Passenger Trains > ITCS restored in Michigan

After an outage of several months, ITCS (Incremental Train Control System) was restored to service on the Amtrak
Michigan Line between MP 143.3 and MP 240.5 effective at 0001 hrs., October 24, 2011.

Maximum speed remains at 79mph but all other ITCS rules will apply.

There were some problems; the system didn't work for the first few trains operating on October 24. Also, Amtrak
had to reactivate NPCU Cab Cars (former F40PH) account shortage of ITCS-equipped P42s; over the extended
suspension of ITCS, they have been scattered across the system. Once they are rounded up and returned to
Michigan, estimated by the beginning of November, the NPCUs will be reassigned and all trains are to be equipped
with ITCS P42s. At that time, speeds will be increased to 110mph.

Were they running all trains in push mode or did the ex-F40PH's sometimes run ahead of the power?

Unless there is a specific bulletin stating the cabbages are to be sent elsewhere, I do not believe that it will be an all-P42 deal. Several NPCUs, specifically 90200, 90215, 90218-90219, 90222, and 90225 are equipped with ITCS and thus can and do operate at high speed - most recently 90MPH in the ITCS zone where allowed. I took a trip to Chicago on train 371 Saturday and I did notice that many of the ITCS equipped cabbages and P42s were stationed at Lumber Street...it makes sense now why there were so many of them together. For the record, the ITCS P42s are in two blocks: 26-37 and 126-128.
Is this for sure going to be 110MPH operation now? I was told sometime ago that the speed can only be increased in 5MPH increments, meaning more testing would have to be done before upping the speed to 110. Under the explanation I was given, the speed now could/should be 100MPH.
Either way, it's nice to see the system back on and expanded. The work it was down for entailed extending coverage from MP 222 to MP 240.

About 110 mph operation - I know someone who... knows someone at Amtrak, and their professional comment is that the P42's can't even really get the trains up to 110 anyway. Any word on that?

They don't seem to have any problem getting upto or close to 110mph on the NEC when they are occasionally used there.

inRVA Wrote:
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> About 110 mph operation - I know someone who...
> knows someone at Amtrak, and their professional
> comment is that the P42's can't even really get
> the trains up to 110 anyway. Any word on that?

For what it's worth, I have ridden several ALB-NY Empire trains powered by P32DM's, which have less power than a P42, including some cab rides. Almost all have exceeded 100 MPH over the high speed stretch between CP 141 and CP 125, and most have just about reached 110. I'm talking one electric porpoise pulling 4-6 Amfleet. A good porpoise would have a train originating in Albany-Rensselaer (MP 142.1)up to 100 by Schodack (MP 136). This should provide an idea of what a P42 should be able to do in MI.

Andy

I was in Kalamazoo yesterday (MP 143ish), doing some fanning w/fellow TO member/Amtrak engineer MJ and heard crew of WB 351 (I think) on the radio repeating ITCS (info/bulletin) as they departed westbound out of the station stop in Kzoo. And, at Porter, signs are posted at the junction "begin ITCS"/"end ITCS" corresponding to direction.

wondered what that was all about, now I know. Thanks, Gene

chico
http://www.heartlandrails.com

I was wrong in stating that the NPCUs wouldn't go anywhere. Amtrak rules limit the units to operating at 100mph and the speed is indeed being increased to 110mph after the problems with the system are worked out. In a way, it's sad to see the units reassigned, as some variety will be lost, but at the same time I'm glad as a passenger because the horns on the units are terrible.
And yes, the P42s are capable of and do run at a top speed of 110MPH in the aforementioned Northeastern corridors. In this regard, the MIC will be a piece of cake.
Also, for the record, the ITCS now covers the ENTIRE length of the Amtrak-owned Michigan Corridor between BO Tower and CP-482 in Porter. With the purchase of the NS Michigan Line by the state of Michigan and federal grant money, I'm sure we can expect it to be expanded all the way to CP-Ypsi near Ypsilanti by the end of 2012, thereby facilitating 110MPH operation across the state. In any regard, this upgrade is huge in that it represents the first solid, 100+ MPH corridor outside of the Northeast.
Congratulations to Amtrak, GE, Michigan and all other parties who have made this system work over the past 13 years.

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Interesting contrast...100MPH+ to CP482, then on approaches, restrictings and stop signals all the way to Engelwood! Anyway, its a start. Wonder how long the ITCS will be up before going down again? Hasn't it been installed since the mid-90s?

cashblock Wrote:
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> Also, for the record, the ITCS now covers the
> ENTIRE length of the Amtrak-owned Michigan
> Corridor between BO Tower and CP-482 in Porter.
> With the purchase of the NS Michigan Line by the
> state of Michigan and federal grant money, I'm
> sure we can expect it to be expanded all the way
> to CP-Ypsi near Ypsilanti by the end of 2012,
> thereby facilitating 110MPH operation across the
> state.

State ownership (coupled with Amtrak operation/dispatching) of the Michigan Line should definitely improve overall performnace, but don't expect 110 MPH operation all the way across Michigan.

Kalamazoo-Battle Creek should be able to host faster sppeds fairly easily, but east of BTL there is just too much curvature to sustain extended high-speed operation. You might get some fast running in around Jackson (except you have the station stop) and Chelsea, but the old MC meanders left and right between BTL and west of Albion and again along the river from east of Chelsea through Ann Arbor to Ypsi.

Not saying it's not possible, but I don't think the existing pot of money is enough to do any serious addressing of the curves, such as realignment or adding some SERIOUS superelevation.

It will be interesting to see if the ITCS remains in place long-term on the Michigan Line or if it will have to be replaced by whatever becomes the "standard" PTC system in 2015 or so. Unless it has a long-term future, I would hope the $$ isn't wasted on installing a "lame-duck" system over additional territory.

BTW, it was the P32-8s (500s) that could not reach 100 MPH when they were used for testing the ITCS back in the early 2000s. Sometimes you had to drop the HEP to the train to gain enough HP to accelerate back up to track speed. AFAIK, no such problems with the P42s.

NZ
Worked the Michigan Line and taught ITCS rules long, long ago in a galaxy far, far away....

NebraskaZephyr Wrote:
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> Not saying it's not possible, but I don't think
> the existing pot of money is enough to do any
> serious addressing of the curves, such as
> realignment or adding some SERIOUS superelevation.

if the degree of curvature doesn't need to be changed and the curves just lack superelevation ... adding superelevation doesn't really take much ... just some ballast and little bit of time ... however if the curves have any vehicular grade crossings adding superelevation could be costly

cashfare Wrote:
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> Interesting contrast...100MPH+ to CP482, then on
> approaches, restrictings and stop signals all the
> way to Engelwood! Anyway, its a start. Wonder
> how long the ITCS will be up before going down
> again? Hasn't it been installed since the
> mid-90s?

Kind of like the NEC when you hit Elmora interlockingin Elizabeth heading towards NYC.

Any confirmation yet? Mileposts clocked at 36 seconds (100) or 32.7 seconds (110)? Any slipstream movement of trackside buildings?

Would Talgo equipment be able to address the curve issue east of Battle Creek?

Carl Shaver
Lombard, IL