Passenger Trains > Wires fall on SEPTA train, 150 aboard, Paoli service suspended

Catenary wires fell onto a SEPTA Paoli line Regional Rail train west of Philadelphia 30th St. Station Monday afternoon. 150 passengers on the train are remaining aboard as SEPTA and Amtrak power controllers work to shut off the catenary power, before rescue efforts can begin.

Services on the SEPTA Paoli-Thorndale Line (former Pennsylvania side R5) and the peak-hour only Cynwyd Line (former Pennsy-side R6) are suspended indefinitely.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/24 14:58 by GenePoon.

Amtrak Keystone 647 got through just fine from Philly to Paoli between 4pm and 430p

The Amtrak Keystone and Pennsylvanian use a different route through the Zoo maze.  SEPTA comes off the upper level, Amtrak the lower level.  SEPTA is still not operating.

Current alert from SEPTA:Amtrak and Septa crews have safely cleared the affected area, and repairs are now underway. Service will remain suspended until repairs have been completed. Alternative service suggestions are available using the SEPTA Trip Planner.
 

Why can't SEPTA run Philly - Thorndale trains from the lower level ? 

joemvcnj Wrote:
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> Why can't SEPTA run Philly - Thorndale trains from
> the lower level ? 

Logistical nightmare.    Most of the paoli/thorndale trains run thru to somewhere on the reading side via the center city tunnel.
So you'd have to have those trains turn back at 30th st, and the have separate trains running from 30th St LL.  Theorettically its possible if u have crew change trains from the upper level to lower level  (and ppl too, as many paoli/thorndale line ppl start at cener city, not 30th st. )   You'd have to have  lot of pple in place to do it...   SEPTA is probably hoping they will have a track open west out of upper level soon.

They also could run trains uppr level to ZOO on the trenton line, the reverse thru the NY/Pgh subway (if it still has wires) to run west.  But that involves real talent and coordination, which kinda leaves septa out of it....

 

pdt Wrote:

>
> They also could run trains uppr level to ZOO on
> the trenton line, the reverse thru the NY/Pgh
> subway (if it still has wires) to run west.  But
> that involves real talent and coordination, which
> kinda leaves septa out of it....

I was last in Philadelphia in late October 2024.  Construction is underway west of the Pittsburgh Subway; nearly all of the yard trackage there has been removed, and there was equipment parked on the tracks on the afternoons when I rode past on the Paoli/Thorndale Line.  From that, I would guess that the Subway is out of service, at least for through service during construction.

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> Why can't SEPTA run Philly - Thorndale trains from the lower level?

Besides no connection to Suburban Station (where crews change on every though train) and the Center City Tunnel, there are no SEPTA fare gates on the lower (Amtrak) level.

SEPTA crews are also not qualified on the lower level.  Amtrak engineer and conductor pilots would be required.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/24 14:37 by GenePoon.

Two WPVI helicopter images of broken wires and the involved SEPTA train.

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SO what's going on now where the big PRR shops and yard were at 34th st west of ZOO in the Hbg main?
Last I was there I think there was a SEPTA maintenence facility and yard tracks for septa cars?  Is that all being changed again?
 A once great yard and shop and interlocking complex being even further reduced to nothing?

More of the "simplify the tracks so that one dispatcher can handle everything?     ZOO tower was once an amazing place....
133 lever pistol grip maching with a crew of 5 to handle everything.    Now controlled from a bunker, with probably half the routings available that there once were....

 

Service has been restored to the Paoli/Thorndale line.

The first outbound train was #4571, from 30th St. at 624pm.  The first inbound train will be #5352, arrving 30th St. 815 pm, originating Malvern.

Service between Malvern and Thorndale remains suspended.

There are no more scheduled Cynwyd Line trains today.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/24 15:58 by GenePoon.

GenePoon Wrote:
> SEPTA crews are also not qualified on the lower
> level.  Amtrak engineer and conductor pilots
> would be required.
At one time they were. What changed?  I was once
on an inbound Trenton local that terminated at 30th Street,
lower level. NO pilots that day.

CPMorris Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GenePoon Wrote:
> > SEPTA crews are also not qualified on the lower
> > level.  Amtrak engineer and conductor pilots
> > would be required.
> At one time they were. What changed?  I was once
> on an inbound Trenton local that terminated at
> 30th Street,
> lower level. NO pilots that day.

How long ago was that?   Things can change over a period of 20 years...  Altho I would think that everyone at Septa would be qualified over all the wired tracks between arsenal and ZOO.  Irregular moves could happen ay any time....

GenePoon Wrote:
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> Besides no connection to Suburban Station (where
> crews change on every though train) and the Center

The connection is "walk upstairs",

> City Tunnel, there are no SEPTA fare gates on the
> lower (Amtrak) level.

SEPTA doesn't need fare gates to operate, they still collect all tickets on board despite having gated the center city stations.

> SEPTA crews are also not qualified on the lower
> level. 

SEPTA crews to Wilmington and I think the Airport frequently in the past have run in and out of the lower level during construction projects between 30th Street and PHIL Interlocking.  This may have also been done once for Trenton trains durign construction in K Interlocking or the Zoo tunnels, can't remember.  The Wilmington side moves are much more common and often.  I think SEPTA has run push-pull Wilmington line equipment moves to Frazer through the lower level in the past?

I have never heard of Paoli crews doing this, but there is no reason they couldn't other than qualification.  Amtrak has 4 tracks (7 to 10) available for Harrisburg line trains on the lower level.

"SEPTA doesn't need fare gates to operate, they still collect all tickets on board despite having gated the center city stations."

Fares are CHECKED on board and conductors can still collect fares if necessary, but passengers, even at outlying stations, are supposed to tag on and off with their SEPTA Key Cards, which is how the actual fare collection is normally done.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/25/24 22:28 by GenePoon.

pdt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How long ago was that?   Things can change over
> a period of 20 years...  Altho I would think that
> everyone at Septa would be qualified over all the
> wired tracks between arsenal and ZOO.  Irregular
> moves could happen ay any time....

Correct.  I believe the SEPTA qualification territory is currently Perryville to Ham and 30th Street to:Lancaster.  Floor 7 at SEPTA HQ used to have the Amtrak maps for those sections for the crews in training.  The reason for the extended limits is if an interlocking like THORN or DAVIS is out of service they can operate the train to the next available location to turn a train.  At one time, the qualification book was only to BACON south of DAVIS, but I think they realized that was no place to turn a train and extended it to Perryville2qw2.  I have a 2005 Amtrak qualification packet for SEPTA crews, it is HAM to BACON, including the Philadelphia Terminal from PHIL to ZOO, and STILES to CORK.

Septa service all the way to Perryville would be a great improvement.

Doubtful Maryland would pay anything for that.

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