Passenger Trains > Off Topic: Greyhound up for sale

https://www.businessinsider.com/greyhound-owner-firstgroup-says-looking-to-sell-2019-5?fbclid=IwAR3hUvdQQY9Tdpd_F5aZmZivJwMA4Df6F5W-EcnyzfVB3t-r7tj3kp804N8

I found this interesting : "Greyhound survived and is now the only operator of scheduled intercity coaches in North America..." and untrue. It leaves out Amtrak's Thruway buses. They are "scheduled intercity coaches". Also interesting is that low-cost airlines, not Amtrak, were listed as the main competition for Greyhound. I think that much is true.

Greyhound missed out a few years back when Amtrak offered to work with them and develop a national bus-rail system based on cooperation between the two. Shared terminals, synchronized schedules, etc. would have been a win-win for each side. But, no, too much "stove pipe" - silo mentality at Greyhound management. There have been some isolated experiments but nothing on a system wide basis. They could still pull it out if they sought to re-organize along those lines.

John Webb
Trinidad, CA

"Greyhound has been in dire financial straits for some time, including before its sale to FirstGroup in 2007."

Also mention of British railway franchises not in good shape.

The BBC article mentions that there was a change in management at First Group, bought about by an "activist investor" (sounds familiar).
They plan to concentrate on their most profitable sector, which is the North American school bus operation , First Student.

I'm not sure why First Group purchased Greyhound in 2007. Perhaps they thought they had way to improve the bottom line and service, but the once proud bus company continued to decline in service standards and frequency.

First Group acquired Greyhound when they purchased its parent company, Laidlaw, in 2007. In addition to Greyhound, the former operated school and transit buses.

eminence_grise Wrote:
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> The BBC article mentions that there was a change
> in management at First Group, bought about by an
> "activist investor" (sounds familiar).
> They plan to concentrate on their most profitable
> sector, which is the North American school bus
> operation , First Student.
>
> I'm not sure why First Group purchased Greyhound
> in 2007. Perhaps they thought they had way to
> improve the bottom line and service, but the once
> proud bus company continued to decline in service
> standards and frequency.

Greyhound Canada deteriorated far more slowly than Greyhound Lines since the 1980's, but starting 10 years ago, starting dying far faster. While they don't go west of Sudbury, at least you can get west of the Appalachians in the US.  But a shame they sucked Continental Trailways, TNM&O, and Vermont Transit down with the ship.  

If their operations were not so sloppy and late, they would do better. After about 8 trips in 10 years, not one was less than an hour late, moistly due to driver dithering. 

First Transit also runs tons of bus transit and college circulator systems as low bid contractor.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/30/19 11:09 by joemvcnj.

Greyhound and Amtrak could have some great possibilities if they aligned schedules and services like has been done on the Zephyr between SLC and RNO. Unfortunately now with Anti Amtrak Anderson in charge (at least by title) a Amtrak/Greyhound synergy could be disasterous for Amtrak and it’s riders.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/30/19 11:11 by Flyer92122.

Anderson ought to understand hub and spoke, but seems to either have another agenda, or simply checked his brain at the door nearly 2 years ago, and as with most incompetents in high places, has anger management issues when challenged. 

Not true. Jefferson Lines, Peter Pan, Adirondack Trailways to name a few.  
> I found this interesting : "Greyhound survived and
> is now the only operator of scheduled intercity
> coaches in North America..." and untrue. It leaves
> out Amtrak's Thruway buses. They are "scheduled
> intercity coaches". Also interesting is that
> low-cost airlines, not Amtrak, were listed as the
> main competition for Greyhound. I think that much
> is true.
>
> Greyhound missed out a few years back when Amtrak
> offered to work with them and develop a national
> bus-rail system based on cooperation between the
> two. Shared terminals, synchronized schedules,
> etc. would have been a win-win for each side. But,
> no, too much "stove pipe" - silo mentality at
> Greyhound management. There have been some
> isolated experiments but nothing on a system wide
> basis. They could still pull it out if they sought
> to re-organize along those lines.

joemvcnj Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Anderson ought to understand hub and spoke, but
> seems to either have another agenda, or simply
> checked his brain at the door nearly 2 years ago,
> and as with most incompetents in high places, has
> anger management issues when challenged. 

