Western Railroad Discussion > 567 Engines

So in my drunken stupor, I will post this, since I'm enough times out on the extra board that it poses no threat to my job. A few days ago, I spotted a large grain industry that has it's own power for moving cars about the plant. After riding the shove deep, I had to walk up to make the cut on our power so we could return to the yard light engine. The walk from the rear of the loop track to the headend took me past an old high-hood geep, still in Conrail blue. It looked like either a GP-7 or a GP-9, I really couldn't care less. But I knew it was of the vintage that would mean it had a 567 engine in it. I was very impressed with how smooth the idle chant of this unit was, just sitting there, purring away, waiting for the longshoremen to climb aboard with a new assignment. It was a much smoother idle than the rattly clank and cough of our POS switch engines. Don't ask what road I work for, they'll just fire me if they find out as is the tradition of carriers these days. Anyhoo, that is all. I'm out.

~GP-38, lurking Trainorders.com since well before the Coppermedia days.

Also, don't believe the second edit counter. The first one is real.

Edited 1,845,693 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/09 00:23 by GP-38.

I enjoy the idle sound of locos. The gray switcher at California state railroad museum or the former West Oakland Amtrak switcher SW-1 "Little toot" have a melodic smooth idle.
At Portola last Railroad Days year the DDA40X centennial had the hood doors open for all to see and hear. SMOOTH!!
On the other hand :^(
A late model 6-axle GE road Loco. like C40-8W clatters like a bucket of bolts. Sounds terrible.
Someone said the horrible clatter is the turbo but I don't know the internals that well.
Ever heard an EMD F-7 (567 prime mover),, like music.. Cal-P

GP-38 Wrote:
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But I knew it was of the vintage that
> would mean it had a 567 engine in it. I was very
> impressed with how smooth the idle chant of this
> unit was, just sitting there
GP-38.

567-645-710 all have the same bore just longer stokes.

I'm wondering if it not the engine size so much as the exhaust reverberating through a muffler, not a turbocharger.

Kit Courter
Menefee, CA
LunarLight Photography

GP-38: You didn't say what kind of engine your POS switch engines have (12-645E? Genset with Cummins?) but if they're all EMD, the difference could be idle speed. A 567B, for instance, idles at 275 RPM. EMD drove idle speed down to improve fuel economy (particularly important in switchers because they idle a lot); modern EMD's idle at 200 RPM. Fewer strokes means rougher idle.

Cal-P: An EMD fires every revolution, while a GE fires only every second revolution. That's why EMD's sound smoother (more exhaust pulses) than the chugga-chugga-chugga of GE's, which is particularly noticeable at low engine speeds.

QU25C: Not quite.
567: 8.5 X 10 B x S.
645: 9.062 X 10.
710: 9.062 X 11.

CimaScrambler: Those GP7/9's don't have a turbo, but they ain't got no muffler either; just a spark-arrester manifold, if they're lucky.

ddkid Wrote:
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>
> CimaScrambler: Those GP7/9's don't have a turbo,
> but they ain't got no muffler either; just a
> spark-arrester manifold, if they're lucky.


OK, the point being the exhaust pressure waves coming through the pipe (manifold) and out the stack aren't destroyed by passing through the turbine, so we hear the soft "chugga" instead of a whine. It is the pressure waves eminating from the stack that give the non-turbo engines their characteristic sound, just like those coming from a musical intrument of similar mode (think pipe organ or clarinet). If one took the sound coming from a clarinet and passed them through a turbine, they would not sound like Benny Goodman anymore (assuming one could pass enough air to spin the turbine and they managed to sound like Benny when fingering the instrument).

Sorry to have been imprecise previously.

Kit Courter
Menefee, CA
LunarLight Photography

The thing about the 567, or even the 645 non-turbo varieties, instant power now. Anytime I was called up for a work train job (Caltrain), I always enjoyed running the GP9's and MP15DC's, especially the more I could have on a train the louder it could be, no ear plugs on those days.

I'm reminded a story of one engineer who told me the day he ran a Bayshore to Watsonville Turn (on the SP) with just SW1500's, out of Hayward Park you start climing a hill towards Hillsdale. He continued to say that he had these things in run 8, just making a ton of noise and as he approached the platform at Hillsdale, this little old lady with a cane turned around and started to wave her cane. As he neared he could read the explatives coming from her lips, she wasn't too happy, hehe.

I was deployed to Incerlik Turkey a year or two after the first gulf war, I had the day off and was wlaking down the road past the base power plant, when what did I hear, the familiar chant of a 567 engine coming from the confines of the power plant!

Perhaps there was a small industrial diesel in the rear compartment to provide coolant heating and battery charging to allow the prime mover to shut down when not in use. These modifications have become quite popular.

Somebody who's a better theoretical musician than I should weigh in on the normally-aspirated 567's 'chant'. It's perfection. (Non-turbo 645's and 710's don't have it. Close, but no sonic cigar. Sorry.)

I believe it's a combination of the exhaust pipe resonance and regular pulses (per CimaScrambler) and the frequencies of the Roots blower. And possibly the generator. But if you listen to the distinct pitches, you'll hear natural harmonic intervals. GE hasn't got them. ALCo didn't either.

What that means is that you have recognizable tone modulation, in octaves and possibly thirds, which make a pleasing major chord. And a root tone with a tune you can hum. Any kid fan from 567 days could do his impression of a set of 567's leaving in full chant. (I could still clear a room at a party with mine if I wanted to. But I have restraint.)

Maybe it was accidental, because it's hard to believe that this musical note was engineered in. But it was the 1930's when the 567 was developed, and the 1930's were the pinnacle of blending industry with art. So... who knows?

What I do know is that I miss the rousing, hearty chorus of half a dozen 567's in full Mormon Tabernacle Choir mode. But an idling 567 crooner here and there is good enough for now. We all have to take what we can get.

Thanks for the musings, GP-38.

One thing that helps is the racks and the timing being set properly. One over-firing injector can alter the hum. Setting the racks isn't that difficult, but the timing is a chore requiring a certain amount of patience.

ddkid Wrote:
> QU25C: Not quite.
> 567: 8.5 X 10 B x S.
> 645: 9.062 X 10.
> 710: 9.062 X 11.
OK good info

The 567s big brother, the Cleveland 278 sound a bit alike as well.

Ahh, yes, I love that tune. Just today I was stopped at the Fifth St crossing in Oxnard, California. VCY was switching with their 7 (or 9); hadda roll the window down to listen, even though it wasn't working very hard. In the mid-1970s I watched the USS Kitty Hawk being pushed away from her berth at North Island. The best part? The delicious sound of a 567 in the nearest tug working REALLY hard.

sixaxlecentury Wrote:
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> The 567s big brother, the Cleveland 278 sound a
> bit alike as well.

More like little brother, the Cleveland is a smaller motor.

Gotta love the 9s.