Passenger Trains > More Cardinal Problems

The Westbound Cardinal arrived in Cincinnati early this morning on time, actually a few minute early at 109 AM.   And terminated.  Follow from Amtrak:

"Service Adjustment: As of 5:18 AM ET, Train 51 will now terminate at Cincinnati (CIN) due to ongoing mechanical issues. The train is now canceled between Cincinnati (CIN) and Chicago (CHI). Bus transportation will be provided between both locations. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience".

Empty consist departed Cincinnati shortly after this.  Train is approaching Indianapolis now - will be interesting to see if it terminates and goes to Beech Grove or if it makes it's Beech Grove pickup and continues to Chicago.  Either way, I would suspect tonight 50 will ether depart late or be bustituted or canceled.  



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/09/25 05:44 by scraphauler.

I want you to imagine being asleep comfortably and warm in your room that you paid $1,000 for at 5am, to be awoken and told to get the h*ll off the train because Amtrak doesnt feel like running it anymore nor putting in the effort to find a replacement locomotive and to enjoy your busride. Its getting really difficult to vote for Amtrak anymore. 

I'm thinking they were not warm in their rooms. The issue almost certainly involved HEP problems that they couldn't correct leaving the consist without heat or restrooms.

If my guess is correct what choice did they have?

Hindsight being 20/20 yes they should be running with 2 motors but they weren't

Posted from Android

HEP died. Motor 202. Temperatures in the teens and the train got cold very fast. 3 buses were ordered.

Posted from Android

Could have been worse they could have been stuck at a Amshack without heat while the buses were organized.   Atleast Cincinnati has a waiting room with heat.   

Amtrak-P42 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I want you to imagine being asleep comfortably and
> warm in your room that you paid $1,000 for at 5am,
> to be awoken and told to get the h*ll off the
> train because Amtrak doesnt feel like running it
> anymore nor putting in the effort to find a
> replacement locomotive and to enjoy your busride.
> Its getting really difficult to vote for Amtrak
> anymore. 

Just where would you expect Amtrak to find a replacement locomotive in Cincinnati? It would not be a pleasant experience for sure, but there’s not much they could do about it either.

Posted from iPhone

Wouldn't it be smarter if Amtrak had two units on a train when they know they are going into colder weather or adverse weather? I know - Amtrak is short on serviceable and working locomotives, but they need to work on this! 

It's more satisfying to complain without understanding the backstory on the cancellation.

alan2955 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Amtrak-P42 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I want you to imagine being asleep comfortably
> and
> > warm in your room that you paid $1,000 for at
> 5am,
> > to be awoken and told to get the h*ll off the
> > train because Amtrak doesnt feel like running
> it
> > anymore nor putting in the effort to find a
> > replacement locomotive and to enjoy your
> busride.
> > Its getting really difficult to vote for Amtrak
> > anymore. 
>
> Just where would you expect Amtrak to find a
> replacement locomotive in Cincinnati? It would
> not be a pleasant experience for sure, but
> there’s not much they could do about it either.
>
> Posted from iPhone

PaTrainFan Wrote:

> It's more satisfying to complain without understanding the backstory on the cancellation.
==========================================================

Okay, here it is.

Awakened at 5am?  Bu!!shit.  Actually around 130am when temperature was 17F/minus 9C in Cincinnati.

The HEP on AMTK 202 failed.  No heat, no lights except for emergency pathway lighting in most of the train, and standby battery lighting in the Viewliner sleeper.  No food service.

By the time Amtrak announced the annulment of 51(8) at Cincinnati, the temperature was 4F/minus 16C.

Passengers were bustituted.  The train operated deadhead to Chicago.  It is not known whether anybody thought to open the drains on the water system so that pipes would not burst, but in any case the equipment apparently is unable to operate as the eastbound Cardinal 50(9).  Train status shows as "Delayed" and space is unavailable for booking at any point along its route.

Poor Red Bird.   Happy now???

 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/09/25 16:36 by GenePoon.

GenePoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> PaTrainFan Wrote:
>
> > It's more satisfying to complain without
> understanding the backstory on the cancellation.
> ==================================================
> ========
>
> Okay, here it is.
>
> Awakened at 5am?  Bu!!shit.  Actually around
> 130am when temperature was 17F/minus 9C in
> Cincinnati.
>
> The HEP on AMTK 202 failed.  No heat, no lights
> except for emergency pathway lighting in most of
> the train, and standby battery lighting in the
> Viewliner sleeper.  No food service.
>
> By the time Amtrak announced the annulment of
> 51(8) at Cincinnati, the temperature was 4F/minus
> 16C.
>
> Passengers were bustituted.  The train operated
> deadhead to Chicago.  It is not known whether
> anybody thought to open the drains on the water
> system so that pipes would not burst, but in any
> case the equipment apparently is unable to operate
> as the eastbound Cardinal 50(9).  Train status
> shows as "Delayed" and space is unavailable for
> booking at any point along its route.
>
> Poor Red Bird.   Happy now???
>
>  

Actually yes!  Facts without the personal bias is always much better.

Bottom line is that Amtrak doesn't have enough functional equipment to operate the national network.  The P42's are prone to mechanical issues due to age and suspect maintenance practices, and the new Chargers struggle at times.

Too much equipment was stored during Covid and not properly maintained for return to service.

