Western Railroad Discussion > ATSF 3751 coming- here's what to expect at Fullerton Station

 If you’re going to Fullerton, CA, to see ATSF 1927-built steam engine 3751, here’s a guide for you.  It’s illustrated by Clifford Prather, editor of Orange County Railway Historical Society newsletter and excellent documentarian of the modern OC railroad scene.

Note all of this could be disrupted by a railroad strike.  On Saturday and Sunday, September 24 (10-5) and 25 (10-3), San Bernardino Railroad Historical Society’s 3751 will be at the Fullerton Transportation Center at 120 East Santa Fe Ave., more details here- https://www.sbrhs.org/news/media.html
Amtrak and Operation Lifesaver will be there with their free Track Safety Community Event, on the east side of the station- https://www.pacificsurfliner.com/blog/rail-safety-community-event/
Southern California Railway Plaza Association's free Fullerton Train Museum will also have their equipment present, three passenger cars and three cabooses- https://www.fullertontrainmuseum.org  They’re open 9:00 to noon the first and third Saturdays of the month, but will be closed Sept. 17. 
There are two parking structures plus parking lots and street parking by the depot, see bottom of map- https://www.cityoffullerton.com/home/showpublisheddocument/3030/637459321364270000  On the map, 164 is the display area (see Photo 1).

There may be food booths or food trucks on Sept. 24 and 25.  At the Amtrak Depot, with tables on the platform just feet away from the trains, is Santa Fe Express Cafe (see the view in Photo 2).  The Old Spaghetti Factory (in the UP Fullerton Depot that used to be across the tracks- Photo 11) is also next to the rails.  There are more nearby restaurants with a view of the tracks, lots of choices.

One of my favorite things to do at Fullerton is to stand on the overhead pedestrian bridge when a train passes under (Photo 3).  A train doesn’t get louder than when you are right over the exhaust stack.  A freight will be louder going eastbound (ebd) up the 0.6% grade.  You can look east at the Fullerton Junction (Mile Post 165.3=MP 45.7) EBCS (EastBound Control Signal) for the three main lines (Photo 4- note Track 4 on the right).  Anything other than a red signal indicates an ebd is lined up.  Looking west, you can read the intermediate signals (Photo 5).  A yellow or green (not a red or flashing yellow) on the signals for Main 2 or Main 3 means a westbound (wbd) train is lined up.  A green on the signal for Main 1 would indicate a wbd train lined up.

Photo 1- BNSF ES44C4 8094 rear DPU on empty ebd ethanol train, 2020-11-9.  The event display area is on the left, with some of the Fullerton Train Museum equipment in view.

Photo 2- table view of ebd CPR GE ES44AC 8927 from Santa Fe Express Cafe at Fullerton Station, 2021-8-30.

Photo 3- the pedestrian bridge, above modern Amtrak power (California DOT CDTX Siemens SC-44 2109) on wbd No. 785 on the right and SCAX (EMD F125 930) on ebd No. 606 on the left, 2020-9-17.  They are on Track 1 and Track 3 per Amtrak station announcements, Main 1 and Main 3 per BNSF track charts.
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/22 14:56 by mapboy.

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Photo 4- Fullerton Junction EastBound Control Signal (EBCS), BNSF wbd “Q” train with ES44AC 6082 and SCAX wbd train 687 with Hyundai Rotem (Korea) cab car 680 approaching.  Note Metrolink Platform and Track 4 on the right, 2019-6-21.  The curving spur on the left leads to the event display area. 

Photo 5- SCAX ebd No. 664 with MPI MP36PH-3C 894; BNSF DPU C44-9W 4480 on wbd “S” train; BNSF ES44C4 8290 on ebd “Z”, 2020-12-19. 

Photo 6- Amtrak wbd No. 3 with GE P42DC 62 and six cars, 2021-12-20.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/22 14:09 by mapboy.

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Here’s the Fullerton train symbol count from Sunday, 8/7/22 to Saturday, 8/13/22, from viewing Railstream’s Fullerton Station railcam.  That’s BNSF's San Bernardino Sub, plus Amtrak and Metrolink (SCAX) via trackage rights.  I started out noting only ebd trains, to see if I could match BNSF’s trains with their symbols.  After three days, I decided I should note both directions.  Unfortunately, that means below I have a full week of ebd trains but only a four-day sample of wbd trains.  Because traffic varies with days of the week, a four-day sample is not as accurate a measure as a seven-day sample.  There is a big reduction in weekend commuter trains, so weekday and weekend totals are shown separately.

