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Date: 06/06/19 23:53
The Big Hole...
Author: goduckies

I assume upgrade westbound is much worse for the 844 or 3985 when it went through. Did they use gas masks east bound as well?

Posted from Android



Date: 06/07/19 04:40
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Bob3985

If you are thinking of the tunnel I am thinking of, westbound the oxygen masks saved our lives on 3985 with the doubleheader. Eastbound we were drifting and didn't need them.

Bob Krieger
Cheyenne, WY



Date: 06/07/19 06:39
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: CPRR

goduckies Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I assume upgrade westbound is much worse for the
> 844 or 3985 when it went through. Did they use
> gas masks east bound as well?
>
> Posted from Android

Assuming this is tunnel 41 in the Sierras, then Bob answered your question 



Date: 06/07/19 15:30
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Copy19

My guests and I were getting pretty uncomfortable back in the passenger cars.

JB - Omaha



Date: 06/07/19 17:18
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: HotWater

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My guests and I were getting pretty uncomfortable
> back in the passenger cars.
>
> JB - Omaha

I can imagine. But then, you should have heard about all those "extra people" crammed into the cab of the GE diesel unit that the MU'ed with 3985 at Sparks. When the GE tripped the ground relay, and quit loading, which quickly illuminated the red light on the Diesel MU Control Box, beside Engineer Bob Krieker on 3985, there were so many people with their luggage, that they couldn't open the electrical cabinet door in order to reset the ground relay lock-out. By then the exhaust heat and smoke from 3985, now at full throttle as soon as Bob realized what was happening with the diesel, subsequently choked the diesel engine in the GE, and it died. At that point the Ge also lost it's air conditioning for the cab, and all those extra riders had quit a time of it. The diesel engine could not be restarted, and the ground relay reset, until after we had stopped outside the tunnel for the scheduled service stop on both steam locomotives, i.e. dope the rods, etc..



Date: 06/07/19 17:25
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: WAF

Eastbound, its a downhill inside T41



Date: 06/07/19 19:25
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: atsf121

Bob3985 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If you are thinking of the tunnel I am thinking
> of, westbound the oxygen masks saved our lives on
> 3985 with the doubleheader. Eastbound we were
> drifting and didn't need them.

I’m glad everyone came through ok, bet that was a scary ride for all involved.

Nathan

Posted from iPhone



Date: 06/07/19 22:42
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: ProAmtrak

HotWater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Copy19 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > My guests and I were getting pretty
> uncomfortable
> > back in the passenger cars.
> >
> > JB - Omaha
>
> I can imagine. But then, you should have heard
> about all those "extra people" crammed into the
> cab of the GE diesel unit that the MU'ed with 3985
> at Sparks. When the GE tripped the ground relay,
> and quit loading, which quickly illuminated the
> red light on the Diesel MU Control Box, beside
> Engineer Bob Krieker on 3985, there were so many
> people with their luggage, that they couldn't open
> the electrical cabinet door in order to reset the
> ground relay lock-out. By then the exhaust heat
> and smoke from 3985, now at full throttle as soon
> as Bob realized what was happening with the
> diesel, subsequently choked the diesel engine in
> the GE, and it died. At that point the Ge also
> lost it's air conditioning for the cab, and all
> those extra riders had quit a time of it. The
> diesel engine could not be restarted, and the
> ground relay reset, until after we had stopped
> outside the tunnel for the scheduled service stop
> on both steam locomotives, i.e. dope the rods,
> etc..

From what I read in Trains about that trip over the Sierras Jack I know that was one scary moment that seemed to last for an eternity!



Date: 06/08/19 08:46
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: coach

Which is exactly why SP ran westbound trains on the #1 line, which was ventilated, even in the snowsheds.  Eastbound trains just drifted downhill in Tunnel 41, as it was meant to be.



Date: 06/08/19 10:10
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Copy19

After surviving the big hole I became increasingly annoyed by the seemingly constant horn blowing by the GE.  People came out to hear the steam whistle, not the bleeping of a diesel!