Northwest Air, under his administration, made a practice of threatening to shut down marginal stations.  Towns and counties would front some extra money to keep DC-9 and commuter aircraft serving Podunk, etc.  Eventually, Delta, United, and Northwest went into an almost simultaneous closing of many stations.  The result was just one, sometimes two, carriers serving each outpost on the hub and spoke.

Worked then, and Congress seems OK with paying to restore an agent here, keep a route there, etc.

Winnemucca Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I found this interesting : "Greyhound survived and
> is now the only operator of scheduled intercity
> coaches in North America..." and untrue. It leaves
> out Amtrak's Thruway buses. They are "scheduled
> intercity coaches".

No, Amtrak Thruway buses are NOT scheduled intercity coaches as they are not open to the general public. You must purchase as part of an Amtrak Train ticket.

CP8888 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not true. Jefferson Lines, Peter Pan, Adirondack
> Trailways to name a few.  

Correct, but if the article had said the only NATIONAL operator that would be true.

Back when Amtrak was new, circa 1971 or 72, there were reports that Greyhound had approached Roger Lewis (then AMT’s CEO) with a proposal for coordination similar to the one noted above. I don’t know this to be 100% factual, but it comes from people who were in a position to know. 

Anyway, the tables are now turned, and an increase in coordination is still a good idea. 

Someone is going to need to explain Thruway buses 8255 / 8257 / 8850 / 8852 and 8856.
These are Thruway buses operated between Indianapolis and Chicago, extending to Cincinatti or Nashville.
Amtrak.com will let people buy a ticket between Indianapolis and Chicago without buying a connecting ticket.
Is this a glitch?

And the service is operated for Amtrak by Greyhound.
(As are several other Thruway bus routes.)

Winnemucca Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Greyhound missed out a few years back when Amtrak
> offered to work with them and develop a national
> bus-rail system based on cooperation between the
> two. Shared terminals, synchronized schedules,
> etc. would have been a win-win for each side. But,
> no, too much "stove pipe" - silo mentality at
> Greyhound management. There have been some
> isolated experiments but nothing on a system wide
> basis. They could still pull it out if they sought
> to re-organize along those lines.
>
They could have been the FedEx, UPS, or (to strech it a bit) the Amazon of today. They squadered their vast network of package express services in the late 1980's in favor of the heavily-leveraged buyout of Continental Trailways. Then came the rise of the Internet in the 1990's, and the rest is history.
 

Greyhound Canada was hauling trailers all over Alberta, maybe other western provinces. What did they do to wreck that business ? 

Some chassis of the old PD-4501 Scenicruisers were used to build some Greyhound Canada MCI MC-7's, as they were regarded as sturdier, and both rear axles were duals, better for hauling trailers. . 
 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/30/19 17:48 by joemvcnj.

CP8888 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not true. Jefferson Lines, Peter Pan, Adirondack
> Trailways to name a few.  

Also Megabus.

> > I found this interesting : "Greyhound survived
> and
> > is now the only operator of scheduled intercity
> > coaches in North America...

Don't forget Megabus and the other cut-rate companies.  They have to have had some effect.

John

Megabus poaches the heavily used routes that are more populated.

 



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/31/19 05:18 by joemvcnj.

Winnemucca Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I found this interesting : "Greyhound survived and
> is now the only operator of scheduled intercity
> coaches in North America..." and untrue.

North America......so guess that would include the Maritime Provinces. When Acadian Lines pulled the plug here 7 years ago, the owner of a successful charter bus business said he would give scheduled service a try but told the Provincial Public Utility Boards they were going to have to work with him and relax regulations if they wanted any bus service left. If he maintains a minimum service…..he is now free to adjust schedules and size of equipment according to demand by time of day or season. One day the bus might be in service for ‘Maritime Bus’ and the next a ‘Coach Atlantic’ charter.

BTW.....Maritime Bus feeds VIA at Moncton (from Saint John and Prince Edward Island) and Truro (from Sydney) and shares the VIA Station in Halifax:

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Is this good news for Amtrak though?  Pretty easy to add a coach or two if the market is there for the taking between certain city pairs.