but usually not dirty.  I'm guessing the exteriors are washed regularly, and the interiors swept / mopped daily.

With high humidity, regular rain, and lots of dust from the right of way etc even a clean train or car can get dirty pretty fast/

Tri-Rail's equipment sees the shop everyday. Amtrak's equipment is spread from coast to coast on runs that may exceed 2000 miles.
Not exactly a fair comparison.

PHall Wrote:
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> Tri-Rail's equipment sees the shop everyday.
> Amtrak's equipment is spread from coast to coast
> on runs that may exceed 2000 miles.
> Not exactly a fair comparison.

The Hiawatha equipment (subject of this thread) is managed by a contract operator, too.  They probably see the shop a few days each week.

Fair comparison

Each of the two bi-directional Hiawatha trainsets get to the Chicago yard every 2nd night. 

TAW Wrote:
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> Seems like a sweet deal for Amtrak. The Passenger
> Rail Investment and Improvement Act of 2008
> absolved Amtrak of any responsibility for routes
> of less than 750 miles. They are a contract
> operator, just like Herzog or Keolis, but with a
> nationally famous and misleading name.

Completely Wrong. Amtrak still has a mission to operate routes less than 750 miles by law. PRIIA changed how they have to be paid for. Other operators like Herzog and Keolis operate as private for profit companies and don’t have to pursue any service they don’t wish to. Amtrak has a duty to pursue service if there is a willing state funding partner. While the states pay the main costs, Amtrak still loses money operating the state supported business even after state payments are considered and is allowed to use federal funding to absorb that loss. Amtrak does operate three regional services that aren’t part of Amtrak’s network as simply a contract operator in the manner you suggest - like Herzog and Keolis. They are the MARC Penn Line in Maryland, Metrolink in California, and Shore Line East in Connecticut. They also have an equipment maintenance contract to service CTDOT’s CTrail diesel and Mafersa fleet that is used on the Hartford Line (which uses Herzog as its contract operator.) Amtrak is allowed to generate ancillary revenue bidding on competitively bid regional services that aren’t part of the Amtrak network, but it cannot spend any federal funds on that activity so it has to be fully market rate and revenue positive. In most states if they wanted to convert a PRIIA 209 service into a completely state run regional service they’d have to bid it out competitively and Amtrak could still bid, under its ancillary business line, in such a situation.

The window situation is annoying and should be addressed. But the implication that this is only a problem on Amtrak is a joke. I rode VIA in December and the windows were absolutely filthy - worse than Amtrak. But no one here criticizes them.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 03/23/24 14:23 by lordsigma.

lordsigma Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TAW Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Seems like a sweet deal for Amtrak. The
> Passenger
> > Rail Investment and Improvement Act of 2008
> > absolved Amtrak of any responsibility for
> routes
> > of less than 750 miles. They are a contract
> > operator, just like Herzog or Keolis, but with
> a
> > nationally famous and misleading name.
>
> Completely Wrong. Amtrak still has a mission to
> operate routes less than 750 miles by law. PRIIA
> changed how they have to be paid for. Other
> operators like Herzog and Keolis operate as
> private for profit companies and don’t have to
> pursue any service they don’t wish to. Amtrak
> has a duty to pursue service if there is a willing
> state funding partner. While the states pay the
> main costs, Amtrak still loses money operating the
> state supported business even after state payments
> are considered and is allowed to use federal
> funding to absorb that loss. Amtrak does operate
> three regional services that aren’t part of
> Amtrak’s network as simply a contract operator
> in the manner you suggest - like Herzog and
> Keolis. They are the MARC Penn Line in Maryland,
> Metrolink in California, and Shore Line East in
> Connecticut. They also have an equipment
> maintenance contract to service CTDOT’s CTrail
> diesel and Mafersa fleet that is used on the
> Hartford Line (which uses Herzog as its contract
> operator.) Amtrak is allowed to generate ancillary
> revenue bidding on competitively bid regional
> services that aren’t part of the Amtrak network,
> but it cannot spend any federal funds on that
> activity so it has to be fully market rate and
> revenue positive. In most states if they wanted to
> convert a PRIIA 209 service into a completely
> state run regional service they’d have to bid it
> out competitively and Amtrak could still bid,
> under its ancillary business line, in such a
> situation.
>
> The window situation is annoying and should be
> addressed. But the implication that this is only a
> problem on Amtrak is a joke. I rode VIA in
> December and the windows were absolutely filthy -
> worse than Amtrak. But no one here criticizes
> them.

I think TAW had a certain tongue-in-cheek attitude over this matter......

No pride. No accountability. No impetus. No cares. No customers. NO PROBLEM! 🤷‍♂️😀

Regards

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