I know this is an unpopular statement to make, but Amtrak needs to cut some LD trains.  Eliminate the Cardinal totally, and eliminate the Texas Eagle south of St.Louis.  This could free up power and cars for the Borealis service so it could divorce itself from the Hiawatha trainsets, and provide extra equipment for the existing LD trains.  

West Virginia, Ohio and Indiana have no interest in passenger rail even though Cincinnati - Indy - Chicago is a very viable corrider for daytime service.

Texas does a good job in the DFW area regarding commuter and light rail, but in my opinion the Texas Eagle epitomizes the "niche " transportation that just isn't viable.

A lot of this is the fault of Amtrak management and it's employee culture, but I am afraid that given the current equipment situation and the inability to fix it, nothing is going to get better.



 

fulham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> I know this is an unpopular statement to make, but
> Amtrak needs to cut some LD trains. 

Coming soon to a long distance route near you:  Tri weekly service (on routes not already tri weekly).

Andy

It seems impossible...but things got worse.

With the Cardinal consist freeze-damaged, Amtrak scheduled a special from Beech Grove with cars to add to the Cardinal.  It was to operate as Train P979(9) with the AMTK 517. 

It did not operate.  P979(9) derailed about a mile after leaving the shops.  It was cancelled. 



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/09/25 22:26 by GenePoon.

fulham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I know this is an unpopular statement to make, but
> Amtrak needs to cut some LD trains.  Eliminate
> the Cardinal totally, and eliminate the Texas
> Eagle south of St.Louis.  This could free up
> power and cars for the Borealis service so it
> could divorce itself from the Hiawatha trainsets,
> and provide extra equipment for the existing LD
> trains.  

I don't understand how giving Amtrak more equipment to park will help improve anything.

Cardinal is an example of congressional mandate train....if it runs 1 engine and one coach I expect it will run. 

fulham Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bottom line is that Amtrak doesn't have enough
> functional equipment to operate the national
> network.  The P42's are prone to mechanical
> issues due to age and suspect maintenance
> practices, and the new Chargers struggle at
> times.
>
> Too much equipment was stored during Covid and not
> properly maintained for return to service.
>
> I know this is an unpopular statement to make, but
> Amtrak needs to cut some LD trains.  Eliminate
> the Cardinal totally, and eliminate the Texas
> Eagle south of St.Louis.  This could free up
> power and cars for the Borealis service so it
> could divorce itself from the Hiawatha trainsets,
> and provide extra equipment for the existing LD
> trains.  
>
> West Virginia, Ohio and Indiana have no interest
> in passenger rail even though Cincinnati - Indy -
> Chicago is a very viable corrider for daytime
> service.
>
> Texas does a good job in the DFW area regarding
> commuter and light rail, but in my opinion the
> Texas Eagle epitomizes the "niche " transportation
> that just isn't viable.
>
> A lot of this is the fault of Amtrak management
> and it's employee culture, but I am afraid that
> given the current equipment situation and the
> inability to fix it, nothing is going to get
> better.

No, you do not reward bad management by lowering the bar. You show them the door, with cause, no severance, no unemployment office because this is the national network they have been told to run and given plenty of money to run it. 

It's national or nothing. If the LD trains go away, so should federal support of the NEC and let it become 80 MPH commuter railroad. 



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/25 03:56 by joemvcnj.

You cannot make this stuff up!  Good grief.  One locomotive fails, three trains get truncated or canceled.  Welcome to Amtrak 2025.


GenePoon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It seems impossible...but things got worse.
>
> With the Cardinal consist freeze-damaged, Amtrak
> scheduled a special from Beech Grove with cars to
> add to the Cardinal.  It was to operate as Train
> P979(9) with the AMTK 517. 
>
> It did not operate.  P979(9) derailed about a
> mile after leaving the shops.  It was
> cancelled. 

And we have a winning comment!

Yes, if I were in Congress, House or Senate, and you took away my twice daily train, I would take away my vote for Amtrak.  Why should all of America fund the NEC for the elites?  If Amtrak is not a national railroad, I do not want to see them get a dime.  Not one.

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No, you do not reward bad management by lowering
> the bar. You show them the door, with cause, no
> severance, no unemployment office because this is
> the national network they have been told to run
> and given plenty of money to run it. 
>
> It's national or nothing. If the LD trains go
> away, so should federal support of the NEC and let
> it become 80 MPH commuter railroad. 

AndyBrown Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fulham Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > I know this is an unpopular statement to make,
> but
> > Amtrak needs to cut some LD trains. 
>
> Coming soon to a long distance route near you: 
> Tri weekly service (on routes not already tri
> weekly).
>
> Andy

Sadly, I think that is DEFINITELY in the cards for the future if Amtrak can't get reliable locomotives on the road AND is able to sustain its Superliner LD equipment. There's going to be further delays in LD equipment procurement process. VIA Rail Canada has already waved the flag that they need replacement of their LD legacy fleet by 2035 or there's reductions.........

Chessie1963 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And we have a winning comment!
>
 Why should all of
> America fund the NEC for the elites?  If Amtrak
> is not a national railroad, I do not want to see
> them get a dime.  Not one.

> joemvcnj Wrote:

> > It's national or nothing. If the LD trains go
> > away, so should federal support of the NEC and
> let
> > it become 80 MPH commuter railroad. 

Agree 100%. National or Nothing

Posted from Android