JB - Omaha



Date: 06/08/19 10:43
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: HotWater

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> After surviving the big hole I became increasingly
> annoyed by the seemingly constant horn blowing by
> the GE.  People came out to hear the steam
> whistle, not the bleeping of a diesel!
>
>
> JB - Omaha

Damned right! That idiot in the cab of the GE, controlling the dynamic braking all the way down the hill, kept blowing the horn. Also drove us nuts in the cab of 3985! I think somebody finally must have said something to him.



Date: 06/08/19 10:50
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: goduckies

Thanks for the info, just as I thought. Would love to see 4014 go through there as well..

Posted from Android



Date: 06/12/19 15:21
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: BigSkyBlue

goduckies Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thanks for the info, just as I thought. Would
> love to see 4014 go through there as well..
>
> Posted from Android

Anecdotes in this thread don't bode well for 4014 over Donner.  BSB



Date: 06/13/19 14:12
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Copy19

They should have a diesel helper waiting at at Truckee.  Put it ahead of the 4014 for climb up through the Big Hole and take it off at Norden,

JB - Omaha



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/19 15:31 by Copy19.



Date: 06/13/19 15:07
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: HotWater

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have a diesel helper waiting at at Truckee.
>  Put it ahead of the 4024 for climb up through
> the Big Hole and take it off at Norden,
>
> JB - Omaha

So,,,,,,,,,,you do not want any dynamic brake assist for the VERY long westbound downgrade?



Date: 06/13/19 15:19
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Copy19

The train also will have a diesel trailing the 4014 for the whole trip.  It stays where it is in the consist.  The helper set leads and the 4014 throttle is closed through the tunnel.



Date: 06/13/19 15:31
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: HotWater

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The train also will have a diesel trailing the
> 4014 for the whole trip.  It stays where it is in
> the consist.  The helper set leads and the 4014
> throttle is closed through the tunnel.

Well,,,,,,,,,,,THAT sure isn't any fun!   Maybe,,,,,,,just maybe, the current crew should get at least one taste of what it's like to "power through a tunnel". Besides, with the diesel MU'ed to the 4014, and thus controlled by the Engineer on the 4014, there would be no need for "helpers" to be attached to the front.



Date: 06/13/19 15:45
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: agentatascadero

This is, of  course, silly.....but, given the PSR craze capturing North American railroading.....what if......the UP PSR'd it's passenger operations....official trains and excursions.......into one big train.....that IS the idea, isn't it? ...........let's assemble the entire UP passenger fleet  (still around 70+ cars?)........and take a trip.  Mr Camp's camp will be pleased to see 4014 finally doing some real work.   It'll never happen, but it is amusing...to me at least....to ponder.

AA

Stanford White
Carmel Valley, CA



Date: 06/13/19 15:48
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: Copy19

HotWater Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Copy19  
>Besides, with the diesel MU'ed
> to the 4014, and thus controlled by the Engineer
> on the 4014, there would be no need for "helpers"
> to be attached to the front.

Well that takes us back to the original trip.  The diesel crapped out.  I wouldn’t feel comfortable unless there are at least two or three working motors leading. (A set of Espee Black Widow F7 s would be nice.)

JB - Omaha



Date: 06/13/19 17:20
Re: The Big Hole...
Author: HotWater

Copy19 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> HotWater Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Copy19  
> >Besides, with the diesel MU'ed
> > to the 4014, and thus controlled by the
> Engineer
> > on the 4014, there would be no need for
> "helpers"
> > to be attached to the front.
>
> Well that takes us back to the original trip.
>  The diesel crapped out.  I wouldn’t feel
> comfortable unless there are at least two or three
> working motors leading. (A set of Espee Black
> Widow F7 s would be nice.)
>
> JB - Omaha

Well, yes that "diesel crapped out", but we subsequently learned that that particular GE unit had been having "ground relay problems" for quit some time, and more than a few trips. The supposition was, someone deliberately "assigned" that unit as the MU'ed helper out of Sparks, in order to see how the Steam Crew would handle it when it shot craps again. As the late Paul Harvey was famous at saying, "Now you know the rest of the story"! I seriously doubt that such an incident would happen in the future.



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