Steam & Excursion > Oil-burners aren't real steam locomotives

The proposed conversion of Union Pacific 4014 to oil recalls some conversations I had with the public during my travels with 844. One question to my surprise that came up more than once was when the fact was mentioned that 844 was built as a coal- burner but converted to oil in 1946. I would get a quizzical, sad-eyed look and asked, "Do you mean this isn't a real steam engine?

Of course there were a lot of other questions. One of my favorites was when a woman asked what kind of an engine was inside to make it go.

I overheard a lot of "facts" standing around in the crowds by the locomotive. Seemingly everywhere we went, including on the Mop, there would be an old-timer boasting: "Yessiree, I used to run that engine!"

And when the 3985 was restored I heard some man telling his wife and kids: "Yup, that there's one of them "Big Boys,"

The 4014 ought to be fun,,,

JB



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/13 14:07 by Copy19.

You are so correct John. If we gave all the engineers a ride that ran the locomotives on their last run there wouldn't have been enough room on the tender for the bleachers we would have needed. Hmm, let's see. I was an engineer and I ran the engine to where you viewed it so technically at that moment would I not have been the last engineer to run it? LOL.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And when the 3985 was restored I heard some man
> telling his wife and kids: "Yup, that there's one
> of them "Big Boys,"
>
> The 4014 ought to be fun,,,
>
> JB

I'm sure that bit has been repeated hundreds of times.

All the more reason to get these engines out on the
high iron. Put American history back in the public
eye.

Those were not actually dumb questions, though they
certainly show the state of American education

Here's a question along similar lines - is it not true
that a nuclear power plant is in actuality, a steam
power plant?

Have there not been examples (few) of steam trains
converted to run on another form fuel and deemed
"not real"? Think park engines. Propane powered
engines and such.

As for where's the engine in the steam engine? A
great response would've been - that IS the engine!!

And UP #3985 is in fact, a big boy, just not the
"Big Boy". It's not so bizarre that likely only
a railfan knows what a Mikado is, right?

/Mitch

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> The proposed conversion of Union Pacific 4014 to
> oil recalls some conversations I had with the
> public doing my travels with 844. One question to
> my surprise that came up more than once was when
> the fact was mentioned that 844 was built as a
> coal- burner but converted to oil in 1946. I
> would get a quizzical, sad-eyed look and asked,
> "Do you mean this isn't a real steam engine?
>
> Of course there were a lot of other questions.
> One of my favorites was when a woman asked what
> kind of an engine was inside to make it go.
>
> I overheard a lot of "facts" standing around in
> the crowds by the locomotive. Seemingly
> everywhere we went, including on the Mop, there
> would be an old-timer boasting: "Yessiree, I used
> to run that engine!"
>
> And when the 3985 was restored I heard some man
> telling his wife and kids: "Yup, that there's one
> of them "Big Boys,"
>
> The 4014 ought to be fun,,,
>
> JB

I was amazed at how many 60ish guys told me that they had worked on 1522 or fired or ran her. She was retired in 1951.
One old guy in Tulsa told me he ran her and she was painted green. I mentioned her being a coal burner when delivered and he went ballistic. Even after I showed him the 1926 employee magazine with the stats from her break in run, how much water and COAL she used and showed him the stoker engine mounting pad and holes his only reply was "I beg to differ with you sir", so I told him it was time for me to get up in the cab and do the brake test.
Lotta that kind of stuff when you're involved with an operating steam engine and we had a member who was a great BSer who usually fielded this start of thing.
I even miss the annoying stuff. It was great while it lasted.

We get the same type of questionson the Oregon Coast Scenic RR. Most people come up and ask if it burns coal or wood. They are usually surprised when we tell them we burn recycled motor oil. One of our engineers was ready to toss a rider into the cab to look for coal because he was convinced that the engine could only burn coal based on the smell of the exhaust. When we run the Heisler we get even more questions because it looks less like a steam engine that most people expect.

All you can really do is be polite and educate the people. And be sure to get as many kids in the cab as possible.

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The 4014 ought to be fun,,,
>
> JB

John, aren't you glad you are retired from the Public Affairs office??? (grin)

Regards,
Burlington John

I used to work at a museum that operated a wood burning 4-4-0 and I can't tell you how may times I heard some father telling his son "And every so often they had to stop and cut down some trees.", never mind that the engine was from a desert road.