Here is the eastbound only seven-day total of trains from Sunday, 8/7/22, to Saturday, 8/13/22:
Z    36 priority intermodal= 5.1/day
Q   24 intermodal=             3.4/day
S   46 marine stacks=        6.6/day (four more combined into U-WATxxx ethanol trains)
B     0 baretable
V     0 vehicle
H   11 manifest=                 1.6/day H-LACBAR1 and H-WATBAR1
L   13 local=                       1.9/day Slab, 2nd La Mirada, 5th La Mirada
U    4 ethanol=                   0.6/day U-WATxxx7 Watson (all “combo" trains)
U    2 rock=                        0.3/day U-VRNVVC0 Vernon-Victorville
U    1 geometry=                0.1/day U-LACCHI5
D    0 light engines                                                                                               
   137 freight=                   19.6/day

       7 Amtrak=                       1/day Southwest Chief No.4
     70 Amtrak=                     10/day Pacific Surfliner 500s and 700s
   112/42 Metrolink=             16/day weekday, 6/day weekend, commuter trains
                    63/28=               9/day weekday, 4/day weekend, OC Line 600s
                    49/14=               7/day weekday, 2/day weekend, 91 Line 700s
A 189/119 passenger=        27/day weekday, 17/day weekend                           
    325/255 all trains=          46.4/day weekday, 36.4/day weekend
Weekday/weekend left column passenger train counts above are 7x weekday and weekend scheduled trains, to match per day column.

Here is the westbound only four-day total of trains from Wednesday, 8/10/22, to Saturday, 8/13/22:
Z   13 priority intermodal=  3.3/day
Q   20 intermodal=             5.0/day
S   28 marine stacks=        7.0/day
B     5 baretable=               1.3/day
V     1 vehicle=                   0.3/day V-xxxWAT, 59 empty? auto racks
H     5 manifest=                1.3/day H-BARLAC1 and H-BARWAT1
L      7 local=                      1.8/day Slab, 2nd La Mirada, 5th La Mirada
U     3 ethanol=                  0.8/day U-xxxWAT7 Watson
U     1 rock=                       0.3/day U-VVCVRN0 Victorville-Vernon
U     0 geometry
D     2 light engines=         0.5/day D-BARLAC3 (10 units) and D-? (11 units)     
     85 freight=                  21.3/day

       4 Amtrak=                      1/day Southwest Chief No. 3
     40 Amtrak=                    10/day Pacific Surfliner 500s and 700s
     60/24 Metrolink=            15/day weekday, 6/day weekend, commuter trains
                    40/16=            10/day weekday, 4/day weekend, OC Line 600s
                      20/8=              5/day weekday, 2/day weekend, 91 Line 700s
A  104/68 passenger=        26/day weekday, 17/day weekend                            
    190/154 all trains=         47.5/day weekday, 38.5/day weekend
Weekday/weekend left column passenger train counts above are 4x weekday and weekend scheduled trains, to match per day column.


Average eastbound (seven days) + westbound (four days) train count:
    Eastbound + Westbound=    Total
Z     5.1/day   +       3.3/day=   8.4/day priority intermodal
Q    3.4/day            5.0/day=   8.4/day intermodal
S    6.6/day            7.0/day=  13.6/day marine stacks
B    0                      1.3/day=   1.3/day baretable
V    0                      0.3/day=   0.3/day vehicle 32/day intermodal trains=78%  
H    1.6/day            1.3/day=   2.9/day manifest
L     1.9/day            1.8/day=   3.7/day local 6.6/day manifest trains=16%         
U    0.6/day            0.8/day=   1.4/day ethanol
U    0.3/day            0.3/day=   0.6/day rock
U    0.1/day              0=           0.1/day geometry 2.1/day other unit trains=5% 
D    0                      0.5/day=   0.5/day light engines 1%                                      
137=19.6/day+85=21.3/day=40.9/day freight

          1/day              1/day=       2/day Amtrak Southwest Chief No. 3 and 4
        10/day            10/day=     20/day Amtrak Pacific Surfliner 500s and 700s
        16/day            15/day=     31/day Metrolink weekday commuter trains
          6/day              6/day=     12/day Metrolink weekend commuter trains
A      27/day            26/day=     53/day weekday passenger
A      17/day            17/day=     34/day weekend passenger                               
        46.6/day +      47.3/day=  93.9/day weekday all trains
        36.6/day +      38.3/day=  74.9/day weekend all trains


Note: no grain, coal or oil trains pass by Fullerton.  The daily freight train count was Sun 8/7/22= 20 ebd; Mon= 17 ebd; Tue= 21 ebd; Wed= 19 ebd, 23 wbd; Thu= 22 ebd, 21 wbd; Fri= 19 ebd, 22 wbd; Sat= 18 ebd, 20 wbd.

Unlike Virtual Railfan, Railstream railcams are not on YouTube, therefore no thumbnails along the timeline to easily spot trains.  I find the trains by logging the BNSF San Bernardino Sub ATCS, playing it back and noting when long trains pass Fullerton.  Short trains that fit entirely within the interlocking are almost always passenger trains.  I have the Railstream engineer membership, so I have their 30-hour archive to look at trains visually to determine symbols.  Due to that 30-hour time constraint, most of the short trains were not looked at on camera, unless they came in or out of La Mirada Yard to the west, indicating La Mirada locals and H-LACBAR1/H-BARLAC1.

