Western Railroad Discussion > BNSF Wabtec Order

Scuttlebutt is that BNSF has ordered 7 ES44ACH models (6 motor) and 25 ET44C6H models, H in this ballasted to
436K, 4K heavier than the previous H models. The C4 issues finally seem to have sunken in.

Out 

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Scuttlebutt is that BNSF has ordered 7 ES44ACH
> models (6 motor) and 25 ET44C6H models, H in this
> ballasted to
> 436K, 4K heavier than the previous H models. The
> C4 issues finally seem to have sunken in.

What is the difference between ACH and C6H?

> -----
> > Scuttlebutt is that BNSF has ordered 7 ES44ACH
> > models (6 motor) and 25 ET44C6H models,


> What is the difference between ACH and C6H?

Looks like the ACH is an ES44AC, so tier 3 compliant, while the C6H is an ET, tier 4...probably a credits/accounting issue related to EPA regs. Unless there's new software differences for the newer 6 motor units?

Posted from Android

Darren Boes
Lethbridge, AB
Southern Alberta Railfan

Rumor it is. Until they start delivering non C4 units or rebuilding the existing ones into 6 axle units I won't believe it. We have been hearing this crap since they took delivery of the first ones.

Pacific5th Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rumor it is. Until they start delivering non C4
> units or rebuilding the existing ones into 6 axle
> units I won't believe it. We have been hearing
> this crap since they took delivery of the first
> ones.

no rumor, fact. There's a tight angle rostershot of BNSF 3650 on Flickr still at the factory but you can clearly see the trucks are typical Hi-AD's and lack the weight transfer system for the center axle which would be on a C4.

Bryan Jones
Brooks, KY
Bryan's Train Photos

redneckrailfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Pacific5th Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Rumor it is. Until they start delivering non C4
> > units or rebuilding the existing ones into 6
> axle
> > units I won't believe it. We have been hearing
> > this crap since they took delivery of the first
> > ones.
>
> no rumor, fact. There's a tight angle rostershot
> of BNSF 3650 on Flickr still at the factory but
> you can clearly see the trucks are typical Hi-AD's
> and lack the weight transfer system for the center
> axle which would be on a C4.

I will believe it when it is delivered. I'll also wait to see if they continue the trend. They were ordering both 4 and 6 powered axles at the same time years ago. We will also see if they start rebuilding older ones. One order doesn't mean they are dumping the system.

Suppose to be 100 unit order. All will go into service at Alliance, NE.

Pacific5th Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Rumor it is.

It's no rumor, they're literally on the Wabtec floor being built right now with six traction motors. Should see the first one on the property later this month

A six motor GE at 436K lbs should start somewhere around 225K lbs of tractive effort. With all those solid knuckles
out there needing replacement, should be a party!

Out 

callum_out Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A six motor GE at 436K lbs should start somewhere
> around 225K lbs of tractive effort. With all those
> solid knuckles
> out there needing replacement, should be a party!
>
> Out 

On CSX we have ballasted GE's all over the place....you can tear up a train if you want to, but we are trained to get going gently. Skin her back only when the whole train is moving well along. 

I was chuckling at the post on BNSF new hires and wondering what a 90 day wonder hoghead
would do with one of the new six motors!

Out 

How are they able to go up to 436K lb's? I thought years back when the 432K units came out that was the absolute max individual axle loading possible? These ought to be absolute monsters on unit trains! Who wants to guess they'll go to Helena, MT and broke in as pushers? Haha. 

NWrailfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How are they able to go up to 436K lb's? I thought
> years back when the 432K units came out that was
> the absolute max individual axle loading possible?
> These ought to be absolute monsters on unit
> trains! Who wants to guess they'll go to Helena,
> MT and broke in as pushers? Haha. 

Interesting question. In the diesel era, the general thinking was not to exceed 65,000 lbs per axle, then it went to 68,000 lbs per axle, then 70,000 lbs per axle, then finally 72,000 lbs per axle. So now, they are at 72,666 lbs per axle? 

NWrailfan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Who wants to guess they'll go to Helena,
> MT and broke in as pushers? Haha. 

Well, maybe Laurel MT.  I'd put money out that BNSF elliminates manned pushers on the (soon to be) ex-MRL territories in favor of DPU's (similar to what UP does to get through eastern Oregon's Blue Mtns).



 

I think that's a safe bet, another would be the elimination of the manner helpers on Tehachapi for the grain/cottonseed
trains though at least those make some operational sense.

Out 

Doesn't MRL have the manned helpers over Mullan Pass for the same reason BNSF now uses them on the east side of Tehachapi Pass? i.e. short but steep grade but no more need for all that power once they crest the grade. Instead of tying up a bunch of locomotives as DPU's that are not being used for most of the trip you use a few for the one part of the run that needs the power, but they can help multiple trains while the DPU units are stuck on just one train.
At least that's how it was explained to me.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/01/23 15:23 by PHall.

Along with the weight these will also come with extended range high capacity dynamic brakes and will have a lot of effort and traction in dynamic braking compared to stock AC units let alone the C4's! 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/23 06:59 by NWrailfan.

Mr. Hall has some good points and the Tehachapi set did away with the extra dupe power that collected
in Bakersfield. Right now at current traffic levels the helper return is hardly an issue though when things
were busy the extra move sometimes was a problem. Guess we will see.

Out 

Norfolk Southern still maintains several sets of manned helper units out of Altoona PA.  Some trains get a push to Cresson, near the top of the grade. Others get a push all the way to Pittsburgh, or back to Altoona.

Pacific5th Wrote:
> I will believe it when it is delivered.

https://flic.kr/p/2oBM6y3
Time to start believing.