Eastern Railroad Discussion > Delphos Ohio questions

I thought that Delphos only had NKP/Clover Leaf and the PRR as it's RR's This looks like a NYC signal. I saw the signal for the Delphos Diamond, now removed, and the advance signal for this sig. What happened?

DRF

It has been 3-4 years since I was in Delphos, but that signal was there at that time. Not that it's of any consequence, but what appears to be the distant signal for the Cloverleaf/NKP/CERA interlocking in Marion Indiana (it always shows a yellow every time I've seen it, although it is close enough to govern movement at the switch; not done any more exploring) is of the same style as this (that is, NYC), but that would have been for the Cloverleaf/NKP interlocking with the ex-NYC. The NYC there (see previous thread) has Pennsy-style signals, except (if faded memory serves me) for those where the NYC crossed the Pennsy where the ex-NYC line has NYC-style signals (don't take me to the bank on that).

That all having been said, could it be the NKP, in some demented move, installed the ex-NYC style signals at both Marion and Delphos? Is each RR responsible for their own signals, or does who controls the interlocking have some signal maintenance responsibility for the foreign RR?

...and that is an unusual set of aspects in the picture. No 'clear', but what would the lower indiation add?

SPV's RR Atlas shows a north-south CHD through Delphos at one time, and an AC&Y east out of Delphos; per the map, they all seemed to meet downtown. Those two RR would seem to have been of an era little related to this signal, I suspect.

Chris - cloverleaf

Judging from how new that concrete base is, I'd say Conrail put that in. They dropped those new signals in at many of the interlockings, such as NS Tower in Lima. Estry, Dunkirk, and COLSAN kept their PRR signals.

Now I am curious of what the layout was around the diamonds

DRF.

Well it looks like the only two aspects that signal can give is clear and stop. The Cincinnati, Dayton, and Hamilton Railway was a subsidary of the B&O by the early '20's and the CH&D line that went to Delphos I think was gone by the early '30's so they definitly wouldn't have any position signals. The Akron, Canton, and Youngstown used semaphors and at a lot of interlockings like Chatfield used colored signals with just aspects for clear and stop.
-Happy Fanning!

It appears at one time the track also went south out of town. The ROW is still visible. Old CH&D maybe? The diverging route seen in the first pic heads West South West out of town. Part of the Clover Leaf is my guess. Who owns it now? The crossings are not maked like CSX's except for the PRR.

I am suprised the signal is still standing. Must have been too much work to disconnect from the interlocker. It does look funny having a signal with no track.

DRF

The AC&Y and the Clover Leaf appeared to run together and then split on the north side of town. Parts of both ROW's are visible. The US-30 overpass bridges are reminders of the RR heritage of the town. On a previous trip I followed the AC&Y home and some of the rail was still there.

In the first photo, that is the NKP/Clover Leaf eastward home signal for the former crossing diamonds with the Fort Wayne Line (ex-PRR). The track made a sharp curve to the north (left) and then crossed the PRR. These diamonds were removed in 1998. This track is now known as the Delphos Terminal Railway and runs southwest to Landeck OH. Conrail operated it from 1998-1999 and CSX from 1999-present. Access is via a wye which is further west near the distant signal you photographed. The curved section of track near the former crossing diamonds is not used.


Zeke
<a href="http://www.trainweb.org/fwarailfan/&quot;&gt;Fort Wayne Railfan Page</a>

I saw the track on the other side of the mill. Looks like a giant crossover. Where there any wyes at the Diamond? What was the line heading south from the Diamond. Looks like it's been gone much longer that the track to the North.

DRF

Ahh, so that is the line north to Ft. Jennings. I chased an IHRC local from Ohio City to Delphos in 1993. Neat line that I'm sorry to see is gone.

The CH&D that went through Delphos was the old narrow gauge CH&D, prior to the reorginization into the "new" CH&D that B&O later acquired. The line was at one time part of the "Little Giant" narrow gauge system.

