Passenger Trains > 28 Alstom transits have been produced

According to an article from CTInsider, 28 Acela replacement trainsets have been produced by Alstom.  So production has not stopped, apparently.  Then again, the article does not say that they have been built, but that there will be 28 trainsets.  Hmm.  I wish we could get the full story.  It is oddly hushed.

Here is the story:

https://www.ctinsider.com/connecticut/article/ct-new-trains-amtrak-acela-airo-hartford-line-19560494.php



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/24 04:37 by Chessie1963.

$5.25 Million each for 60 plain-Jane commuter coaches. Ouch. 

Thus far, various species of Siemens Charger locos are proving to be a varying degree - junk (Brightline ones are the only exception), so I don't think dual-powered Airos are anything to look forward to, so they'd better keep protect P42's on hand at Philly, New Haven and Washington. Only recently are they bragging that ALC-42's MDBF are outpacing that of 25 year old P42's with 3 million miles on them.  That ain't saying much.  

As for Alstom, NJT is in the process of scrapping their 15 year old Alstom PL42's, ahead of 40 - 50 year GP40's, and their 15 year old Alstom Comet-V rail cars leak, so got sealant paint applied on the ends of their roofs.  



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/24 06:03 by joemvcnj.

Thanks. Scrapping the fleet of PL42AC units seems like such a waste.

Are they really that awful?

Posted from Android

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks. Scrapping the fleet of PL42AC units seems
> like such a waste.
>
> Are they really that awful?

Until a few months ago when they stopped publishing it in their monthly Board reports (to hide stuff ?), MDBF was stated by loco and MU type. Yes, they are that awful, rivaling or worse than the old EMD's. 

Foir those of us that don't know, what is MDBF?

texchief1

texchief1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Foir those of us that don't know, what is MDBF?
>
> texchief1

Had to look it up myself.  Mean Distance Between Failure seems to be the common meaning.

There are so many "suspicious and unnatural" things about this Acela-2 situation,
that makes it hard not to conclude "somebody is hiding something".

.  This is a $2.5 BILLION contract for Alstom -- yet Alstom says nothing about
the failure to deliver acceptable equipment which is 3 years late.

.  Usually, builder contracts contain "Non-Performance" clauses whereby the Builder
pays penalties for failure to deliver on the order.  Alstom/Amtrak says nothing about this.

.  We have seen no recent pictures of train sets leaving Hornell -- so we must assume
production has stopped.  Alstom/Amtrak says nothing about how many are yet to be produced.

.  Even if production resumes on the remaining sets (19?) -- it will be years before they enter service.

So,  the NEC could be heading for the same equipment mess as the Western Long Hauls.

BTW -- have you noticed the "Dead Silence" about ordering new Long Haul equipment?

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks. Scrapping the fleet of PL42AC units seems
> like such a waste.
>
> Are they really that awful?

I thought I read somewhere that they decided not to sink money into the rebuild, because the cost to overhaul 15-year-old units was close to the cost of replacing them with more dual-mode units.

The local newspaper in Hornell NY has an editorial cheering Alstom Hornell's chances of getting the contract to build BrightLine West's new locomotives and car sets.  No mention of their reliability etc in delivering the Amtrak order.

Senator Schumer (D-NY) notes that a network of supporting companies has set up shop around Hornell to supply parts, and that upstate NY has high quality skilled union labor.

https://www.stargazette.com/story/news/local/2024/06/12/brightline-west-train-manufacturing-should-set-up-shop-in-ny-schumer/74048861007/

--------------------------------

 

ronald321 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> There are so many "suspicious and unnatural"
> things about this Acela-2 situation,
> that makes it hard not to conclude "somebody is
> hiding something".
>

To add to your list, there were rumblings that the next phase of testing/crew qualification was supposed to begin in early summer following FRA sign off.  Yet the trains continue to only make occasional night time test runs or sporadic equipment moves (with the 90 mph restriction still in place), so what the heck is going on?

hsr_fan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> To add to your list, there were rumblings that the
> next phase of testing/crew qualification was
> supposed to begin in early summer following FRA
> sign off.  Yet the trains continue to only make
> occasional night time test runs or sporadic
> equipment moves (with the 90 mph restriction still
> in place), so what the heck is going on?

TrainOrders discussions last year suggested that the train software and Amtrak's train control signals were incompatible. And FRA would not accept the various "fixes" proposed.

