Steam & Excursion > A Sleeping Giant Awaits It's Awakening - SP 4449 - 1971

As we continue with the 1472-Day inspection work on SP Daylight 4449, it is good to recall how she looked before all this started in the first place.

First put on display in Portland Oregon's Oaks Park in April 1958, #4449 had seen only 17 years of active service on the SP before being retired along with the rest of SP's steam fleet. While she was given a fresh paint job and otherwise in perfect shape at the time she was put on display, the outside storage in Porltand's damp climate along with minimal fencing left her subject to deterioration from the weather and from vandals.

By October 1971, when this photo was taken, the mood of this huge 4-8-4 was fairly somber as she pondered her future. Unseen were the efforts of local Railfan and steam enthusiast, Jack Holst, who had taken the time over the years to visit the big Northern and keep her main axles lubricated so they would not become so pitted as to render her a park display for all time.

In less than 3 years after this photo was taken, 4449 would be visited by Doyle McCormack and his American Freedom Train crew for inspection. They would soon return later that same year, 1974, and pull 4449 off her display and commence what would become several restorations over the next 40 years to keep the engine in service.

True, the brooding giant is asleep in this photo. However, not for long.


Martin



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/08/14 05:37 by LoggerHogger.

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Credit the actions of the few and be thankful for what we have today…

Steve Mitchell
http://www.yardgoatimages.com

As our Oregon Rail Heritage Center exhibits committee ponders future exhibits, I have been thinking about where we might be today if the 4449 had not been selected to pull the American Freedom Train and where we might be if Doyle and Laurie had decided following the AFT romp to stay in the east. While I know that one can't "what if" too much, I do believe that tracing history back to some key and pivotal events is important to remember and record.

I am attempting to make the case that without the 4449 being selected to pull the AFT and Doyle coming back to Portland, we would not today have the three city of Portland steam locomotives under cover and available for public viewing. And as you say Martin, Jack Holst, is one of those key events......I wonder what all Jack would have done for rail history preservation if he hadn't gone to end of track in his mid-30s.

Establishing a permanent home in 2012 for these locomotives donated to the city of Portland in 1958, is one hell of an accomplishment for a bunch of volunteers......

Thanks Martin. Arlen

And, speaking of that Union Pacific 4-6-2, ... how's it coming? Any hope for future operation?

Keystone1 Wrote:
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> And, speaking of that Union Pacific 4-6-2, ...
> how's it coming? Any hope for future operation?

Slowly but surely. Between Holiday Express 2013, 4449's rebuild, and Doyle working to get his Alco PA up and running, not much has been done to the 197 recently. From my understanding though, they are still waiting for more parts to be fabricated before continuing restoration.

197 would be a fantastic little engine for the Holiday Express stuff. Probably wouldn't spread the rails on Samtrak like 700 did...

Looks like the little Pacific only gets worked on when everything else is caught up. None of my business, but that is not how the U.S. got to the moon.

Keystone1 Wrote:
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> Looks like the little Pacific only gets worked on
> when everything else is caught up. None of my
> business, but that is not how the U.S. got to the
> moon.


Well I'll be damned! I sure didn't realize that it was a volunteer project to put a man on the moon. You sure learn something every day on Train Orders.

Come on Jack...you know what I mean by the above comment.

Can we say 3203!...The 197 no longer exists! it was a 3-cylinder until rebuilt at Albina during the 20's!

You're right. Comparing a government program with basically unlimited capital resources is a spot on comparison with the 197...

Pump

Posted from iPhone

I'm talking about total...we can not fail...commitment.

That looks more like a junk yard than a park. I'm a bit surprised, as I thought Portland took more pride in their park system. Maybe this was a low point.

Since its restoration, we've seen 4449 travel in non-regular service configuration (AFT paint, BNSF black paint) and in various in-service configurations (Daylight Southern Pacific Lines, Southern Pacific Daylight, indicators forward and aft). At the risk of starting a war, why hasn't it been in the configuration found towards its end-of-service period, specifically black without skirts and solid-aluminum pilot? Is it because there's no desire or interest, or funds? Just curious.

I see work being done on the 197 (3203) weekly by multiple volunteers; these dedicated volunteers are making steady restoration progress... Arlen

On a cold and dreary winter's day, a new beginning...

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Heresy I know, but I swear that skirt-less black- mid 50's look on the GS's was just marvelous.

I read somewhere that 4449 can't be retrofitted to this appearance due to a number of "non-era" appliances which are hidden behind the skirts.
Too bad. I'd love to see the GS-4 doing an ACDC impression (IE: back in black).

And no - I don't count the BNSF specials.....

Brian E

m420 Wrote:
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> I read somewhere that 4449 can't be retrofitted to
> this appearance due to a number of "non-era"
> appliances which are hidden behind the skirts.
>
>
> Brian E

I must admit that I had not that excuse before. As much time as most of us on the crew have spent "up & under" the skirts, I am not aware of anything that is "non-era" about her appliances. The main, and MOST IMPORTANT", reason for NOT removing the skirting is: the extreme amount of labor involved to A0 remove them all including supports, and B) the huge amount of labor to "sanitize" every square inch of everything that would be exposed with no skirting. Just look at that great photo, above, and notice all that "stuff" that is available for viewing!

BCHellman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> At the risk of starting a war, why hasn't it
> been in the configuration found towards its
> end-of-service period, specifically black without
> skirts and solid-aluminum pilot? Is it because
> there's no desire or interest, or funds? Just
> curious.

BC, I visited with Doyle at Brooklyn in 2002 when 4449 was resplendent in her by-god-as-intended AFT colors (and you think you are starting a war! ;-) ) prior to the excursion to Bend. He made a comment that if somebody came up with the money AND was willing to do the work, he would paint the engine pink!

Regards,
Burlington John

HotWater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> m420 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > I read somewhere that 4449 can't be retrofitted
> to
> > this appearance due to a number of "non-era"
> > appliances which are hidden behind the skirts.
> >
> >
> > Brian E
>
> I must admit that I had not that excuse before. As
> much time as most of us on the crew have spent "up
> & under" the skirts, I am not aware of anything
> that is "non-era" about her appliances. The main,
> and MOST IMPORTANT", reason for NOT removing the
> skirting is: the extreme amount of labor involved
> to A0 remove them all including supports, and B)
> the huge amount of labor to "sanitize" every
> square inch of everything that would be exposed
> with no skirting. Just look at that great photo,
> above, and notice all that "stuff" that is
> available for viewing!
It was not that long ago that there was a TO discussion here mentioning the thought of painting 4449 basic black, and removing the skirts, just as in her last years of regular service. I had thought it was you Jack, but it must have been Doyle who responded to that thread by saying it would be a very unsightly move due to all the appliances he has added under the skirts over the years. I love the Daylight scheme, as an SP brat how could I NOT?, but have to agree with the critics who say 4449 just looks too sissy wearing all that makeup, it cheapens a girl, you know? I too would like to see another stint in basic black, makes 4449 look more like the brute she actually is! Anything BUT bicentennial colors, back in those days, I never saw such an ugly mishmash of really dumb paint schemes...all over the country, no less. AA

Stanford White
Carmel Valley, CA

Let's keep in mind after a mere 17 years in service, she is into her 39th post-restoration year, keeping railfans happy not just in the Pacific northwest but all over the USA. Those are some great thoughts, Arlen, and you are right. Personally I have contributed to her reputation as "the most photographed locomotive in the world."