Passenger Trains > Turnstiles gone from Metra Electric

On Tuesday, the Metra Board in Chicago, after advanced whining and blubbering from people with nothing better to do, began removing the turnstiles from the automatic gates that Illinois Central put in about 40 yers ago. Metra already has added 10 trainmen to the service and, IMHO, will ahve to add many more to check tickets. The blinkered individuals, who have no sense of how the private companies ran the suburban operations that Metra took over, are using the gates to blubber about how the poor South Siders are picked on by Metra. Now the line will be bleeding money, but, hey, they don't have turnstiles any more.

Also, Metra Electric is the last Metra line without on-board toilets. But the agency is now adding bathrooms on new cars, thanks to the advanced whining and crying of a handful of people. I have been riding Metra (C&NW/Metra UP North) virtually every day since 1977 and I could count the number of times I've seen people enter the bathroom on the train on two hands. Also, with the ADA accessibility rules, bathrooms are much bigger than the phone booth with plumbing you see on the older cars on my line. The cars will lose a lot of seats to accommodate the bathrooms (which have only one seat), so more riders will be standing (not in front of commodes) in rush hour.

I wonder what those poor, picked-on folks will do if they have to take the "L" because those trains have no bathrooms and you have to go through a turnstile to get to the platform.

I don't know if they still do it, but Vancouver SkyTrain fare inspectors used to handcuff and remove fare violators from the honor zones. If you get caught, it's a few hundred bucks Canadian.


On NJ Transit Comet trains, the ADA rest rooms take the space of 3 sets of 3 seats, displacing 9 passengers.

Considering all the other s%$# people in wheelchairs put up with, I don't begrudge them or anybody else the space.

There was a big item on the local CBS station in Chicago a week or so ago about this. Toilets ARE nice but I agree with Galena Division....I've ridden the BNSF line on and off since 1972 and very rarely see the toilets being used. Although there was an incident on the BNSF route a while back where a couple were using the handicapped restroom in one of the new coaches to try to "get it on". The rest of the whiners use the service once a year to go to the 4th of July fireworks or "Taste of Chicago" and they feel better about themselves when they can puke in the privacy of a water closet when they get WAY over-served. They need to hang onto their plastic beer cups to use for relief. That's true recycling...out of and back into the same container. Also solves a litter problem.........
Silver Sky

In a way, getting rid of the turnstiles is a good idea, as it means more jobs for on-board personnel. SEPTA wanted to do the opposite where they wanted to get rid of assistant conductors and replace them with either turnstiles or some other type of system where all trains would have only a conductor, regardless of the length of train.

If I am not mistaken Metrolink, Coaster, Trinity etc. have only one conductor. Just because Metro is still in the stone age of fare collection shouldn't mean they have to add conductors when they get rid of turnstiles. SEPTA will also have to go to Proof of Payment fare collection if they are to get rid of their excess conductors. (Yes I admit I have seen Coaster and Trinity use a 2nd conductor when they run long trains with an engine in the middle).

The ADA bathrooms on the California cars have been somewhat problematic in this regard. In particular, on the Amtrak Capitols, the "baby changing" table gets broken on a regular basis by people who mistake it for a "baby making" table...

-=paulf

OK -

I am one of those complaining whiners.

And I use the IC/Metra electric more than just once or twice a year.

And more than once in a while I need a restroom in the hour I travel aboard (especially since my intown terminal didn't have a bathroom for years.)

Now, as to those turnstiles - if they had replaced on-train collection, they would have been worth it (as they did in the 60's when they were introduced) but to have to have my ticket out at start, onboard, and at exit seemed a bit much. Even more than the old show-you-ticket on the Paris Metro and Britrail!

Now, add in malfunctioning ticketing vending machines and broken turnstiles, getting onto the train could be an ordeal.

And it is not lost on me, a caucasian, that the only line with such multiple proofs of ticket served the traveling public representing the highest level of minority ridership. If it seemed racist to me, how do you think it felt to our brothers and sisters of other races?

So, these are changes we can all live with!

When the IC installed the fare gates 40 years ago, the demographics of the territory served were predominently white. I used to ride the South Chicago line in those days, which ran through a white ethnic enclave. The IC mainline on the south side ran through a middle class white area. The suburbs served were all white at that time. How can these turnstiles be considred racist,except by those inclined to see racism everywhere because it's to their advantage?

Does racism exist? You bet your booty! Are turnstiles racist? No. So why waste precious resources and time battling something that's not related to racism and won't diminish racism in the area by one iota?

One other question? Is the CTA racist because many of its L lines run through predominently black neighborhoods? It has turnstiles and no toilets.

