Western Railroad Discussion > Cantara Loop derailment photos

Went back up to Cantara Loop this afternoon and got a couple of shots.

Photo#1. 5260 north returns to the scene of the crime. Yesterday evening it left Dunsmuir and had a mishap at Cantara. The rear of the train was pulled back to Dunsmuir and early this morning the power returned to Dunsmuir. Its second attempt was more successful as it passes the head end of last nights train.

Photo#2. A southbound passing the derailment site.

Photo#3. The signal crew replacing the crossing signals wiped out by the derailment.

Robert Morris Photography
http://www.snowcrest.net/photobob/index1.html

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Thanks, Bob.
I remember the big derailment there happened not long after the D&RGW experts instructed the SP on how to operate a mountain railroad, including their instructions about permitting more tonnage behind the head end power; and that was also a stringline situation.
Can anyone comment on the amount of trailing tonnage permitted behind the head end now?

Nice photos...thanks. Any idea how many cars derailed?
Roger Beckett

up833 Wrote:
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> Nice photos...thanks. Any idea how many cars
> derailed?
> Roger Beckett

Seven empty centerbeams

Ryan Wilkerson
Fair Oaks, CA

Second shot's a winner Bob, thanks for sharing.

Kent in Carmel Valley

Are those guard rails or are they trying to one up Lionel?

Rob

Below 3000 tons no restrictions. 3000-3500 tons 5 cars weighing 45 tons or more. 3500-4000 tons. 10 cars 45 tons or more. 4000-4500 tons 15 cars. 4500-5000 tons 20 cars

Geez, the cars traveled quite a distance from the rail, I'll bet that made a sound even though no one was there to hear it.

when are they going to learn that positioning multiple empty flats on these tight curves is justwaiting for an accidet to happen and conducive to possible stringlining everytime a train of this kind of train consist postioning negotiates these tight mountainous curvatures

Out_Of_Service Wrote:
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> when are they going to learn that positioning
> multiple empty flats on these tight curves is
> justwaiting for an accidet to happen and conducive
> to possible stringlining everytime a train of this
> kind of train consist postioning negotiates these
> tight mountainous curvatures


Lots of recent derailments involving those empty flats. I agree, it seems like they are missing something obvious. Still curious to hear if loads were behind this string of cars.
Also cool seeing the doomed train leave on the Duns cam. I bet that clip is getting record hits. Local news even showed it!

Very nice photos. What is the purpose of the rails between the gauge?
Thanks, John

jmbreitigan Wrote:
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> Very nice photos. What is the purpose of the rails
> between the gauge?
> Thanks, John


its a narrow guage double mainline!! LOL

jmbreitigan Wrote:
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> Very nice photos. What is the purpose of the rails
> between the gauge?
> Thanks, John


Maybe to keep the track itself from stringlining?

Most railroads had guard rails on bridges and through tunnels way back when. Well, the SP tore all of theirs out years ago, saying they were a maintenance headache and caused more of a problem with dragging equipment. UP kept theirs. UP takes over and the guard rails come back.

The rails are supposed to keep the cars in line with the track structure in case a set of wheels decide to jump off. Older pictures show guard rails closer to the running rails back then. The ones UP are putting in look more towards the center line of the track.


Nudge

jmbreitigan Wrote:
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> Very nice photos. What is the purpose of the rails
> between the gauge?
> Thanks, John


To keep a derailment from damaging the bridge and falling into the river.

ljj Wrote:
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> jmbreitigan Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Very nice photos. What is the purpose of the
> rails
> > between the gauge?
> > Thanks, John
>
>
> To keep a derailment from damaging the bridge and
> falling into the river.


They work pretty well so long as the cars remain upright. Once the cars tip over and the wheels cannot track between the rails in a stringline situation the guard rails no longer have a function.

Posted from Windows Phone OS 7



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/15/13 10:48 by fbe.

Maybe someone from the U.P. can explain the continued practice of empty centerbeam placement in trains traversing mountain grade. Whatever that practice may be, it's not working.... I've dealt with arrogant, young managers at another railroad who simply won't listen to words of advice. Somehow when things go south, they claim it wasn't THEIR fault!

Posted from iPhone

I'd stick them on the rear.

I have a buddy who is a UP engineer out of Portland, iirc, and he has ran empty centerbeam unit trains... fun.

Posted from Android

I seem to remember a video from the spill days of an uphill train with flatcars going around the loop showing daylight under the outside wheels. Maybe it was pig flats. Not like it's a new concept.

Out_Of_Service Wrote:
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> when are they going to learn that positioning
> multiple empty flats on these tight curves is
> justwaiting for an accidet to happen and conducive
> to possible stringlining everytime a train of this
> kind of train consist postioning negotiates these
> tight mountainous curvatures

The railroads know about this and have placement restrictions to prevent this from happening. Based upon years of experience I find yard masters and terminal trainmasters are just too LAZY to compare the train make up against the restrictions. If they found something out of place then the train would need to be reswitched. That would mean running another complete list and canceling that early quit for a switch crew who would likely go on OT so the Terminal Supt would yell at the yardmaster. When the train gets to the final terminal the empty cars would be out of block resulting in more switching time there. That terminal Supt would complain to the regional manager who would call the terminal Supt who's yard screwed up the blocking for safety and the yardmaster would get yelled at. Hey, the subdivision outside the originating terminal may be flatter and straighter than that mountain track two subdivisions away so just get the train out of town and let someone else worry about compliance.

The train crews are probably in too much of a hurry to check and if they do address the situation of noncompliance then all this is the crews problem and they are just trying to delay that train. Never mind it is the crew which will be the only persons likely to be disciplined over the derailment and train make up.

It is like they are all a bunch of osteriches with their heads up their,.....in the sand. They did it before and it was OK, it will possibly work this time.

At least I spent my early years working for the Mikwaukee out of Alberton where this stuff was important and the crews and yardmasters took the time and effort to make it right before the problems occurred. I sure miss those times and those people.

Posted from Windows Phone OS 7