Steam & Excursion > Royal Gorge conductor falls off moving train, dies

http://www.koaa.com/story/32089961/woman-dies-after-falling-off-royal-gorge-scenic-train

Link on western board says it was the conductor.

I'm wondering just who it was; after all the media calls everyone from the janitor to the engineer a "conductor."

Beyond that, I'd like to see what the investigation shows actually happened.  There has to be more to it than the train was just trundling down the track and someone took a careless header.  Could it have been during a run-around move with the engines changing ends and someone was riding a ladder and lost their grip?  Unexpected slack action and an opened door?

I would think there's more to it than, as an earlier poster panicked, someone flipped over the side of an open air car.

Mary McPherson
Dongola, IL
Diverging Clear Productions

ch 9 said it was heading into the gorge, they don't runaround usually, push pull

i am heart broken for her family and the rr



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/30/16 13:21 by dan.

The train was on the way out of the Royal Gorge with only 4 miles to terminate. She was the train conductor, the employee controling the movement.

This is very sad to the family of the young lady and all who knew her, and for the railroad.  What is strangest is that she had the authority to stop the train at any moment, and just speculating, she might have tried to swing between cars that were built without passageways, as she neared the end terminal.
 
Every one of the over 500 tourist railroads in North America should attempt to learn what really happened and review if their equipment would not prompt some unsafe occurrence.  Recently, an experienced lady companion of an engineer running a tourist train at North Freedom, WI fell as she walked down the fireman side of an S-1 Alco locomotive and in that stairway, her fall was in the blind spot to the engineer, and she was run over (killed) as he moved the engine on a cut-away from the cars.  If she had exited the engine under the engineer eyes he would have seen that she was OK or have seen that she fell.  She likely failed to get off facing the steps as the slanted steps on that engine tend to make folks go down forward, and that is also a hazard. Do not exit a locomotive cab without the engineer knowledge and OK so he sees that all is safe before he makes the next move
. 
Does anyone know what the make-up consist is of this Royal Gorge train?

The TRAINS organization should publish the entire event to all its members.
This is another example of when in doubt; take the very safest route possible, even if it means a few minutes train delay.  A tourist railroad does not need to move on the minute or second clock.
 

Re: Wisconsin incident..

If the incident occurred as described, who was the engineer of the Alco taking signals and directions from?
It seems like a tragic mistake, but were there other factors?
Who gave the directions to " cut-away" from the train?

Who was giving the signals to the operator of the engine, were they at the front of the engine during the move or were they 
away at a distance?  Were directions given by hand signals, or radio, or were there more than one person giving the signals?

The description seems sketchy, at best...

W.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/29/16 09:31 by wcamp1472.

At North Freedon,the passenger train arrived at terminal station and conductor from coach, directed movement after pulling the cutting lever, just as the lady passenger in the engine cab, went down the far steps away from the engineer.  The Alco S-1 was running cab forward.  The conductor knew nothing about, or could not see the lady exiting the engine cab, as she did not come down on the engineer's side and be in view of the conductor and the engineer.  I hope you can research the history as I am distant from the happening, and this is all I know.

A few things to respectfully keep in mind:
1. This young lady did not go to work yesterday planning to get hurt, let alone lose her life.
2. The Ashby ' s have been in the tourist railroad business for DECADES and most of those years with older, much more aged and historic equipment than what they are using now at the Royal Gorge. Chances of them lacking proper passageways or safety apparatus are pretty slim.
3. Let the FRA investigate this incident. Like it or not, it may take some time for the entire incident investigation and report to be made public. Like most all governmental agencies, the FRA is methodical and thorough. The use time tested processes and procedures to make sure they get this right the first time.
4. Show some respect for the employer and the deceased employee's family and withhold your speculation for now.

Remember, safety rules are always written in blood. We will all be able to learn something from this in due time.

Sincerely,

TrackGuy

Posted from Android

The normal makeup of the train is a passenger Geep on the west ( uphill ) end and a modified cab car leading the eastward
( downhill ) movement, from which I guess a trainman has control of the air.  I don't know if someone remains in the unit
on the other end or not, or whether the cab car is trainlined.

Definitely when the investigation is done, the results should be made available.  Any time something happens, there is a lesson to take away from it.

In my earlier post, I asked questions more of a rhetorical variety.  I have never been to the Royal Gorge and have no knowledge of the operations and practices.

All told, heritage railroads as a whole have a remarkable safety record; especially given that operations run the gamut from full-time to "weekend warriors."  Any time an incident happens, from Gettysburg to the Arkansas & Missouri to the incidents mentioned here, it bears repeating that even the oldest restored equipment must be respected.

