International Railroad Discussion > Venezuela's Chinese-made bullet train project abandoned

Haven't seen this reported here yet so I'll just leave this here for discussion.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2016/05/14/venezuela-chinese-made-bullet-train-project-abandoned/

Considering that the Government just declared a "State of Emergency" because they're about one second away from a revolution.
It's not surprising...

Nope, not a surprise at all. The chickens have come home to roost in the "socialist utopia" created by Chávez and Maduro. Lots of lessons to be learned in Venezuela.

trainjunkie Wrote:
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> Nope, not a surprise at all. The chickens have
> come home to roost in the "socialist utopia"
> created by Chávez and Maduro. Lots of lessons to
> be learned in Venezuela.

And Cuba is probably getting nervous.

Maggie Thatcher was correct

“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”

Dare I enter into this?

Venezuela was a left-nationalist regime, like many in the region and around the world. Leaders using the term "socialism" doesn't mean it was. Were capitalists expropriated? Did workers take control of production? Was there a revolution? Nope, nope, nope.

Funny how no one has bothered to mention the economic instability of relying heavily on oil revenues for social welfare programs. Venezuela is not the only country suffering the consequence of that; Saudi Arabia is enacted its first income tax and enforcing austerity, and fuel subsidies and other programs have been cut in other countries with a similar set up - whether they are monarchies or "socialist".

The things will be worse to Venezuela now that Brazil changed to a government that is against Cuba philosophy in Latin America. It won't receive more money from Brazil.

Pedro Rezende
Vespasiano MG,
https://youtube.com/c/minasgeraisrailways1



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/16/16 17:11 by pedrop.

Well it sure wasn't capitalism nor monarch but, very close to dictator, especially while Chevez was there.  So that leaves communism or socialism.  Take your choice, both are horrible.

Chavez said many times he was a Marxist Socialist, just like the Castros...

PHall Wrote:
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> Chavez said many times he was a Marxist Socialist,
> just like the Castros...

I believe one A Hitler called himself a socialist as well, but I don't think he was one. Chavez was an authoritarian nationalist, he certainly wasn't a socialist as understood in some parts of the world. People call themselves lots of things they're not, look at Donald Trump.

inCHI Wrote:
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> Dare I enter into this?
>
> Venezuela was a left-nationalist regime, like many
> in the region and around the world. Leaders using
> the term "socialism" doesn't mean it was. Were
> capitalists expropriated? Did workers take control
> of production? Was there a revolution? Nope, nope,
> nope.
>
> Funny how no one has bothered to mention the
> economic instability of relying heavily on oil
> revenues for social welfare programs. Venezuela is
> not the only country suffering the consequence of
> that; Saudi Arabia is enacted its first income tax
> and enforcing austerity, and fuel subsidies and
> other programs have been cut in other countries
> with a similar set up - whether they are
> monarchies or "socialist".

Actually Chavez called it the Bolivarian Revolution (named after Simon Bolivar) and said he was emulating the Cuban revolution.  Which is socialistic in that price controls, very high taxes on private enterprises, and nationalizing private outfits that didn't get on board.   The elections were fixed and the dictatorship thrived.  Then charismatic Chavez got cancer and died,  putting his hand-picked successor Maduro in power.  And he doesn't have a clue how to run the government, not to mention losing the oil revenue needed to fund the operation.  Now there are no medicines, basics like Pampers, cooking oil, toilet paper, beer and most other foodstuffs.  When you start controlling prices, producers quit producing, farmers quit growing, and you're on the way to killing inflation, lack of hard currency and chaos.  Don't call it socialism if you like but the result is the same.  The system doesn't work.

But like other countries in Latin America,  the tremendous gap between rich and poor fuels this and when a charismatic leader says he has the answer the poor tend to follow.   Happened here in Chile in 1971 with the election of Salvador Allende.   Within no time there were lines to buy basics (my then 12-year old future wife has great stories about waiting hours to get a bit of rice), inflation, etc.  Come 1973 and the dictatorship took over and the dark years followed, altlhough they also established a capitalist economy which has served the nation well.  But today the poor are demanding more and the government is holding 'meetings' about what to do, if anything.  They never seem to learn.  But following a leader with sound bite answers to ills of a nation seldom ends well.

As for Venezuela,  it doesn't seem like Maduro can hold out much longer.  Opposition members either in jail or pretty much muffled about saying anything, a puppet supreme court, and all kinds of press repression.   Not to mention two day work weeks due to no electricity,  infrastructure falling apart,  street crime worse than in Iraq, etc.  We who live in the southern hemisphere are all wondering when the army will take over and who knows what will happen after that.  Gonna be a hot summer up there.

UPDATE:  Just read a Business Week article reporting that most of the government-seized businesses are now in the hands of the army's top ranking officers.   Which would explain why they're doing nothing and probably won't until a civil war breaks out.  Hard to imagine things will continue as at present much past summer.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/16 12:55 by masterphots.

Marxist, socialist, when you add throwing people in prison with no reasonable trial or shooting them, as Castro did and does,  I call that communism.

tomstp Wrote:
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> Marxist, socialist, when you add throwing people
> in prison with no reasonable trial or shooting
> them, as Castro did and does,  I call that
> communism.

Khadaffi did the same thing in Libya and he wasn't a Communist, just a Dictator.

tomstp Wrote:
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> Marxist, socialist, when you add throwing people
> in prison with no reasonable trial or shooting
> them, as Castro did and does,  I call that
> communism.

There is no evidence that the Cuban government is executing prisoners, political or criminal. Most of the executions that did occur took place immediately after the Revolution. Unlike the US, Cuba does not have capital punishment. The once exception was for 3 plane hijackers in 2003. So your term "does" is incorrect.