The Cotton Belt had a opean house where we were restoring the SSW 819 and over herd a lady ask if the tender was where they put the WOOD LOL just wondering how hi was it going to be stacked over the top of the tender LOL Matt Ritchie

We had just gotten into the station with our 36 ton standard gauge coal burning Heisler when a woman and her husband who had ridden the train asked one of our senior members, "Is that REAL coal?" Our senior member replied, "No, it's plastic!" To that the woman turned to her husband and said, "See, I told you it wasn't real coal!"

Roger Holmes

While sitting on the sand box of an oil tender, taking a break between runs. I had been hearing the typical "where is the coal?" question all day, I heard it one last time. I looked at the guy and said "sir, if this engine burned coal, I would be sitting on a pile of the stuff right now!"

PLACE: San Clemente, California
RR: ATSF
LOCOMOTIVE: F7 cab & booster on a San Diegan
DATE: 1970 (I am 14 years old)
OLD TIMER: "Son, that car in the back, behind the engine, that's called the tender, where they carry the fuel. It's one of them diesels, it burns fuel oil, not coal"

John Gezelius
Tustin, CA

Visitor looking at the 261 points at the sandbox atop the boiler: "Is that the dynamic brakes?"

"No sir... Let me explain..."

Posted from Android

Al Seever
Phoenix, AZ

Overheard a woman wondering out loud why they need a man onboard to put out fires? The fireman!

Kimball Wrote:
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> Overheard a woman wondering out loud why they need
> a man onboard to put out fires? The fireman!

No, that kind of fireman rides behind us in a hi-rail with the water bottle.

-LD

And when I'd tell visitors at the Gold Coast Railroad Museum that #153 was built
as an oil burner, NOT converted, they wouldn't believe me! Even after I explained
why the FEC didn't burn coal!

---

>
> John, aren't you glad you are retired from the
> Public Affairs office??? (grin)
>
> Regards,
> Burlington John

I don 't miss having to go to work. I miss being around Steve, Bob, Lynn, Mary, Reed, Art, Tom, Bob, Walter, Rusty, Joel, Mike, John, Fred, Sherman, Jim, Willie, Charles, Lowell, Dick and Greg, I miss being in the loop. I miss being a spokesman for Union Pacific Railroad.
JB

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > John, aren't you glad you are retired from the
> > Public Affairs office??? (grin)
> >
> > Regards,
> > Burlington John
>
> I don 't miss having to go to work. I miss being
> around Steve, Bob, Lynn, Mary, Reed, Art, Tom,
> Bob, Walter, Rusty, Joel, Mike, John, Fred,
> Sherman, Jim, Willie, Charles, Lowell, Dick and
> Greg, I miss being in the loop. I miss being a
> spokesman for Union Pacific Railroad.
> JB



And if anyone brought "honor" to the PR profession, it was JB who was always the epitome of professionalism and integrity and honesty. I worked in corporate PR and knew a lot of "snakes" and a lot of "pros" and JB was at the top of the PRO line. We are privileged to have him and his wife Pat as good personal friends since 1998 when I e-mailed him about one of his paintings I saw in the UP Gift shop at the HQ in Omaha------------the UP had one of the finest.
C.

Carol Voss
Bakersfield, CA

I'm gonna have to remember some of those lines so I can ask some probing questions next time I'm trackside.

crackerjackhoghead Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I used to work at a museum that operated a wood
> burning 4-4-0 and I can't tell you how may times I
> heard some father telling his son "And every so
> often they had to stop and cut down some trees.",
> never mind that the engine was from a desert road.

Now, in the favor of the guy saying that: if you dig back into some of the popular magazines of the era, you will find woodcuts showing a small passenger or mixed train stopped somewhere, and a few guys out chopping down trees, with the caption saying that they had run out of wood and had to forage for more. You can also find woodcuts showing passengers out picking up deadwood, with a similar notation about having run out of wood in the middle of nowhere, and needing to forage.

That sort of thing often showed up in the equivalent of News of the World, so one had to take it with a few pounds of salt. But I don't think we could honestly say that something like that NEVER happened. There was an awful lot of improvisation in the early railroad era.