The latest of the Amtrak Southwest Chief No. 3s this week was six hours late, none were on time (due at 6:54 AM).  One was an hour late, three were about two hours late.  Since No. 4 is only 35 minutes away from its point of origin, its timekeeping was good, with six out of seven within ten minutes of schedule at 6:30 PM.  The other one was 37 minutes late.  Photo 6 is Amtrak No. 3.

Amtrak Pacific Surfliners through Fullerton that are numbered in the 500s run San Diego-Los Angeles-San Diego (six each way).  Those in the 700s run San Diego-Goleta-San Diego (four each way), with two extended to/from San Luis Obispo.  That's ten Surfliners each way, both weekdays and weekends, 20 total per day.  They have a standard consist of six cars- two business class cars, the coach-café car, two coaches and the cab-baggage coach.  One of the business class cars is a superliner coach in either an Amtrak scheme or painted in blue/silver scheme similar to the Surfliner cars.  A superliner lounge car is used at times and some California cars from up north are seen.  The trains all use 2100s Siemens SC-44 locomotives, usually with one on the south end of the train.  An extra unit does appear when there is a locomotive or cab car failure and this second unit will be used normally on the opposite end of the train.  Private cars appear from time to time and are usually behind the cab car going to San Diego and behind the locomotive heading to L.A.  The major exception to the six-car Surfliner is during the Del Mar race track season/Comic-con period when a block of cars and a locomotive are added, cut off in San Diego, then added to a later train.  This season it has normally been two extra coaches and a locomotive.  Which trains have the extra cars is determined by the start time of the races at Del Mar.  Most often train No. 770 and No. 591 will have the extra cars.  Some busy trains, especially at holiday periods, may get an extra coach-cab car between LA- San Diego which allows easy cutting in an out of the extra car.

Metrolink runs trains that have four to six cars, usually the same amount on the same train each day.  While most Metrolink trains run into L.A. cab car first, some trains through Fullerton run locomotive first towards L.A.  I think this is because of Inland Empire-OC Line trains turning into Orange County Line trains at Mission Viejo/Laguna Niguel.  See Photos 7-9.

So what’s the pattern of passenger train platform assignments?  In the morning, westward passenger trains use the Track 3 platform and eastward trains use the Track 1 platform.  Around 11 AM, the pattern changes to westward passenger trains use Track 1 and eastward trains use Track 3.  This is in effect seven days a week.  No. 3 and 4 usually follow this pattern, but changes can be made by the dispatcher as conditions warrant.

Fullerton Station is at MP 165.0.  Main 1 is closest to the station (called Track 1 by Amtrak agents that make public announcements at the Fullerton Station).  Main 3 is farthest from the station.  That’s 3 Main Track-CTC.  Track 4 is the stub track east of the pedestrian bridge that pre-pandemic hosted Mission Viejo/Laguna Niguel-Fullerton Metrolink commuter trains.  East of Fullerton Jct., the BNSF San Bernardino Sub and the Metrolink Orange Sub are Two Main Track-CTC.  Speeds are 79 MPH passenger-50 MPH freight west of Fullerton Jct., but 45P-40F for the curve east of Fullerton Jct. on the San Bernardino Sub.  It is 55P-40F for the curve on Metrolink’s Orange Sub.

Photo 7- SCAX EMD F125 937 on ebd No. 660 in front of the depot, 2022-7-4.

Photo 8- SCAX MPI MP36PH-3C 902, built 2008, and EMD F125 930, built 2017, pushing on wbd No. 687, 2022-8-15.

Photo 9- SCAX MPI MP36PH-3C 901, heading east on No. 686, and SCAX EMD F125 927 on wbd No. 609.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/22 14:47 by mapboy.

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Who are the hottest of the hot, with a six-pack up front?  That would be the Z-LACWSP1, Z-LACWSP2 and Z-LACNYC1, all with a lot of UPS traffic and 6x0 power.  Wednesday mornings all three are scheduled to pass Fullerton.  Tuesday mornings you’ll get the two WSPs.

The four manifests that pass Fullerton have regular days and on duty times, but now their schedule is often determined by crew or power availability.  Setouts and pick ups by inexperienced crew members also delay the trains.  In two weeks late July- early August, the H-LACBAR1 passed Fullerton Mon-Fri between 12:00 and 15:00.  The H-BARLAC1 was seen Sat-Thu between 00:01-10:00, although it’s scheduled for 21:00-22:00.  If you see vegetable oil or corn syrup or more than ten box cars, that’s the LAC trains, with the Watsons usually the opposite.  The H-WATBAR1 was seen Mon-Sat during one week, between 17:00 and 20:15.  That same week the H-BARWAT1 was seen Sat, Tue-Thu at various hours.