That could be consistent with a 90 mph imit on testing operations.

ts1457 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> texchief1 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Foir those of us that don't know, what is MDBF?
> >
> > texchief1
>
> Had to look it up myself.  Mean Distance Between
> Failure seems to be the common meaning.

Yep, a similar term is Mean Time Between Failure (MTBF) which is commonly used for computer parts like hard drives.  The lower number on your MDBF pretty much tells you that you have a shop queen for a locomotive.  My limited understanding is that Amtrak was using a system to maintain the Acelas similar to one used by the Navy, where you measured your MDBF or MTBF and replaced key components or parts as you approached that number/metric.  Doing so meant you had fewer chances for a breakdown while in operation because you were replacing the critical components before they had a chance to fail, on average.  While it doesn't give you a 100% gaurantee that you won't have a failure, it does drastically reduce the chances of them happening.  Meaning you provide better customer service & experience by having trains that run on time and can make it to the end of their run in one piece.  It is expensive because you are replacing components that still might have useful life left in them, and that "extra" cost is probably why more places don't operate that way.  The reality is that it isn't "extra" cost, but most people tend to see it that way.  In fact, I would think it would be easier to budget that way, but that's just me.

Nathan

It’s time for NARP (or whatever they call themselves) to publish Amtraks answer to why the new Acelas are not running or when they will be

I thought NARP had the ability to keep Amtrak accountable at least in their communication regarding these trainsets

Posted from iPhone

amtrakbill Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It’s time for NARP (or whatever they call
> themselves) to publish Amtraks answer to why the
> new Acelas are not running or when they will be
>
> I thought NARP had the ability to keep Amtrak
> accountable at least in their communication
> regarding these trainsets

Ha-ha-ha. That's good one ! They are Amtrak's PR firm, so nothing w/o Amtrak's blessing gets published.
When did they last pull an inconvenient FOIA on them ? I can think of only Trains-in-the-Valley and Aurora Group doing so. . 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/24 09:59 by joemvcnj.

If they don't get them to work is there any chance of selling them to Nigeria to run alongside the Wisconsin Talgos, or will they be used for first responder training like the RTL-III Turboliners?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/03/24 10:05 by hsr_fan.

Perhaps they can dump them into the ocean to be used as corral reefs. As it stands now, we have these hunks of junk that have been sitting in yards decaying for up to 4 years.

Imagine buying a new car that you can't drive and has been sitting in the dealer lot for over 4 years.


hsr_fan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If they don't get them to work is there any chance
> of selling them to Nigeria to run alongside the
> Wisconsin Talgos, or will they be used for first
> responder training like the RTL-III Turboliners?

Posted from Android

Sorry, amtrakbill and joemvcnj, but Rail Passengers of America (formerly NARP) has no magic wand to make Amtrak Do the Right Thing. They are a consumer advocacy organization and have been advocating for rail passengers for decades. Unfortunately advocacy does not mean the ability to implement corrective action. That responsibility is up to Amtrak. And, yes in recent public announcements RPA has scolded Amtrak for failing to make these and other needed improvements .

As I have said before, if you feel RPA is not doing it's job I suggest you get involved with RPA rather than throwing stones at a comfortable distance.

Does RPA/NARP still do its annual visit where they swarm Capitol Hill and Amtrak offices?

Posted from Android

Lackawanna484 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does RPA/NARP still do its annual visit where they
> swarm Capitol Hill and Amtrak offices?

The Hill, yes. 

OnTime Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry, amtrakbill and joemvcnj, but Rail
> Passengers of America (formerly NARP) has no magic
> wand to make Amtrak Do the Right Thing. They are a
> consumer advocacy organization and have been
> advocating for rail passengers for decades.
> Unfortunately advocacy does not mean the ability
> to implement corrective action. That
> responsibility is up to Amtrak. And, yes in recent
> public announcements RPA has scolded Amtrak for
> failing to make these and other needed
> improvements .
>
> As I have said before, if you feel RPA is not
> doing it's job I suggest you get involved with RPA
> rather than throwing stones at a comfortable
> distance.

I donate money to this group

So I am involved. Maybe RPA can ask Amtrak “what’s up?” And let its members know what they said?

Updating its members on this issue at least quarterly is not an unreasonable request

Posted from iPhone