Just stating the obvious and probably preaching to the choir.

Mary McPherson
Dongola, IL
Diverging Clear Productions

When I did a cab ride three years ago, the train was operated from the engine cab on the west end.  On the reverse move back to Canon city the engineer in the cab was controlling the train with instruction from a crew member on the rear of the east end. 

Still done this way.

drgwrgs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When I did a cab ride three years ago, the train
> was operated from the engine cab on the west
> end.  On the reverse move back to Canon city the
> engineer in the cab was controlling the train with
> instruction from a crew member on the rear of the
> east end. 

According to the Fremont County Sheriff’s office she was standing at the back of the train in a door opening as the train was backing up en route to the Canyon City station.  She fell off the end and the train ran over her and she was visibly deceased.   With all due respect to the young lady, her family and friend, and with my 20 years of railroad accident investigation (with answer before you go home), I feel there is sufficient information from this report to advise any tourist railroad using the backup movement to immediately have chains, bars, gates or other protection to prevent someone from falling out if the slack runs in or other train handling incident occurs.  Personal hand hold is not sufficient.  I imagine some Dutch door will be built on the end equipment of the railroad, and is likely the reason for the cancellation for several days.  This is very sad, and it likely could happen elsewhere, so word should go out to all Tourist Railroads.
 

What happened to the initial report that "She fell 1200 feet to her death." ?

Back in the day I was a regular conductor on the St. Louis, Iron Mountain & Southern.  It was a pull / push operation as was described above, with the conductor directing the movement on the point and the engineer on the rear.  We always had a caboose on the rear (they still do), which provided a platform from which to direct the shove.

Perhaps there needs to be some sort of industry wide consensus on shoving platforms?

Mary McPherson
Dongola, IL
Diverging Clear Productions

PlyWoody Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> According to the Fremont County Sheriff’s office
> she was standing at the back of the train in a
> door opening as the train was backing up en route
> to the Canyon City station.  She fell off the
> end and the train ran over her and she was
> visibly deceased.

This is a screenshot from a news video showing the actual train. She must have been standing in the end door directing the shove. I think about this often as I perform this exact same task many times every week on the passenger trains where I work. There are many different end-door configurations on our passenger cars but I always place myself in the opening in such a way as to protect myself if there is any unexpected slack. And there often is. I always assume there will be and guard against it. Complacency and implicit trust in your engineer can kill you.

What a horrible, but probably avoidable tragedy. I can't even imagine being run over by any train, let alone my own. Heartbreaking.

Her family has apparently set up a gofundme page with additional information on the conductor, Leslie Cacy. https://www.gofundme.com/26z56qc

---

One of the first things many Railroad operations do is remove those old scissor gates that were designed to help prevent just that from happening. Seen so many tourist Pike's do this and replace with chains or nothing at all.

Condolences to her family, both railroad and biological.

Posted from Android



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/31/16 14:57 by nhiwwrr.

Some trains head into the gorge with the power on the uphill end and the former VIA steam generator car, now used to supply hotel power to the train, on the downhill end. At Parkdale they begin backing to Canon City with a crewman on the VIA car. Later trips in the day additional cars are added, including a locomotive on the downhill end. The VIA power car is now bewteen the added cars and the original consist.

Two hands, one foot......two feet, one hand, always three points of contact.  Easy to forget when you're standing in the vestibule.  Safety gates or chains added for EXTRA protection when you DO forget.  Minor fails on our part can lead to tragedy.  I worked on the flight deck of an aircraft carrier for 3 years and saw the same thing:  a minor slip up, just a moment of hesitation, ever so slight mental lapses can lead to severe injury or death.  All of us are occasionally guilty of those mental lapses.  But at the wrong place or the wrong time, it leads to tragedy.  Not trying to set any blame, but things can happen.  Sorry for all involved, especially crew and company.  

Ed 

As a result of this unfortunate tragedy Oregon Pacific is inspecting all of our excursion equipment bringing some into the shop this week to "beef up" and add to various railings, handholds, kick plates etc. to try to avoid such an ocurrance . Safety of our employees, volunteers and passengers is always foremost in our minds. A consequence of this tragedy mar result in passengers not being allowed on the observation platform of our Santa Rosa business car on moves where the Santa Rosa is leading.

The Colorado tragety just serves to emphasize that a life can be taken in a split second of inattention.

Safety FIRST, LAST and A L W A Y S !

Our prayers are with all of the Royal Gorge family in this time of sorrow.

Dick Samuels
Oregon Pacific Railroad