There are three locals that pass Fullerton:
The loaded steel slab train is L-CAL1911 ebd from the harbor Mon-Fri 21:00-23:59.  It returned empty from Fontana as L-CAL1931 wbd Tue-Sat 23:30-next day 01:15.
The 2nd La Mirada R-CAL0081 (Mon-Fri) comes out of La Mirada Yard, passed noon to 13:00 on Mon and Wed to go down Metrolink's Orange Sub to work the Kimberly Spur.  Two GP60s and usually less than ten cars, they returned around 14:30 (see Photo 10).
The 5th La Mirada R-CAL0162 ( Mon-Fri) is also out of La Mirada Yard and had a maximum of twelve cars.  For the urban night stalkers, here was that week’s 5th La Mirada schedule:
     Monday- ebd by Fullerton at 20:35, switched Orange Sub west of La Palma, returned to Fullerton at 22:44, reversed east on San Bernardino Sub to Atwood, reversed there to work the Olive Sub, came out at Orange onto the Orange Sub, where it reversed and went through Fullerton at 23:01 to complete the triangle.  In the count above, that would be ebd and wbd twice each at Fullerton.  Most days they return after midnight, so that complicates the count.
     Tuesday- same routine as Monday, ebd at Fullerton at 21:58 and 23:05, wbd at 22:51 and 00:27.
     Wednesday- ebd at Fullerton at 20:48 to the Orange Sub, switch King Plastics in Orange, continue to the Irvine Spur to make the long winding trip to Braun Medical Instruments to drop more plastic pellets, then return wbd to Fullerton at 00:20.
     Thursday- ebd at Fullerton at 20:38 to Atwood, reverse to work the Olive Sub, onto the Orange Sub at Orange, and reverse wbd through Fullerton at 21:51.  When it went ebd past Fullerton, it had a yellow and green caboose (technically a "shoving platform").  When it returned, it had a dark blue caboose, but still the same BN 12568. After it traverses the triangle, it shows a different painted side.
     Friday- I have not seen the 5th La Mirada pass Fullerton on a Friday.

All four empty Watson ethanol “U” trains were combined in the harbor area with an “S” stack train into a “combo” train to save a train crew.  The heavy “S” train goes in front, the empty “U” on the rear (see Photo 11).  Power variations were 4x2x1, 4x2x0 and 3x2x1.  There was a 15k baretable B-WSPLAC1 with 3x1x0 power.  A Q-NYCLAC6 was combined with a B-MEMLAC3 baretable, 4x2x0.  Other combo trains past Fullerton- Q-ATGLAC6 (2x2x0), Q-MEMLAC6 (2x3x0), Q-LACATG6 (3x3x0), Q-LACCXO1 (3x3x0), and many “S” trains.  “Z”s are not exempt, there was a 13,000’ long Z-LACMEM8 3x3x0, and into SBD Z-CHISBD6s and Z-CHISBD8s.  The Memphis and the SBDs don’t have trailers so you wouldn’t suspect they are “Z” trains, although not very high priority ones.  The average was two 13k to 15k trains per day in each direction past Fullerton.

You can compare the above Fullerton count to Cajon (Lugo Virtual Railfan camera) from June, 2020, during the pandemic period with reduced rail traffic-
https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,5046821,5047424#msg-5047424
Lugo has only Amtrak No. 3 and 4 passenger trains, no Metrolink, but additional freight trains from San Bernardino, San Diego and Kaiser.  The count there was 48 BNSF trains per day, eight UP trains/day and two Amtrak trains/day=58/day.  That excludes UP’s Mojave Sub trains, they’re not visible from Lugo.

mapboy with much help, especially photos and passenger train info by Clifford Prather. Also much anonymous help.


Photo 10- BNSF 2nd La Mirada Road Switcher wbd, with EMD GP60M-3 122, EMD, 6 cars and shoving platform, 2020-1-2.

Photo 11- BNSF ebd “S” stack train, two mid-train DPUs, and empty U-WATxxx7 ethanol train with protective buffer car, 2020-11-9.  Rear end in Photo 1 above.  The Spanish tile roof of the ex-Union Pacific Depot is visible over the second car.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/22 14:54 by mapboy.

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Another great job by mapboy on a very detailed picture of what is moving through Fullerton! Thanks to you and Cliff also for the photos. 

Let's hope the strike doesn't mean this will be cancelled. But it may take that to hopefully, finally get fair treatment for railroaders. 

Bruce 

Very interesting series!!

Larry

An amazing amount of compiled information here.

~ Mr. MRL

Fantastic shots and information - thanks!

Great info and nice shots!!