I repeat, riders rarely use bathrooms on Metra lines where they exist. New toilet facilities will take out 15-20 seats per car. That means people will have to stand every day just so someone can use a bathroom once a year. That just doesn't make sense to me.

Metra Electric offers the best on-time performance on the Metra system and the best frequency in off-peak service. Because it's the only electrified line, communities along its lines get a quiet, non-polluting operating enviornment. Hey, I like diesels, but if you ask people about the noise and smell that comes with them, you won't find many with positive things to say.

Putting more trainmen on is a good thing if you're a union employee. If you're a taxpayer and have to foot the bill, that's something else. Pay and benefits add up to big bucks very quickly. Those guys don't (and shouldn't) work for minimum wage. Metra has done a good job of holding the line on fares without beating up the state for more operating funds. Adding more trainmen to the Electric line will cost more. Somebody's got to pay for it. That could be me, among others, when my Metra UP North ticket price goes up or when more of my tax dollars are used to pick up the tab.

Finally, I've seen and heard lots of ranting and raving by politicians representing south side districts. They want stations rebuilt, more parking lots, etc. That's fine, but instead of shouting at Metra, why don't they go to work to get a more equitable funding arrangement? Right now, every dime of the transportation portion of the sales tax collected within the city goes to the CTA. Metra has to use funds from elsewehre to pay for this work.

I think Galena Division stated the situation very well. As long a Metra has been in existence, there are still many "holdovers" from the Class I operators. I am fortunate enough to live where riding the BNSF line is an option. Why is it such a good service....? Because it was a great service on the old CB&Q and this carried over into the BN days. Metra inherited a great product. Having a triple track, CTC railroad provides the physical plant to provide a superior service when a little creativity of scheduling is thrown in. But where did the last covered wagons operate in regular service?.......on the BNSF line. And what other Metra line is still operating coaches that were built as early as 1950?....the BNSF. The old CB&Q, with the help of the Budd Company, designed a car that was the granddaddy of all of the gallery type cars. I rode in car 700 as recently as this past week. So a superior product has provided exceptional service for over 50 years. Do the Metra electric lines operate the oldest equipment.....no, the BNSF does. The Highliners were state of the art when compared to the old IC heavyweights but they were a far cry from the Budd, St. Louis Car Co and P-S gallery cars that were purchased by the majority of the "steam" railraods. I never did understand why no restrooms were built into the Highliners except that the IC was cheap. I'm sure that their philosophy in the late '60's and early '70's was that they HAD to do something about the heavyweights but why build something that might lure additional riders or that required additional maintenance? Restrooms and the associated cleaning and maintenance means more expense and greater losses. They obviously wanted out of the commuter business. There are many communities on the IC electric that were very high class and expensive places to live. The IC didn't change, the demographics of the communities changed. The equipment on the electric lines needs to be replaced but no group of people is being "picked" on. Metra cannot justify replacing cars built at least 20 years later than ones being operated on other lines (read BNSF). Amtrak has involved many communities in station construction and maintenance. Maybe some of the communities fathers on the Metra electric need to hear from their train riding constituents as to the condition of their stations. Involvement in effecting change through some creativity volunteerism and community spirit would go a long way to changing conditions on the Metra electric. As is the case with all commuter agencies, there is just not enough money to go around. Metra is sensitive to public perception of its service and "fairness" to the riding public. I am sure that they are not purposely shortchanging the south suburbs of Chicago. Just my spin on the situation.
Silver Sky

OK...so now the Electric line has lost (or is losing) its turnstiles, to make it more like the other lines.

Eventually it will have a decent downtown terminal, making it more like the other lines.

Bathrooms, used or not, will make it more like the other lines.

New crew members to take care of fares will make it more like the other lines.

But what next? A train staffed at one person per car couldn't check everyone between all of the stops. Do you suppose they will have problems with people getting on and off before anyone can look at their tickets? Will Metra decide that some of these stops are too close together, and eliminate a few, making it more like the other lines?

You think you've heard cries of discrimination now?

Watch for other economies to bring the Electric service levels down to levels more like the other lines.

Hmm thats interesting about how it is said that people don't use the bathrooms on the trains. I ride one of the UP lines every day and trust me they are not under used. The number of people who I see use them far exceeds 10 in just two days.

You are 100% correct, the CB&Q ranned an excellent passenger product in their Aurora - Union Staion tripled track corridor. Their equipment was the best. I rode the other night in one of those stainless steel Budd built gallery coaches, and they ride as good as they did decades ago. But then look at the past of CB&Q history with passenger rail. Some of their Intercity passenger trains carried named like California Zephyr, Denver Zephyr, Morning & Afternoon Zephyrs and so on. Metra was very fortunate to get a crown jewel handed to them in the Burlington Northern Santa Fe line & the equipment that came with it as well.