The right-of-way heading south out of town was the Cincinnati Hamilton & Dayton Railway (CHD). That's been gone a LONG time. I'm not sure if there were ever other wyes at the diamond. There is a photo of the Pennsy tower on George Elwood's Fallen Flags site that I think he took himself. Maybe you've seen it:
<a href="http://gelwood.railfan.net/other/prr/prr-tower2.jpg&quot;&gt;PRR Delphos Tower photo</a>

There was an excellent article about the Clover Leaf in the Fall 2000 issue of Classic Trains Mag that described the Delphos area pretty well. It has a photo of the curve and depot in that same spot and a general description of the area (~1950s). According to the article, that curve is/was 18 degrees 50 minutes - very sharp.

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Zeke
<a href="http://www.trainweb.org/fwarailfan/&quot;&gt;Fort Wayne Railfan Page</a>

Those signals are replacement signals, signals were formerly NKP-type signals protecting the Cloverleaf sides of the diamond. You'll find NYC-type signals at Mike Tower in Fort Wayne on the NS side, as well as the (now) CSX side, also.
Well into the seventies, the track that continued on south out of Delphos was in place to service one or two industries and I'm almost certain that the AC&Y ran down there to do that, rather than the NKP, can remember seeing them crossing old U. S. 30 in town. I'm sort of guessing here, don't really know the particulars, but don't know why they would have been south of Delphos Yard, otherwise.
As for the CH&D, I think that railroad was abandoned before the thirties, what route did it take when it went north out of Delphos? I've no old map to refer to, but know that it went up to Ottoville and then to Mandale to connect with the line that had been the Findlay, Ft. Wayne, and Western, later CH&D, which was abandoned right around the end of WWI.

The signal on the NKP on the curve either was red or green. The distant signal for a eastbound was either yellow or green and we would stop back of Bradieck street if we had a long train. The CH&D crossed the PRR just east of the NKP track, in fact the track for the freight house was the old CH&D main line. The ACY paralled the NKP from the NKP yard to a coal yard and a PRR wye. When we crossed Main street we would be going east or west, in half a block we wouls be turned due north and paraell to main street. The NKP had a 8 mph restriction on the curve.

Slightly off the thread again, but just for comparison - I went down to Marion Indiana today; the signal shown here is for CP79 South, where the north-south NYC crossed the E-W Pennsy. There are two signalled north-south tracks here; for southbound moves, one is a Pennsy-style; the other is this one, an NYC style. It does share the same aspects as the Delphos signal in the first post.

Looking at the tracks, it does appear that the track this signal governs is part of the Cloverleaf/NKP, running parallel with the NYC/CR/NS main. Northbound, BOTH the NKP and the NYC tracks have NYC style signals. The distant signal for the northbound (eastbound) NKP is also an NYC style.

I will post some other Marion pics in another thread.

Chris - cloverleaf

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So, how many tracks went down through town from the PRR north to Delphos Yard, was there once more than one main down through there. Also, where did the CH&D cross the Cloverleaf? I've always wondered what the layout once was there.

The CH&D split off of their main line in Dayton (now the CSX Toledo Subdivision) and meandered northwest through Ludlow Falls, Versailles, Celina, Spencerville, Delphos and Ottoville until it ended at East Mandale, Ohio, where it did connect to the Findlay, Ft. Wayne and Western (by 1914 also a CH&D line). East Mandale is located about 2.5 miles west of Cloverdale, Ohio or about 15 miles west of Ottawa, Ohio.

According to the 1914 CH&D Form 6 (official list of stations, industries and sidings), the CH&D interchanged with the Northern Ohio (later AC&Y) and the Toledo, St. Louis and Western (Clover Leaf) at Delphos. No mention of the Pittsburgh, Ft. Wayne and Chicago (Pennsy) crossing is made.

Many of these old lines were originally narrow gauge. Including the CH&D predecssor road through Delphos, the Dayton, Covington and Toledo.

73's
Eric